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LAPPING, kinda worried......!!! - Page 2

post #11 of 33
I don't lap at all...I like my warranty. If I had bought an OEM processor instead of the retail box, then I wouldn't have a problem doing it but you spent the extra money for the retail for that warranty. You could also just wait and see if you can find another one cheaper that's OEM and then lap it.
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post #12 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xx573v3xX_Z28 View Post
GRRR now i'm not completely sure. I really want to, but that warranty and price of the cpu is holding on me, If i have some more feedback i'll do it.
Hmmm

My take:

1. Your CPU is experiencing something call "Hot-Electron Degradation" because of your core-voltage, regardless of whatever temps you might have. That voltage of >1.5 will ABSOLUTELY lower the life and performance of the Silicon Oxide gates over time. Your temperatures will not have a huge effect in that regard.

If you're game, then read this paper that will explain it extremely well to you

http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/444/ludeke.html

2. However, if you're looking for an extremely long life out of that CPU, you honestly shouldn't be overclocking. Without giving you a lecture, these chips are made to last >10 years in certain applications if left at stock and cooled relatively well. Lapping will give it a bit more life due to the greater thermal transfer, but unless you know how to properly apply thermal paste in this situation (Microscopic amount), you won't notice a difference whatsoever.

3. My initial reaction to this was "man up and get some cahones." Honestly, I have done it, and it's a difference of 2c at most for the CPU, the heatsink was about 5c. If you do decide to do this, you should NEVER lap with sandpaper finer than 1200 grit. I personally only ever go up to 1000. It's amazing how stupidly people will apply thermal paste at grits of 2000 or 2500. If you sand that finely, you're so close to being flat (that is, assuming your technique was correct) that the advantage of using thermal paste is almost negated.


I'll PM you this just so you get it, but in your case, I WOULD NOT recommend doing that in your case unless you can easily go into a store tomorrow to buy a replacement.

You vcore is already a bit too high for my tastes (and Intel engineers as well) So I would probably lower the OC to 3.6. However, that's simply personal preference. I went down from 3.6 to 3.4 simply because I can go from 1.46 to 1.40 in my vcore. That's an incredible difference for only 200 mhz.
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post #13 of 33
CPUs very rarely fail under the conditions they are warrantied for.

My vote is to go a head and lap it, as it's extremely difficult to kill an LGA CPU during lapping.
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post #14 of 33
If you can't afford another then just wait, or ask everyone who is telling you to go balls first to show theirs first.
post #15 of 33
This isn't russian roulette; this is sanding a piece of copper.
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post #16 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post
This isn't russian roulette; this is sanding a piece of copper.
Where as if something goes wrong he has a $165 paper weight plus costs of lapping stuff. If you can't afford to break it don't play with it.
post #17 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCJP View Post
Hmmm

My take:

1. Your CPU is experiencing something call "Hot-Electron Degradation" because of your core-voltage, regardless of whatever temps you might have. That voltage of >1.5 will ABSOLUTELY lower the life and performance of the Silicon Oxide gates over time. Your temperatures will not have a huge effect in that regard.

If you're game, then read this paper that will explain it extremely well to you

http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/444/ludeke.html

2. However, if you're looking for an extremely long life out of that CPU, you honestly shouldn't be overclocking. Without giving you a lecture, these chips are made to last >10 years in certain applications if left at stock and cooled relatively well. Lapping will give it a bit more life due to the greater thermal transfer, but unless you know how to properly apply thermal paste in this situation (Microscopic amount), you won't notice a difference whatsoever.

3. My initial reaction to this was "man up and get some cahones." Honestly, I have done it, and it's a difference of 2c at most for the CPU, the heatsink was about 5c. If you do decide to do this, you should NEVER lap with sandpaper finer than 1200 grit. I personally only ever go up to 1000. It's amazing how stupidly people will apply thermal paste at grits of 2000 or 2500. If you sand that finely, you're so close to being flat (that is, assuming your technique was correct) that the advantage of using thermal paste is almost negated.


I'll PM you this just so you get it, but in your case, I WOULD NOT recommend doing that in your case unless you can easily go into a store tomorrow to buy a replacement.

You vcore is already a bit too high for my tastes (and Intel engineers as well) So I would probably lower the OC to 3.6. However, that's simply personal preference. I went down from 3.6 to 3.4 simply because I can go from 1.46 to 1.40 in my vcore. That's an incredible difference for only 200 mhz.
I have to disagree with the highlighted portions of your statement. I have gotten anywhere from 3c to 15c difference from lapping. It depends on how bad the cpu was before the lapping. Intel has gotten better with the 45nm cpus by a long shot. However there earlier ones were horrible at best.

As far as appying the thermal paste just use a smaller amount then you normally would and youll be fine. In some very rare cases where someone spends the large amounts of time to get a "near perfect" lap they can actually get away without using thermal paste at all but I wouldnt recommend this. In normal instances a good lap with a small amount of thermal paste applied will end up with a nice thin layer of paste after applying the heatsinc that is very uniform as compared to before the lap where there will be vallys and such that are filled with thinck sections of thermal paste.
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post #18 of 33
When lapping, there are only two ways to damage it that I'm aware of. Those are either damaging the contacts/pins, or doing an unlevel lap. As for The second option, the only thing you must remember when lapping, is that the final surface has to be flat, and level, a peice of clear glass and a small drop of water, or a razor blade are the best ways to be sure it is level. As for proof of perfectly fine lap jobs, search around on here, they aren't hard to find loads of, there's no point in filling this users thread with our pics.

The OP says they have already lapped before if I'm not mistaken, which means they already know that they have to be sure the finished job is completely flat. I have personally lapped two processors, and two heatsinks. The only thing I did wrong was the surface wasn't completely level on my first cpu, which just meant I had to start back with a bigger grit (smaller number) and then work my way back up. It was a very safe and easy fix. To this day neither machine has had any problems and they are both OC'd and working fine, on air cooling.

If you are still in doubt, best bet is DON'T do it. I know very, very, little about intel chips, but your temps don't appear to be all THAT bad. If you are worried about those, try to use less volts, you may or may not be able to get the same OC. Either way, best of luck and keep us posted on your final desicion.
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post #19 of 33
Umm can't you also go too far on your lapping job?
post #20 of 33
make sure you wet sand it
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