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[INQ] Intel Holding Out USB 3.0

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...ays-games-usb3

Quote:
THERE IS ANOTHER power game brewing over USB3.0 and it looks like the user is going to pay the price once again.

If you remember the OHCI/UHCI mess that made USB1.0 worthless, Intel is about to provoke the same thing for USB3.0.

It is power games, user be damned.

The problem this time is that USB3.0 is basically an Intel spec, think PCIe2.0 over external cable and you are 98 per cent of the way there. Intel is the driving force here, and it did the bulk of the work, so fair enough.

If you are making the usual widgets for it, memory sticks, rocket launchers and sex toys, you can get the specs now. If you are competing with Intel, that is, you are making a chipset or anything with a CPU in it, you have to wait six months. Don't take this to just mean x86 either, ARM, MIPS or PPC and device vendors get equally shafted.

This behaviour is not what defines 'standard', it is what defines 'proprietary'. Basically if you are competing with Intel, or are perceived to be competing with it, you have to wait and suck down a six-month disadvantage. The last time this happened was USB1.0. Intel played the same games and the standard was so broken it never worked.

What happened then is that the world went around Intel and developed their own spec, and you ended up with UHCI or OHCI, neither of which were compatible. Things sucked, nothing worked, and the 'standard' stagnated from 1995 to 1998. USB1.1 fixed that problem by basically throwing it out and starting over, and USB2.0 was done as a real standard from the beginning. Shockingly it worked, confusing Hi-Speed/Fast/Chocolate-covered/Swift-ish labeling aside.

Now back to USB3.0 and Intel is pulling the same dumb tricks again. We are on the verge of people defining another USB3.0 spec so you have will have USB3.0-I and USB3.0-E for Intel and Everyone. Conveniently, they will all be simply labeled USB3.0 and half the devices just won't work on your machine.

Come off it Intel! You don't need to play these games. And they only make you look bad once they come out (See above).

We might expect such behaviour from the likes of Nvidia or MS, but not you guys. µ
Monopolies are bad.
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post #2 of 22
looks at specs in signature....

apparently you bought into it..

and this is what people get for saying buy intel.. buy intel... amd sucks... MONOPOLY and amd is not even half the market share they need to survive.. so unless ATI cards hold there head above water... or the government helps amd... intel WILL be the only "standard"
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post #3 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace_001 View Post
looks at specs in signature....

apparently you bought into it..

and this is what people get for saying buy intel.. buy intel... amd sucks... MONOPOLY and amd is not even half the market share they need to survive.. so unless ATI cards hold there head above water... or the government helps amd... intel WILL be the only "standard"
Knee jerk much?

Intel's being short-sighted on this. By making it effectively a proprietary format, it severely limits the market for any devices made for the standard which is a disincentive for hardware manufacturers (memory stick makers, etc.) to make devices for it. You're looking at the market too narrowly: consider how many other devices make use of USB or USB-compatible connectors (UMPCs, smart phones, PDAs, sub-notebooks, etc.) and you'll realize that not all of them run Intel chips, nor are Intel chips even available for all of them (though they will be when Intel ramps up Atom production).

On the other hand, it may just be another way to make Atom look even more appealing, especially if the standard takes off, despite the fact that at present Atom doesn't provide many benefits over, say, ARM or Via mobile chips. An interesting choice by Intel, and since there are so many moving parts in the market right now I'd be hesitant to say whether this is a good or a bad move for them. Time will tell, I guess.
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post #4 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by foolsgold View Post
On the other hand, it may just be another way to make Atom look even more appealing, especially if the standard takes off, despite the fact that at present Atom doesn't provide many benefits over, say, ARM or Via mobile chips.
Atom's advantage over ARM is x86-compatability and MUCH more powerful.

Atom's advantage over VIA is much less power consumption for near the same performance.
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post #5 of 22
Can't they sue them with antitrust or something? o.o
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post #6 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coma View Post
Can't they sue them with antitrust or something? o.o
Dunno, it is their spec.


If anything, I would have thought the other way around would benefit the world better. Give the chipmakers six months to work on USB3.0 and work out the kinks. Then allow device makers to build stuff that utilize the now test and prototyped controllers. However, that would make too much sense.
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post #7 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post
Atom's advantage over ARM is x86-compatability
You mean that is it's disadvantage!

ARM is way better when it comes to power efficiency.
Do you want to plug your Mobile Phone to energy source, daily?
Also the x86 is a very complex instruction set making the chips more complex and inefficient.


The only one that could profit of a x86 "world" would be lazy Software developers.
But normally you have to create your Software a different way for mobile devices (less memory, display resolution, different input ways).
With mobile .NET Microsoft did a great work to help you converting your PC Software to Windows Mobile or start from scratch.
Coding for Windows Mobile ARM devices is just as easy as for x86 PCs.
Even Palm development has become easier...

[EDIT]
My statement was ment for Mobile Devices, PDA, Smartphones.
For Low Cost Notebooks ("Netbooks") with Windows XP or Linux; Atom is great of cause.
[/EDIT]
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post #8 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MESeidel View Post
You mean that is it's disadvantage!

ARM is way better when it comes to power efficiency.
Do you want to plug your Mobile Phone to energy source, daily?
Also the x86 is a very complex instruction set making the chips more complex and inefficient.


The only one that could profit of a x86 "world" would be lazy Software developers.
But normally you have to create your Software a different way for mobile devices (less memory, display resolution, different input ways).
With mobile .NET Microsoft did a great work to help you converting your PC Software to Windows Mobile or start from scratch.
Coding for Windows Mobile ARM devices is just as easy as for x86 PCs.
Even Palm development has become easier...

[EDIT]
My statement was ment for Mobile Devices, PDA, Smartphones.
For Low Cost Notebooks ("Netbooks") with Windows XP or Linux; Atom is great of cause.
[/EDIT]

True, but like you said Atom is well-suited for UMPC and Netbooks... exactly where x86 and decent performance is currently needed!
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post #9 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coma View Post
Can't they sue them with antitrust or something? o.o
They're welcome to make their own standard. They all skipped CSI/QPI and went for 'HyperTransport' instead, so I don't see the big deal. 'Oh hi Mr. Largest Chip Manufacturer in the World, can we use your standard in our products? Oh, you make the same kind of products and you want to go first.. Uh, well, that's not fair, we'll have our lawyers on you in a minute.'

No, it doesn't work that way.
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post #10 of 22
Long live USB 2.0...
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