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OC advice for a niewbie?

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 
Hi!

I'm new to the forum (and to overclocking ) and I need some advice. I tried searching the forum and googling but I'd feel a lot better if I get answers for the specific system I'm planing to build.

So the system will be the following:

CPU: Intel E8400
CPU Cooler: SCYTHE KAMA CROSS
M/B: ASUS P5E
RAM: CORSAIR XMS2 DHX DDR2 (2X2GB) PC2-6400
GPU: ASUS 8800GTS 512 MB HTDP
Case: THERMALTAKE VD1000SWA AGUILA ALLUMINIUM WINDOW SILVER
PSU: THERMALTAKE W0103 TOUGHPOWER 600W
UPS: TRUST PW-4130M 1300VA

I think that HDDs and DVD-RW drives are not affecting the system overclock except the overall power that system requires and I think that with 2 DVD-RW, 2 SATA HDDs and a Floppy drive the PSU I choose will suffice.
Please correct me here if I'm wrong.

So the simple thing I want to do is to increase the CPU bus from 333MHz to 400MHz. If I understood correctly what I've read the CPU will increase to 3.6GHz and FSB will increase to 1600MHz.

So my questions are:

1) Will the CPU FSB match the Dual Channel RAM to 1600MHz so that I have 1:1 CPU:RAM performance? (I'm still a little confused about the CPU-RAM synchronization)
2) Will the combination of Case/PSU/Cooler suffice to have a low CPU/System temperature?
3) From what I've read for such simple OC I don't need to increase the CPU voltage, but will it be better if I do? If yes to what value?
4) The RAM sticks indicate that they ran at 4-4-4-12 at 2.1V. Is 2.1V the default DDR2 voltage or I have to manually enter all the RAM values from bios?
5) Will the M/B be able to accept the configuration I want to apply?
6) The specific CPU series (45nm) are reacting impressively well to overclocks. Even so, won't the OC stress out the CPU and decrease its life?
7) Finally, will my system be stable? What are the indications that an OCed CPU is unstable?

Sorry for the noob questions ...
Thanks in advance!
post #2 of 12
Nice system you own..
you have many guides on this site...most for OCing...
need to learn what is(and how it is related):
FSB
Divider
timing
airflow
multiplier
frequency clock
BIOS
CMOS
SD RAM
DDRAM..and many more...I`ve been googleing and Wiki for long time, searched many sites for info and advices before I get into this...Although I think overclocking.net is the best...so don`t be lazy..

Here is some nice material usefull for your Intel machine

Intel OC
Essential Threads
Ram Timings Explained
Good Memory info
Air Cooling
PSU Guide

Besides Overclock.net, good websites are TomsHardware and AnandTech with plenty of info about all aspects of IT technology, reviews of CPUs, mobos, VGAs and everythyng else, charts, comparisons, and also Forums-which have some great educational value too...

About your questions:
System is tested in test programs that stress it and if it is unstable it will show it with errors, lock ups and similar.
OC always decreases life of an integrated circuit unit, but how much is dependant on operating temperature, voltage, and in minor way frequency boost...
45nm cpu are less hot, so they can go at higher clocks.
Some rams automaticaly set values in BIOS, while for others you have to do it manually..Default voltage for DDR2 by JEDEC is 1,8, but to be able for higher clocks, and tightened timings they need more volatage to run stable..
There are many coolers on market, as well as cases...I like CM 690 case and Vendetta2 cooler, it is rather personal, and what do you want to do with your machine...Your combination is nice.
PSU is also dependent, power demand of your components, and if you have future upgrades in mind...

1) and 3) questions have long answers, and you need to back up your knowdlege a bit...
OC have negative effects too, although they are somewhat brought to minimum these days...
It is a matter of luck, long devotion with trial and fail, and a lot more...
hope I helped a bit...
Edited by wolfy87 - 6/11/08 at 3:27pm
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
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post #3 of 12
Yep, RTFM
    
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Q9450 MSI X38 Hydrogen HD 3870X2 Corsair TWIN3X2048-1333C9DHX 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
3 x WD 500GB NEC Windows Vista Ultimate 32bit Nec Multisync 20WGX² Pro 
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post #4 of 12
welcome to the intricate world of oc.
Standard
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i4670k Asus Z87-PRO Gigabyte Windforce HD7950 Corsair Vengeance Pro 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
128GB SSD 1 TB Samsung 7200rpm LG 22X DVD Burner Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit AOC LED and HP LCD Leopold 200FCR Black OCZ ModXStream Pro OCZ600MXSP 
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Rosewill Blackbone Kinzu Steelseries QCK Xonar DX with Superlux HD 681 EVO 
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Standard
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i4670k Asus Z87-PRO Gigabyte Windforce HD7950 Corsair Vengeance Pro 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
128GB SSD 1 TB Samsung 7200rpm LG 22X DVD Burner Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit AOC LED and HP LCD Leopold 200FCR Black OCZ ModXStream Pro OCZ600MXSP 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Rosewill Blackbone Kinzu Steelseries QCK Xonar DX with Superlux HD 681 EVO 
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post #5 of 12
Thread Starter 
Thanks for you quick replies!

So I've read pretty much everything...
...and I have some questions

I think I got the divider-multiplier concept. So if I want to match the CPU with the RAM I could:
1) Overclock my bus to 400MHz to match the 400MHz that RAM runs as I stated before or
2) Change the CPU multiplier to 7.5 and increase FSB to 400MHz

right? ( ... I hope so )

What I couldn't understand is how a faster RAM bus could help improve performance.
If that's true then I shouldn't change the CPU settings if I don't want to overclock and run my system at a 3:4 CPU:RAM ratio.

Also as I read in several reviews for E8400 the OC I want to apply runs smoothly without any voltage increase and with a good cooler you get the temperatures you have when running at stock speeds with the stock cooler.

But I'll take into consideration the week/branch and increase the bus little at a time and check each time the stability of the system with Orthos and Super Pi.

What troubles me though is whether or not should I increase the voltage to help the system run stably.
If I manage to OC at 3.6GHz without having problems at the tests I'll run and without any great heat increase I probably shouldn't ...right?

As for the RAM I saw in a review that the sticks indicate 2.1V to work in the specified timings, so I may change that from bios.

The case is made of aluminium so although a Midi Tower with the help of 2x12cm fans it would be ok for the system.

I don't plan to use 2 GPUs in the future so I think the PSU is good enough.

Except for the shortened life span of the CPU I would like to know what other negative effects I could get with OC.

Experience comes with practice but I want to make sure I know what I'm doing
before messing with a new system.
post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 
OW!

It just occurred to me that if I drop the multiplier to match the CPU to the RAM then I'll also drop the NB clock and thus my performance right?
post #7 of 12
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
  hide details  
Reply
post #8 of 12
Thread Starter 
I've read them through and I'll read them again if I'm missing something.

I've searched and luckily found a thread about overclocking in Asus P5E.
I saw some detailed configurations and results but I got a bit confused because
quad cores need different voltages than dual cores and also most of the systems I saw
had overclocked RAMs apart from the CPU and they needed to have raised NB voltages.

The concept is to raise the bus a bit an then run stability tests, raise more and when
running into problems raise the voltage. But I don't understand if I need to raise apart from
the VCore a CPU PLL Voltage the NB Voltage and the FSB Voltage.

I'm sorry if I ask silly things but I'm kind of lost in the world of OC.
post #9 of 12
read articles on TomsHardware and AnandTech and Wiki about ocing, CPUs, how they are made..
Every CPU is different...You¸ll find it is more than voltage and frequency ther... in a way it is a matter of luck... How good sample you get, and the good ones are the ones that can go very far with as little voltage...
You overclock ram and CPU separetely to see how much you can push them and find out your bottleneck...
Well yes, voltage added gives stronger signal, but also adds the electronmigration of integral circuit(damages CPU, decreases it`s life). If you go in generally approved limits you`ll be fine...And also they vary from CPU to CPU, and from RAM type to RAM type...

ok, you don`t want to read much...I`ve spent half a year on basic stuff...but it was long time ago..so willing to aid you, know how you feel:
vdimm--memory voltage, added if memory becomes unstable
vcore--cpu
nb voltage--for higher FSB(over 400Mhz I think)

DDR SDRAM-dual data rate SDRAM---FSB=333Mhz==>Memory=2*FSB=666Mhz
FSB-ram divider(or ratio depends on boards)--FSB=333Mhz, divider = 1.2==> Memory=FSB*divider=800Mhz
CPU multiplier...FSB 333, multiplier 9==>CPU freq=9*333=2997Mhy~3Ghz
CPU bus(for intel quad(4) pumped bus)FSB=333, FSB*4=1333--speed of data flow between NB and CPU...
these are the main stuff...hope you get smth...
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E5200, @3.5Ghz, 1.385 :/ Asus P5E3 Deluxe Sapphire HD 4850 Kingston 2*1gb, 1333Mhz, CL9 temp 
Hard DriveOSMonitorPower
WD Caviar Blue 6400 AAKS Win XP SP3 dual boot Vista Ultimate SP1 Samsung T220 Thermaltake Purepower RX 600w 
Case
NZXT Tempest 
  hide details  
Reply
post #10 of 12
Thread Starter 
I started reading articles in Tom's Hardware and I ran into some terms such as electromigration and found out some basic stuff. I also need to read about some custom overclocking related BIOS options and start practising when I buy my new PC at the end of the month.

Thanks for your support and I'll return with more questions when I finish my research
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