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[GT] House Passes PRO IP Act - Page 6

post #51 of 136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Piracy is not the same as stealing, especially when it is not for profit, and you know it. Go ahead and say it is the same, but it does not change the fact that it is far from it.

Frankly, I am really sick of all the people on OCN (not naming anybody in particular) who are so damn full of themselves, righteous and noble, and constantly preach about the evils of piracy and how you need to pay that $450 for Vista, or $1000+ for Adobe software.


Are you serious? Do you think that you are somehow entitled to the software? Tell me the difference between piracy and stealing. You are obtaining a product without paying for it.

If you take a car without paying you are stealing. If you walk into a bookstore and photocopy the books instead of buying them you are stealing. If you download an Adobe product, which their programmers worked for years to create for the sole purpose of selling it, you are stealing.

Quote:
I agree with everything Surrepfun said, except for the part about giving away copies of CDs you bought is OK. Even that is harmless, and you guys know it. The artists do NOT get the money you pay for CDs with. The RIAA does, and they use it to sue dead grandmothers, who had a 4-year old that downloaded a copy of the Barney song.
The artists knowingly and willingly sign contracts with the record companies so that they will have access to the marketing, exposure, and promotion that those companies can provide. That is their choice to make and they made it. The record companies sell the music - and if you get it without paying for it, you are stealing. The RIAA is evil - nobody is denying that. But stealing is wrong no matter how you cut it.

Quote:
I'm sorry, but if there is anybody on here that even remotely supports or agrees with any part of the RIAA/MPAA, then you need your internet service terminated permanently. I am going to REP+ all of Surrepfun's posts; he knows and understands more on this issue than most everybody on OCN collectively, most of whom are zombies to "The Man".

/endrant
Who is supporting the RIAA? I just can't stand all the kiddies who think they are a part of a crusade, or think that when they steal it is somehow justifiable, okay, or (and this one kills me) moral.

In case you need a refresher
Definitions of stealing on the Web:

larceny: the act of taking something from someone unlawfully;

In the criminal law, theft (also known as stealing) is the illegal taking of another person's property without that person's freely-given consent. ...
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post #52 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Piracy is not the same as stealing, especially when it is not for profit, and you know it. Go ahead and say it is the same, but it does not change the fact that it is far from it.
Steal, (verb) according to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary:
Quote:
1: to take the property of another wrongfully and especially as a habitual or regular practice
Piracy, according to the Merriam-Webster Dictionary:
Quote:
3 a: the unauthorized use of another's production, invention, or conception especially in infringement of a copyright
Hint: To "take the property of another wrongfully" would generally be considered an "unauthorized use".
Edited by Choggs396 - 6/11/08 at 11:21pm
    
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post #53 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauldovi
You don't "buy" the song, you purchase a license to use it. It is called intellectual property, been around for ages.
Do NOT give me that load of crap. When I buy a song/album, I have the right to do what I please with it, aside from making copies of it and giving/selling them. I can and will, however, make copies for my personal backup, in case the original is lost or ruined.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabidgnome229
Are you serious? Do you think that you are somehow entitled to the software? Tell me the difference between piracy and stealing. You are obtaining a product without paying for it.

If you take a car without paying you are stealing .... If you download an Adobe product, which their programmers worked for years to create for the sole purpose of selling it, you are stealing.
Big difference. A car is a physical object. If you steal it, it's gone, and there must be additional expenses to produce a new one. That is not the case with software, and you know it.
Quote:
The artists knowingly and willingly sign contracts with the record companies so that they will have access to the marketing, exposure, and promotion that those companies can provide. That is their choice to make and they made it.
I make the choice for the Artists that the choices they made were wrong.

Quote:
In case you need a refresher
Definitions of stealing on the Web:

larceny: the act of taking something from someone unlawfully;

In the criminal law, theft (also known as stealing) is the illegal taking of another person's property without that person's freely-given consent. ...
Piracy is not stealing.

PS:
I never actually said I pirate anything.
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post #54 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Do NOT give me that load of crap. When I buy a song/album, I have the right to do what I please with it, aside from making copies of it and giving/selling them. I can and will, however, make copies for my personal backup, in case the original is lost or ruined.
Intellectual Property is not "a load of crap". It's real, it exists. Maybe not always in the tangible, physical form; but it's real.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Big difference. A car is a physical object. If you steal it, it's gone, and there must be additional expenses to produce a new one. That is not the case with software, and you know it.
Just because something doesn't exist in the physical sense that you're thinking of, doesn't mean there aren't rights and laws bound to it. See the link above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Piracy is not stealing.
Wrong. Piracy is a form of theft (stealing). Reread my previous post with definitions.
    
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post #55 of 136
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Wow - I can't believe you actually did that

Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabidgnome229
If you take a car without paying you are stealing .... If you download an Adobe product, which their programmers worked for years to create for the sole purpose of selling it, you are stealing.
Big difference. A car is a physical object. If you steal it, it's gone, and there must be additional expenses to produce a new one. That is not the case with software, and you know it.
I make the choice for the Artists that the choices they made were wrong.
Here is what I actually posted
Quote:
If you take a car without paying you are stealing. If you walk into a bookstore and photocopy the books instead of buying them you are stealing. If you download an Adobe product, which their programmers worked for years to create for the sole purpose of selling it, you are stealing.
What's wrong? Did I just burst your bubble of ridiculous rationalization?
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post #56 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Choggs396
Intellectual Property is not "a load of crap". It's real, it exists. Maybe not always in the tangible, physical form; but it's real.
I did not say IP does not exist or that it is a load of crap. I said that the whole idea of "buying the right to use x times" is a load of crap. I can, and will, use CDs however I want, including but not limited to, copying to my hard drive and making backup copies of the CD in case the original is ruined.

Quote:
Wrong. Piracy is a form of theft (stealing). Reread my previous post with definitions.
Not sure how much clearer I can make this. Piracy is not stealing.
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post #57 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabidgnome229 View Post
What's wrong? Did I just burst your bubble of ridiculous rationalization?
No, I was getting to the point. Again, that IS stealing because the paper is a tangible object, and has to be replaced. Now if you were to just copy one or two pages, no that is not stealing. I wouldn't do it though, because you would get caught and be charged with stealing, even though it isn't stealing.
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post #58 of 136
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
No, I was getting to the point. Again, that IS stealing because the paper is a tangible object, and has to be replaced. Now if you were to just copy one or two pages, no that is not stealing. I wouldn't do it though, because you would get caught and be charged with stealing, even though it isn't stealing.
So if you copy the books on your own paper it isn't stealing? Do you have any idea how idiotic that sounds?

If you think only physical objects have value you need to get out of the 50's. We have this new fangled thing called...damn what was the term...computers! Changes things a bit
Edited by rabidgnome229 - 6/12/08 at 12:09am
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post #59 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by 003 View Post
Do NOT give me that load of crap. When I buy a song/album, I have the right to do what I please with it, aside from making copies of it and giving/selling them. I can and will, however, make copies for my personal backup, in case the original is lost or ruined.
Big difference. A car is a physical object. If you steal it, it's gone, and there must be additional expenses to produce a new one. That is not the case with software, and you know it.
I make the choice for the Artists that the choices they made were wrong.

Piracy is not stealing.

PS:
I never actually said I pirate anything.
Okay. Sure.
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post #60 of 136
Before this thread gets locked, I just want to share my view of the piracy vs stealing thing:

Lets say you're cheating on a test. You don't steal the person's physical test, scratch his name out, and write yours in and hand it in. No, you copy the answers from the test.

I don't know if this is the best example, but it's all I can come up with right now.

When you steal, you deprive someone of an object. When you pirate, you take a look at the object, and sit down and make your own copy. You are not stealing the original song, you're copying it.

I'm not advocating piracy, just saying that I think stealing =/= piracy; however both are wrong.
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