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[MG] Main cause of RRoD revealed - Page 3

post #21 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by SerenityKill3r View Post
I thought I read somewhere that the graphics core in the 360 was based on the same core as the 7950GTX???
G70. Not G71. And it is essentially a 7800GTX with 7800GTX 512 clock speeds.
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post #22 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spart View Post
No it's an ATi chip. The PS3 is based off a 7900 i think.
ps3's gpu is based off 7800

xbox360's gpu is its own thing created by ati
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post #23 of 30
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenutty1 View Post
It sounds like ATI designed the chip itself, but microsoft designed the PCB.
Agreed, that was my understanding as well.
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post #24 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenutty1 View Post
It sounds like ATI designed the chip itself, but microsoft designed the PCB.
Ok that explains a lot.
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post #25 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guruboy View Post
Now this is Megagames which isn't the best, but this looks legit.

Basically it's what the smartest of us expected; Microsoft cut one corner too many in manufacturing. I wonder if it was anything else?

--

After numerous reports about the exceptionally high Xbox 360 failure rate, Microsoft was forced to allocate 1 billion dollars to fix it.

Almost one year later, we have finally come to know the true story behind the historic RROD epidemic.

During the Design Automation Conference, Bryan Lewis, research vice president and chief analyst at Gartner, disclosed that it all begun with a single Microsoft's decision aiming to cut design costs for their Xbox 360 graphics chip.

According to Bryan Lewis, the epidemic happened because "Microsoft wanted to avoid an ASIC (application-specific integrated circuit) vendor", so they designed their own graphics chip and sent it directly to Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing for production.

Normally, semiconductor chips are designed on two stages. The first of them is the Schematic design where engineers draw a symbolic representation of the circuit. This should have been done by Microsoft. The second stage is PCB Layout design. In this stage, the abstract representation of the circuit is converted to real life Printed Circuit Board through a delicate and complex design process. Apparently, Microsoft decided to design its own PBC, but failed and ended up with an RROD epidemic.

"Had Microsoft left the graphics processor design to an ASIC vendor in the first place, would they have been able to avoid this problem?", Lewis asked before answering himself. "Probably. The ASIC vendor could have been able to design a graphics processor that dissipates much less power."

To fix the problem, Microsoft went back to an unnamed ASIC vendor based in the United States and redesigned the chip, Lewis added. (rumors have it that the ASIC vendor is most likely the former ATI, now part of AMD.)

Moral of the story: by going cheap and trying to save tens of millions of dollars in ASIC design costs, Microsoft ended up paying more than $1 billion for its Xbox 360 recall.


http://www.megagames.com/news/html/c...lurerate.shtml
ATI designed the graphics processor, and ibm did the cpu. They were never release with anything else, how old is this news? Everything else in the 360 was done by microsoft. Is that what megagames ment to say?
Edited by Blue_Fire - 6/11/08 at 5:54pm
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post #26 of 30
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue_Fire View Post
ATI designed the graphics processor, and ibm did the cpu. They were never release with anything else, how old is this news? Everything else in the 360 was done by microsoft. Is that what megagames ment to say?
Dude, you need to read the article, especially since you quoted it. For one thing, with a product like the 360, it's not as if Microsoft designed and manufactured every part besides those chips themselves. It's actually quite the opposite.

This news is a day old.

Microsoft cut a big corner - they decided to design their own PCB, from layout (which is common) to fabrication design (which normally an ASIC vendor would do). Basically Microsoft should have drawn up the electrical diagram of the PCB and the ASIC vendor would actually do the work turning that into a physical piece of hardware. Microsoft decided to save some money by doing both parts (by not hiring the outside company) and failed to produce a decent product, which in turn hurt the 360.
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post #27 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guruboy View Post
Dude, you need to read the article, especially since you quoted it. For one thing, with a product like the 360, it's not as if Microsoft designed and manufactured every part besides those chips themselves. It's actually quite the opposite.

This news is a day old.

Microsoft cut a big corner - they decided to design their own PCB, from layout (which is common) to fabrication design (which normally an ASIC vendor would do). Basically Microsoft should have drawn up the electrical diagram of the PCB and the ASIC vendor would actually do the work turning that into a physical piece of hardware. Microsoft decided to save some money by doing both parts (by not hiring the outside company) and failed to produce a decent product, which in turn hurt the 360.
i read the whole thing, and from what i read, they said graphics processor.
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post #28 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by nitd_kim View Post
ps3's gpu is based off 7800

xbox360's gpu is its own thing created by ati
ATi's GPU in the 360 is based off an existing card like the PS3's is, can't remember which though.
    
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post #29 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Near View Post
ATi's GPU in the 360 is based off an existing card like the PS3's is, can't remember which though.
It's based on the ATI R500 afaik
post #30 of 30
Yeah, this really doesn't explain anything. We already knew it was Microsoft's fault and that the issue was related to the graphics chip. This article does not say how Microsoft messed up, just that they did and claim Microsoft would have been better off having had an ASIC manufacturer design it.
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