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[hardocp] Kids Are Failing, It's All Wikipedia's Fault!

4K views 131 replies 76 participants last post by  HowHardCanItBe 
#1 ·
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According to the Scottish Parent Teacher Council, kids are failing in school because of Wikipedia and sites like it. The council is worried that students don't know how to research anymore and they put too much faith in the validity of online resources.

According to the report, Eleanor Coner, the SPTC's information officer, said: "Children are very IT-savvy, but they are rubbish at researching." She noted that today's students do the majority of their research online instead of using books or other resources that could be found at the library.

Source
 
#3 ·
Well, of course we use the internet... why use a book which is much harder to search than the internet?

I refuse to listen to this... most reputable net resources like Wikipedia are very valid, and in fact, teachers reference them when recommending sources.
 
#4 ·
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Originally Posted by Gexx
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Hahaha, people are always looking for a scapegoat.

Beat me to it.

Instead of blaming the internetz for stupid kids, how about we blame the real issue, stupid and lazy teachers!

It isn't that hard to give all the kids with bad answers a poor grade, then the next class day teach them what they did wrong, and why the library might be better.

I have spent my time in the school system, and done some teaching and behind the scenes work, and from what I have seen a lot of teachers are very lazy, and don't have the guts to let parents know what their kids are doing, or don't have the guts to fail or give poor grades to kids.
 
#5 ·
Researching online is just like using books. There are credible realiable books just like there are books that are not totaly reliable. People just need to learn to research correctly whether online or not. I do stay away from wikipedia when doing research type papers. I know it is mostly all reliable but i prefer to use other sources.
 
#6 ·
These times are different now, even if you read a book, most kids do not know how to read it or quite understand it.

Kids today read and write as ThIS iZ MaH RaPot 0n... SpAze
(this is my report on space)

Oh god how this is sad but true.

You also cant blame the internet for being highly resourceful but whenever people want answers we GOOGLE it.

If I wanted to research of course I'll explore on the net but also get the resources on a book as well and slap a few quotes...
 
#8 ·
Why spend ages reading a book when you can find the same information on the internet in under a 1 min?. The Internet is the BIGGEST source of information out there and is constantly updated. Why always refer to a book.

Yes books are good when you know for sure they contain the information you want and exactly where to find it. Other than that the internet is the best place to go IMO.
 
#10 ·
Actually if anything the education system is the problem...not the Internet. Kids are bashed over the head and told to Conform to society in every respect and if you dont pass your tests then you will be a buggered ******. I HATED school with a vengeance when I Was about 14. I realised that there was no sense in being here...I mean for what. A couple of GCSE's that may or may not get me into a college I never really wanted to attend anyway....oh yes please !.

You dont learn anything remotely important in school. Granted Maths,English and science are important in the most part.You are learning all the time and IMO the learning starts after school. The real learning that is. Life is a learning curve. School is all politics and the majority of what you are supposedly taught you will never use again lol.

School for me was always a prison. Apart from seeing mates, that was the only good part of it.

There are many problems with the education system, atleast here and that is they dont do anything that really engages your mind and excites you. Or is it just me ?, I was bored stupid most of the time.

The only good lesson was I.T and that was only because I could get on the internet, They didnt teach me anythng in IT I did not already know. Not because I was super smart...but because the topics they cover are embarassing in school I.T.
 
#11 ·
B.Walker36 beat me to it. The problem is that there are just as many inacurate books and encyclopedias as there are inaccurate wiki articles (or other net resources), the difference is that anything from a book is considered legit and the wEbZ are teh fake. If you don't know how to do reasonably accurate research on the net then you can't do accurate research in books either, one of the skills you need when doing serious research is the ability to weed out the BS and get to the meat. You don't pick up the first book you come to and get all your info there (very short bibliography, lol), you do "research" and find the general consensus on a subject, not one books or articles opinion.
 
#12 ·
Yea, reading a factual (or mostly factual) website is detrimental to what our children know.
 
#13 ·
Hooray for the dumbing of our culture!

I'm still being told in school that using the internet as a resource is not a good way to research information, and that I should go to the library and find a book and look through it for actual research. Why should I do this when many books are cataloged on the internet, and can be referred to much more quickly when I google them as opposed to spending hours searching, copying, highlighting text. Sure, using books to research was all well and good when there was no way of quickly obtaining information, but now that our interwebz! are more advanced, there is no reason not to trust research from websites that can be verified. Now I'm not here to advocate that wikipedia is the most secure form of information on the planet, but when an article has more references from legitimate media than it does text, I feel it is safe to trust. Many teachers suggest that books are more verifiable and must be held accountable in order to be published, but this is utter rubbish. I could go to a publisher, and with enough money, spout off my own ideas/opinions as fact and have a book published, and then refer to that book in a report and not be counted wrong for using it, as it is a published media. But if I write the same thing in a blog, it instantly becomes worthless? The education system in this culture needs to be completely re-worked, and for more reasons than just being forced to use hard media, but that is another rant entirely.
 
#16 ·
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Originally Posted by stargate125645
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What happened to requiring specific numbers of non-internet sources on reports?

It became outdated since the rest of us moved into the 21st century.....
 
#17 ·
Lol i failed a physics project because i copied all the information about a trebuchet from it. That's only because she said you copied all this from wikipedia and i said nope, see look... My name and date are on the top right hand corner. She hated me till graduation.
 
#18 ·
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Originally Posted by Urufu_Shinjiro
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It became outdated since the rest of us moved into the 21st century.....

There's nothing wrong with that requirement. If the 21st century involves not using verifiable sources then it only spells doom for society. People can print whatever they want on the internet. There is nothing wrong with using internet sources as long as those sites have sources, but actual published items should always be referenced.

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Originally Posted by Twinnuke
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Lol i failed a physics project because i copied all the information about a trebuchet from it. That's only because she said you copied all this from wikipedia and i said nope, see look... My name and date are on the top right hand corner. She hated me till graduation.

Would have pissed me off, too. You effectively insulted the teacher by doing that.
 
#19 ·
Quote:


Originally Posted by Urufu_Shinjiro
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It became outdated since the rest of us moved into the 21st century.....

Roger that. Books of course have there uses and will for a very long time. However I just do not see the point in sourcing from a book if you can find the same if not more updated information on the internet.

There argument is '' With a book you have to carefully research and spend time on it. This shows you have good research capabilities ETC''

Well why would I want to do that when I can find the correct information 10x faster and I can then better utilize the saved time on something else.
 
#21 ·
Wikipedia is MUCH easier so what do you expect? I'm not saying it's necessarily good OR bad... just what do you expect?
 
#22 ·
Quote:


Originally Posted by stargate125645
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There's nothing wrong with that requirement. If the 21st century involves not using verifiable sources then it only spells doom for society. People can print whatever they want on the internet. There is nothing wrong with using internet sources as long as those sites have sources, but actual published items should always be referenced.

This is where I disagree, people can print whatever they want in books too. I'm a WWII history buff and I can't tell you the thousands of books out there with completely inaccurate information on them, yet I can reference any one of those and it's considered more valid than an internet article based on interviews with people who were actually bloody there. Yes, you need multiple references on a single point to show it as valid, I can show multiple sources on the net, each one of those with multiple sources and it be just as acurate as referencing multiple book sources. No one is saying you don't need verifiable sources of info, we are saying that books are not inherently more verifiable than internet resources.
 
#24 ·
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Originally Posted by ENTERPRISE
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Roger that. Books of course have there uses and will for a very long time. However I just do not see the point in sourcing from a book if you can find the same if not more updated information on the internet.

There argument is '' With a book you have to carefully research and spend time on it. This shows you have good research capabilities ETC''

Well why would I want to do that when I can find the correct information 10x faster and I can then better utilize the saved time on something else.

The issue is that people aren't verifying their information. There wouldn't be a problem with Wikipedia if kids didn't take it as the ultimate word. Have you ever tried to click on a Wikipedia source? Quite often they are dead links. The fact of the matter is that published items require credibility and sources. The internet does not.

Quote:


Originally Posted by Urufu_Shinjiro
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This is where I disagree, people can print whatever they want in books too. I'm a WWII history buff and I can't tell you the thousands of books out there with completely inaccurate information on them, yet I can reference any one of those and it's considered more valid than an internet article based on interviews with people who were actually bloody there. Yes, you need multiple references on a single point to show it as valid, I can show multiple sources on the net, each one of those with multiple sources and it be just as acurate as referencing multiple book sources. No one is saying you don't need verifiable sources of info, we are saying that books are not inherently more verifiable than internet resources.

Point taken. Books with cited sources, then, as any good source would have. Books aren't automatically taken as fact if they don't support their own words with sources as well. The point still stands.
 
#25 ·
yeah, internet sites are always being updated.
when a book is written, that's it. it must be re-written to update.

BUT
i think it's safe, when researching something you don't know, to find the same information on multiple sources. just so you're sure it's accurate.

maybe that's why assignments in schools ALWAYS ask for more than just 2-3 sources
 
#26 ·
I would have respect for wikipedia if it were not so easy to change it. I personally think wikipedia is crap as far as a source goes. I have no problem with people using ACCURATE online sources. I do think that you need to be referencing a journal or two with anything you do to validate that you are not an idiot in what you are presenting in said topic.

As far as I know most libraries have all of their stuff online and you can easily do a search through a library to find a legitimate source then go and pick it up.
 
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