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[Y!] Voyager Spacecraft Reveals Solar System Edge - Page 5

post #41 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSpock2002 View Post
As of now yes. Tomorrow? Who knows. That is my point. Nothing is impossable. Todays understanding or todays technology sees it as being impossable. Who's to say tomorrow someone won't invent a new math, or have a brainstorm much like Einstien did.

Right now humans say that breaking the light barrier is impossable, and with todays knowlege it is. But who's to say that in 50 or hell even 150 years it wont be possable. That's entirely what I am getting at. Human beings are constantly evolving. If you look at where we were 100 years ago to today you'd think we were ignorant little people who knew next to nothing.

Anyone that says point blank "oh that will never happen" is an ignorant fool.
*Impossible*

And I completely agree with you.
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post #42 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpm666 View Post
*Impossible*

And I completely agree with you.
Doh sorry....
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post #43 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSpock2002 View Post
As of now yes. Tomorrow? Who knows. That is my point. Nothing is impossable. Todays understanding or todays technology sees it as being impossable. Who's to say tomorrow someone won't invent a new math, or have a brainstorm much like Einstien did.

Right now humans say that breaking the light barrier is impossable, and with todays knowlege it is. But who's to say that in 50 or hell even 150 years it wont be possable. That's entirely what I am getting at. Human beings are constantly evolving. If you look at where we were 100 years ago to today you'd think we were ignorant little people who knew next to nothing.

Anyone that says point blank "oh that will never happen" is an ignorant fool.
The understanding of special relativity is very high and well documented in experiments and all observed natural phenomenon. This is very different from other physical theories of the past that were just that, theories.

It is not a matter of technology. As you can see in the chart, as your speed approaches c, your energy approaches infinity. I don't think any technology in the next 100000000000000 years is going to produce an infinite energy source.

Ever used a GPS? This is an existing example of special relativity in action.
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post #44 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSpock2002 View Post
As of now yes. Tomorrow? Who knows. That is my point. Nothing is impossable. Todays understanding or todays technology sees it as being impossable. Who's to say tomorrow someone won't invent a new math, or have a brainstorm much like Einstien did.

Right now humans say that breaking the light barrier is impossable, and with todays knowlege it is. But who's to say that in 50 or hell even 150 years it wont be possable. That's entirely what I am getting at. Human beings are constantly evolving. If you look at where we were 100 years ago to today you'd think we were ignorant little people who knew next to nothing.

Anyone that says point blank "oh that will never happen" is an ignorant fool.
pauldovi is correct. Moving any object with mass faster than the speed of light IS IMPOSSIBLE. Saying otherwise would be science fiction unless you can prove otherwise. Yes, proof is part of science.

However, there are other means of "moving" faster than light that follow the current understanding of physics. i.e. Wormholes.... you move space instead of matter. However, there are issue with those concepts as well. Free energy/information/matter/work is impossible in the universe.
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post #45 of 98
Yeah, thank god the world's flat or that could have come back to ya!
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post #46 of 98
ok let me simplify this:

when an object approaches the speed of light, to make it accelerate (and thus break the "light barrier") you need a certain amount of energy. The value of that certain amount of energy = Infinity Joules

Not going to happen. Its not about technology, its science. Just like science does not allow, lets say a single object being in two places at the same time, science does not allow the breaking of the speed of light.
    
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post #47 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpm666 View Post
Yeah, thank god the world's flat or that could have come back to ya!
That is one of those "theories" that had no evidence to back it up. Special Relativity is extremely well documented.
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post #48 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauldovi View Post
That is one of those "theories" that had no evidence to back it up. Special Relativity is extremely well documented.
I thought the world being flat was a theory proven to be incorrect?
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post #49 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpm666 View Post
I thought the world being flat was a theory proven to be incorrect?
You missed my point. Many of the young and uneducated (not an insult) members of this forum will use the fact that "accepted" science 200 years ago was proven wrong, so modern "accepted" science will be proven wrong in 200 years as well.

But there is a fundamental difference in science today then there was then. The experiments come after the theory and science today is not based upon fear of the unknown but rather math, physics, and the resulting experiments that prove them.
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post #50 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauldovi View Post
Give me a reference to who said it was a physical impossibility to break the speed of sound.

Physics and science now are a little different then they were 50 years ago. 50 years ago you would discover something or perhaps make an invention, and then try to create a scientific model the explained what you had just found.

Now we use math to explain physics, and then use experiments to prove them. The actual invention comes after the theory, which is a big difference from just 50 years ago.

The speed of light is a limitation that cannot be broken with technology. All natural forms of communication, including electromagnetic waves, gravity, and forces are limited by the speed of light.

gamma, the relationship between relativistic values shows us why traveling at the speed of light is impossible, it results in a vertical asymptote at the speed of light:

Good job there guy ^

I only took a high school physics class so I don't claim to know how this stuff works 100% correctly but I have a basic understand of it and it is much more complicated then I explained.

Basically on a object level as to why we don't have vehicles that can do it is because, the faster you move, the heavier you get. The heavier you get, the more thrust you will need to break light speed. In order to add more thrust, you need more engines which in turn adds to weight. Therefore no matter how hard we try at this current stage in life, our tech is too heavy and too weak to do anything. If they some how made Rocket engines the size of an Xbox that can output enough thrust to break the sound barrier in 3 seconds after ignition, we still wouldn't able to do it.

If we tried it on earth, the vehicle we are using would break apart just cause of sheer force on it. Space would only be a good place to test it because there are less forces acting on it like earth has(wind speed, friction, gravity, etc). But then you also have to factor in how your going to slow down when comming out of light speed.

Newton's law says once an object is in motion, it stays in motion unless another force is acted upon it. Hence why our shuttles have forward and rear thrusters. If they didn't have forward thrusts they would just continue to go straight until they smack into something(the other force.) There for something just as strong or stronger would have to be mounted to on the front end of said ship in order to slow it down. It wouldn't have to be an engine that out puts the same exact force as the rear engines, but using a weaker force would mean longer stopping distance.

Akin it to driving a truck at 100mph in one direction and then throw a ball 100 mph in the opposite direction. The forces would cancel each other out forcing the ball to drop straight down.(see youtube for a Japanese game show who did this.)

So in theory(my theory atleast) we would need to build a carrier that can go almost the speed of light and launch a ship from it while it is near the speed of light. Only then we can even hope to break it. Think of it like a F-22 Raptor, Those things can break the sound barrier correct? And lets just say the missiles they launch can got 200 mph. So say if the raptor was traveling at mach 1. the missile inside the plane is technically traveling at mach 1 relative to the ground but it stationary in the plane its self. If the pilot were to launch the missile, it would travel faster then the plane would because it has extra thrust behind giving it the the speed of mach 1 plus another 200 mph. Which explains why a plane can not catch up to its own missile when its launched at max speed, unless it launched at a lower speed and then speed up to catch it.

It also explains why you can throw a ball up in the car and still have it land in your hand if the car is moving. since the ball is moving with the car it is going to same speed as everything in the car which relative to the car it is not moving at all.

This also leads into guns and why you have lead moving targets. but I wont get into that. Correct me if I'm wrong on anything.
Edited by gex80 - 7/3/08 at 12:51pm
    
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