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[YouTube] Phenom II Videos, AMDUnprocessed - Page 7

post #61 of 89
AMD ftw.
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post #62 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptedvick View Post


its still 45nm ..smaller transistors can take less voltage than bigger ones (65nm).. check out cpu history ... regardless if it is AMD of Intel
Ya small layouts have less space to collect and amplify. But they leak so much without actually setting anything off and tripping a "switch". The problem right now is that everyone is going to high metal gates and they are tougher to trip and don't leak that much. But everybody is looking for just the right mixes and just the right sizes and shapes and depths on the high metal to get them to trip the way they want to at the speeds they want and the way the transistor layouts set up as amplifiers. AMD always uses denser circuit layouts looking to do everything in one clock cycle while intel cut down circuit densities to increase clocks and has been adding circuit densities back in. Keeping at more or less the same clocks but dropping off somewhat as they pile stuff in. This is probably because as Intel was off on thier RISC like processors AMD kept throwing in new things SSE3 SSE4 64 bit extensions to distract them. Until all the junk actually worked on computers it was useless so old intel chips was way to run for long time.
The biggest problem is the heat side of it. Old gates got more conductive as they got hotter and leaked more and got hotter. People don't really know how the new gates respond to all this and probably every process size is going to have to change the gates some to max out but they likely won't even bother. I remember when i overclocked my 386sx from 16 to 24. It was no problem for the cpu but the northbridge hated it simply because it was using a 30 percent bigger process size that didn't like the voltage the cpu gave it and it just wouldn't work no matter what ya did on heat sink. I even ran it in freezing garage and it wouldn't work. But if you sprayed it with freeze spray every 2 to 3 minutes it would run fine.
But those days you could get data sheets on everything. Today you have to sign non-disclosure agreement and pay to see a white sheet. So who knows how full of crap everybody is today. The best trick anyone played on anyone was guy changed the 14.1318 mhz crystal to much lower crystal and made people believe he had a 286 running at 100 mhz and some magazines were criticizing intel for not being able to do it. Then they found out he hadn't sped up the processor he just slowed down the clock.
The things you'll do to get through the last screen clogging mission on a wing commander expansion pack in an era when 386-25 processors cost 450 bucks and everything that happens on your screen all happened cause of the CPU.
Edited by Hephasteus - 12/19/08 at 7:28pm
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post #63 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post
Err, It wasn't a few seconds, it ran through the Crysis Benchmark a few times....

Did you even WATCH the other videos?
Agreed mate!

Last night i spent ages reading the thread about this on xtreme systems from team finland, the guys who overclocked it in chicago, one of them took the chip he used for the LN2 runs home and its STILL working and running fine, even on air etc

Some people really have no idea what they are on about, yet alone the differences between intels process and the one amd use

Edit:

Also when it come to their overclocking on air, they had 30 minutes, during that time they tested using 5 cpu's and that half an hour included the time it took to remove heatsinks change chips remount the sinks and then reboot into vista and overclock etc and they still got 3.9 so you can imagine how much time they got to spend on each chip, so there would have been much more room for tweaking thats for sure
Edited by Gr3m1in - 12/20/08 at 12:23am
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post #64 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ihatethedukes View Post
That may be a joke, but if you're serious... no you won't. I personally reach into LN2 with bare hands to pluck out eppendorf tubes all the time. It's not something you'd leave your hand in obviously but for a brief period of time like a spill hitting you, you'd be fine 99% of the time.
he is right. i forget what the law is called, but when you stick your hand in LN2 the heat from your hand instantly evaporates any nitrogen, creating a thin layer of gas. you have to do it quickly, but it is very possible

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrienspawn View Post
Hopefully they'll include a year's supply of LN2.

But I don't believe anything from people who represent the company making it... As always consumer benchmarks will tell.




Wonder if they're that desperate....just getting the hype up so that no one buys i7s for Christmas.



No chip can handle 1.9V, Period. LN2 is the only thing that kept it alive those few seconds. Even if you brought it back to normal voltage that thing will die shortly. Doesn't matter if they're cherry-picked or not, people don't have LN2 to OC like crazy. Air-cooled overclocks are a lot more representative.
1: they have brought in multiple third parties for this. i dont think team finland is AMD specific either...

2: yes they are hyping it up so no one buys i7s. i think thats kinda the point of advertising. gets the consumer to not buy the competitors product, and instead buy your own.

3: no intel chip can handle 1.9v. last time i checked, intel does not own AMD and wont for some time.

4: and they DID DO AIR COOLING. they got to 3.9 which is not that bad and that was only in thirty minutes. and it was in the video.

next time, please watch the videos before posting. it really really helps, i promise.
Edited by forcifer - 12/20/08 at 12:35am
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post #65 of 89
oops double post sorry
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post #66 of 89
Dude see my post above yours about more info on the air clocks, that makes it way more impressive to say the least!
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post #67 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by om3n View Post
that third video... they said if they were to run an intel chip at 6 GHZ it "would probably fry..." what on earth?? Intel has hit 10 GHZ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexgheseger View Post
So I have a question:

How stable is that 8.2GHZ oc? (obviously no LN2-cooled systems are practical for a vast majority of people, unless I guess if you have a TON of money and can actually afford a large LN2 reservoir and pump system to use LN2 cooling on a daily basis )

For the Phenom 2 OC test they were doing, they look like they actually stressed it with a game, and we all know that you can run the clock speed high to post, load windows, load CPU-Z, but will crash if you load a game or some CPU-stress heavy test/program.

While that guy who made that intel-would-fry-at-6ghz statement is probably ignorant of the facts, could the i7/phenom 2 go higher if they did not do any stress/stability test and just tried to go as high as possible? (assuming of course, that 8ghz record did not do any stability testing, otherwise i stand corrected)
Edited by nist7 - 12/20/08 at 8:45am
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post #68 of 89
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptedvick View Post


its still 45nm ..smaller transistors can take less voltage than bigger ones (65nm).. check out cpu history ... regardless if it is AMD of Intel
Heres my proof.

Phenom 2 940 Stock = 1.35vcore

45nm Core 2 Quad Stock = About 1.25 and Less

Yes, overall 45nm processes generally do not stand as high of voltages. But the stock voltages say something. AMD wouldn't release something with a stock vcore of 1.35 if they knew it would die or risk killing the chips at 1.362 or above like intels.
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post #69 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by nist7 View Post
So I have a question:

How stable is that 8.2GHZ oc? (obviously no LN2-cooled systems are practical for a vast majority of people, unless I guess if you have a TON of money and can actually afford a large LN2 reservoir and pump system to use LN2 cooling on a daily basis )

For the Phenom 2 OC test they were doing, they look like they actually stressed it with a game, and we all know that you can run the clock speed high to post, load windows, load CPU-Z, but will crash if you load a game or some CPU-stress heavy test/program.

While that guy who made that intel-would-fry-at-6ghz statement is probably ignorant of the facts, could the i7/phenom 2 go higher if they did not do any stress/stability test and just tried to go as high as possible? (assuming of course, that 8ghz record did not do any stability testing, otherwise i stand corrected)
tbh mate the current phenom II can COLD boot at MINUS 196C (the temp of liquid nitrogen) and thats a FIRST, with all other processors you have to regulate the temps and how much LN2 you have in your pot etc so you dont cold bug, so there apparently is a LOT more headroom to get higher i actually read a few posts on the web hinting that AMD was experimenting with liquid helium which is -270 degrees C so thats saying something when liquid nitrogen isnt too cold for the chip!

the problem with liquid helium is it turns back into a gas really quickly so they have real complicated setups to test it apparently

but on the 8ghz front ive been sayign it awhile now that since dualies clock higher than quads the dual core deneb chips (athlon x2's released in june) which should have a TDP of around 65W should surpass the 7ghz number on LN2 and possibly 5 on good air alone, so honestly within the next year id say we'll see a chip hit at least 7.5 and maybe see the all time record fall


that is unless all these phenoms are cherry picked and its all a ruse then were ****ed
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post #70 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post
Err, It wasn't a few seconds, it ran through the Crysis Benchmark a few times....

Did you even WATCH the other videos?
I measure those benchmarks in seconds. 1 minute = 60 seconds, multiply 60 by the number of minutes to get seconds

Quote:
Originally Posted by forcifer View Post
1: they have brought in multiple third parties for this. i dont think team finland is AMD specific either...

2: yes they are hyping it up so no one buys i7s. i think thats kinda the point of advertising. gets the consumer to not buy the competitors product, and instead buy your own.

3: no intel chip can handle 1.9v. last time i checked, intel does not own AMD and wont for some time.

4: and they DID DO AIR COOLING. they got to 3.9 which is not that bad and that was only in thirty minutes. and it was in the video.

next time, please watch the videos before posting. it really really helps, i promise.
1. You can tell their-pro AMD regardless of their name, I mean come on.

2. Pretty much.

3. The point is not if it can, it's if it should. It might be able to withstand a hit by a hammer, but that's a bad thing.

4. Never said they didn't? What I'm saying is that LN2 performance means nothing. Big whup if they can get 6ghz, no one else will. Maximum OC on air and at a reasonable voltage... If that gives 3.9 at 1.5V+ they're in trouble. They'll have much more competition from the Penryn's than the Core i7.
Edited by Adrienspawn - 12/20/08 at 10:44am
Obsidian
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Obsidian
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