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[Official] OCN Headphones and Earphones Club - Page 3084

post #30831 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWulfe View Post

Interestingly enough, despite my playful protests based upon aesthetics I am still curious about the hd 600's, but as I already have a pair of Akg k712's I've been looking more at the hd 800's (as well as Mr speakers ether) as one of my next purchases. With a higher end setup of course.

HiFiMan's gear is tempting but since their website is a nightmare to navigate as it's constantly opening new tabs and isn't easy to pull up a full list of their gear, let alone compare. No idea if there are any local places to try out such gear either, as I wouldn't mind getting to listen to them before purchase.

Honestly go check out head-fi and see if there are any meets in your region coming up, you can demo a lot of gear there.

For my ear between the Ethers and the HD800 I prefer the Ethers. HiFIMan does have a very interesting website but thats in part due to the fact that they are more focused on the asian market where the lion's share of their sales come from. They do sell in both Europe and North America but their marketing budgets are fairly small in those regions.
post #30832 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by maeveth View Post

Honestly go check out head-fi and see if there are any meets in your region coming up, you can demo a lot of gear there..

+1. The amount and range of fear you can try in an afternoon is huge. There seems to be a lot going on right now too, I think there were a few last weekend and there are a few this coming weekend. I'm heading to the one in Chicago on Saturday.
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post #30833 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by maeveth View Post

Honestly go check out head-fi and see if there are any meets in your region coming up, you can demo a lot of gear there.

For my ear between the Ethers and the HD800 I prefer the Ethers. HiFIMan does have a very interesting website but thats in part due to the fact that they are more focused on the asian market where the lion's share of their sales come from. They do sell in both Europe and North America but their marketing budgets are fairly small in those regions.

With my luck the closest would be Vancouver, or if luckier Calgary, both of which are quite a ways away. As for Hoffman's website, my comment is due to the fact you can't just view all and easily compare the models - it's subdivided subdivisions followed by new tabs being opened with every click, so it's a navigational nightmare.

As for the headphones I mentioned previously, odds are I'd lean towards the ethers for a variety of reasons but the biggest is I like some bass. Nowhere near as much as OC'ing does obviously, but I still like some thump (something about aggrotech and DnB being arguably my two most favourite genres, but not everything I listen to).

I would consider the insanity of getting a pair of Audeze LCD's as well as Mr Speaker Ethers but I really do wonder if it would be worth having two pairs for the days I feel like wanting a bit more thump. It's a lot easier with my current setup (ath-m50x's as my second pair), but eventually I know I'll want something that's a bit.... More.

I'll definitely take a look to see if there's a chance at any actually close meets, since I am pretty curious about such things.
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post #30834 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWulfe View Post

...but I still like some thump...

Take a look at the Ether C, generally closed headphones will have more low end because of the nature of the wave propogation. You'll also in general sacrifice a bit of sound-stage transparency but it may be worth it to you. I will say though however that Ether C is one set of cans I have yet to have a good chance to demo.
post #30835 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by pez View Post

Reading through these last 3 pages, I have to say I'll be pretty excited for the day I can look at some of the mentioned equipment and talk of it as just a 'meh' subject tongue.gif.
Many will end up at sub-$1k gear and be satisifed. Some would be lucky to get to the level of OC'ing Noob's gear.

The rare few that venture far beyond that are probably kooky in some way.


tongue.gif
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post #30836 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by NBrock View Post

Hey anyone have opinions on this? https://www.massdrop.com/buy/appj-1502a-tube-headphone-amplifier
Obviously better tubes are in order...but other than that?


anyone? Not finding much. Some love for it on Reddit and some Amazon reviews as well as a few nice things here and there...nothing bad but nothing in-depth either.
post #30837 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by maeveth View Post

Take a look at the Ether C, generally closed headphones will have more low end because of the nature of the wave propogation. You'll also in general sacrifice a bit of sound-stage transparency but it may be worth it to you. I will say though however that Ether C is one set of cans I have yet to have a good chance to demo.

They're definitely gorgeous, that much is certain. Probably would be gorgeous with a pair of the open ones next to them on the same desk, but that's just me being semi-silly. I'm still debating as to which is my preference, open or closed headphones. Closed has the nice benefit of not waking your spouse up while you're listening to Angerfist or Art of Fighters (done that just a few times with my K712's because some of their songs have really... weird intros) and has more thump, but there's also the annoying "ears get hot" problem some models can have (original ATH-M50's come to mind, the M50X's aren't as bad about it, at least from what I've experienced), whereas open headphones definitely have a wonderful soundstage to them. I will admit though that I'd rather just get one pair that's really good and effectively be done with it, so it's hard to decide.

It also turns out there isn't a MrSpeakers dealer anywhere near me, but there is a HiFiMan one as well as an Audeze on my delivery route, so I could pop into either of them to check them out to see what my thoughts are.

But man those Ethers look nice, and are getting quite a lot of good reviews.
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post #30838 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWulfe View Post

But man those Ethers look nice, and are getting quite a lot of good reviews.

One of my friends has the exact same setup as I do except he has the Ethers instead of my HE1000. I can say that had I not gotten a special deal on my HEKs I would have gone for the Ethers.

I took a moment to listen to the two artists you mentioned above and I see where your concerns come from. I tend to listen to a lot of Operatic Metal so I get into some of those bass heavy sections at times too.

Another thing I did think of in regard to your desire for good bass is your dac and amp choice. While not a hard and fast rule a more powerful amp will be able to better produce low-end, this is not because "MORE POWER IS BETTER" but its because some cans are just more power hungry and need a bit more to really be driven to their fullest.

When it comes to DACs some tend to do a slightly(very) better job when it comes to the de-quantiization of the low end. I don't want to start a big Delta Sigma vs R2R discussion here but I've found that generally R2R DACs ive tried tend to produce a cleaner sound and thus more revealing of detail. I will add however that I HAVE NOT actually setup any sort of testing apparatus to verify my theories of why R2R sounds better so I'm just giving you my opinion which you, and others, may or may not agree with smile.gif

As always YMMV!
post #30839 of 37780
@WhiteWulfe, I should probably give Combichrist or Grendel a try on the HD650s as I haven't done that yet, been too busy listening to deep house on them smile.gif .
   
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post #30840 of 37780
Quote:
Originally Posted by maeveth View Post

One of my friends has the exact same setup as I do except he has the Ethers instead of my HE1000. I can say that had I not gotten a special deal on my HEKs I would have gone for the Ethers.

I took a moment to listen to the two artists you mentioned above and I see where your concerns come from. I tend to listen to a lot of Operatic Metal so I get into some of those bass heavy sections at times too.

Another thing I did think of in regard to your desire for good bass is your dac and amp choice. While not a hard and fast rule a more powerful amp will be able to better produce low-end, this is not because "MORE POWER IS BETTER" but its because some cans are just more power hungry and need a bit more to really be driven to their fullest.

When it comes to DACs some tend to do a slightly(very) better job when it comes to the de-quantiization of the low end. I don't want to start a big Delta Sigma vs R2R discussion here but I've found that generally R2R DACs ive tried tend to produce a cleaner sound and thus more revealing of detail. I will add however that I HAVE NOT actually setup any sort of testing apparatus to verify my theories of why R2R sounds better so I'm just giving you my opinion which you, and others, may or may not agree with smile.gif

As always YMMV!

Ah, I do apologize, those two artists I mentioned are gabber artists, and that's kind of it's own unique set of something resembling a mashup between danceable music and outright noise *laughs nervously*. If I were to use two tracks as an example (for gabber), it would be "Art of Fights w/Noize Suppressor - Breathe Fire", and "Triple Six - Beast" (on Next Cyclone - unable to link due to lyrics) would come to mind as the more modern

Man finding ToS appropriate tracks to link is hard, since Dutch and Italian gabber labels are notorious for having swearing in them. Anyways, short version of what I was wanting to say is as nice as those sound on my K712's I usually find myself reaching for my ATH-M50X's simply because I have to crank my K712's as far as 12 o'clock on my Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 whereas my M50X's (when hubby isn't stealing them, lol) are more than happy for most tracks at only 10 o'clock. Yes, I know it isn't the best of solutions out there, but at the moment it does it's job but it's a stopgap since it's eventually being moved away from my gaming rig (and being plugged into a dedicated audio/djing rig, which is what I purchased it for in the first place).

As for aggrotech, my usual go-to favourites artists are Funker Vogt (Blutzoll is my favourite album, and the track "Fire and Forget" from that same album is probably my favourite song by them, with the single "Hard Way" a close second), Hocico ("Dead Trust" is a song from them I definitely love (I definitely can't link this one due to the rather racy video!!!!), but probably my favourite album from them so far is "TIempos De Furia" (favourite tracks: "Where Words Fail, Hate Speaks", "Dog Eat Dog" but especially "Tiempos De Furia").... Once again, I usually find myself reaching for the M50X's, especially for Hocico's music. Interestingly enough though, I didn't like certain songs by Funker Vogt until I accidentally (was distracted doing other things) let them play on my K712's... Robots (on the album Blutzoll) is a song I've found myself kicking back and enjoying on my K712's...

On the flipside, some songs by Aesthetic Perfection just sound so much nicer on my K712's... All Beauty Destroyed sounds so much more "alive" on my K712's, and I'm not just referring to the piano. Daniel's voice is rather lovely on my K712's, although I have to admit I've never seen him live (I've missed his past two shows since I found his music, oops). Another song of his I greatly prefer on my K712's is "Dying In The Worst Way".

I can definitely say this though: DnB music (we'll just go with, say, "Propane Nightmares" as well as "Blood Sugar (2004)" by Pendulum as examples since there are decent quality versions of them online) wind up having incredibly piercing treble (especially on the highly/sharply tweaked snares a lot of DnB has) if you turn them up enough for the bass to be decent, not to mention tends to feel like a decent portion of the life has been sucked out of it... Whereas I can usually enjoy hours of DnB with the M50X's assuming I take the earcups off every hour and a half or so for a bit to let my ears cool off - which is something that happens often enough because hubby usually wants to get my attention for something anyways.

.... ....Okay, to test a theory I'm pulling a few CDs out of storage since I haven't ripped them yet and man are the YouTube rips of them terrible. Note the M50's are the original version as my husband is using the M50X's right now to "survive" grinding crafting in Final Fantasy XIV:ARR lol.... Going to try and quickly listen to a few different genres of music. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Info on system: CD played back via el cheapo LG 22X DVD-RW. Don't remember the model number, but it's from several years ago.... Audio Interface is a Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 using stock out of the box settings (I've never played around with the control panel for anything other than firmware updates). M50's were on the first headphone jack, K712's on the second, and volume was matched (poorly) by ear. I also found out during this that the headphone outputs aren't infinity cut when fully counter clockwise and a small amount of signal makes it through. K712's were typically around between 10:30 and 11 for volume, and M50's were 9-9:30 depending on the song. There's also some sort of rackmount power filtering going on with my setup, but it's a low end one (aha! ART PB4x4Pro if I remember correctly)

- Five Iron Frenzy's "One Girl Army" (Quantity is Job 1) definitely goes to the AKG K712's. FIF is something resembling ska so I was told ages ago. Trumpets just don't sound right on the M50's, and the vocals are lacking substance.
- Five Iron Frenzy's "Get your Riot Gear" (Quantity is Job 1) is just too boomy with the M50's, especially once the electric guitars come in at 1:30. K712's definitely sound a lot more balanced in comparison.
- Thousand Foot Krutch "Phenomenon" (Phenomenon) on the M50's kind of reminds me of when I saw them live... If the audio engineer was drunk and my head was in a fish bowl or something because man is the bass muddy once everything comes into play around 0:35. At the same time, while there's a much better sound stage on the K712's, it doesn't quite have that "live in a small theater where you had to cover your eyes because the lights under the drum kit were stupidly bright and the mosh pit sheared the bolts off of three rows of seating" feeling.
- Thousand Foot Krutch "Step to Me" (Phenomenon) doesn't sound too bad on the K712's, but once again suffers the same wide soundstage but missing a bit of life feeling.
- Thousand Foot Krutch "Last Words" (Phenomenon) is a mixed bag. Love the punch the kick drum has in the M50's, but vocals are much clearer on the K712's.
- Thousand Foot Krutch "Rawkfist" (Phenomenon) has me leaning slightly more towards the M50's even if the guitars are overwhelming certain parts at times. K712's once again have cleaner lyrics, but there's still that slight feeling that a bit of life is missing from the guitars.
- I'll just say that yup, TFK's Phenomenon is my favourite album for rock, and probably the one I've listened to the most over the years, although Set It Off (the second version - not purple and pink bomb version, and not the 2004 re-release) is definitely a close second.

Okay, so those were some of my favourites, let's try something I tend to pretty much always wind up chilling out to when I put it on, Burial's 2nd album, Untrue.
- "Archangel" is a tough call for me to decide which pair I prefer, but I'll give the edge to the K712's simply because it's a LOT more immersive to me due to the feel of a much wider soundstage plus the lack of an over-exaggerated kick drum.
- "Ghost hardware" I again prefer the K712's even if the M50's have a harder hitting (but sadly slightly muddy) bass, simply because everything's clearer

This is probably going to hurt, but it's something I used to listen to a lot and still enjoy their older stuff... Linkin Park's "Hybrid Theory"
- I'll just say this. Papercut, One Step Closer, Points of Authority, Crawling, and In The End all could benefit from something that is like the weird child of the K712's and the M50's. Wasn't enough bass on the K712's, and there was too much muddy bass with the M50's.

Okay, that last one dancing between the two headphones made it so I could barely even listen to any of the songs... Onto a different album, Project 86's "Songs to Burn Your Bridges By"
- "Spy Hunter". I need to say this, like I always do - demo version was better than what was on this album due to having more life. Anyways, most of the time this is my favourite song by Project 86...... M50's are nice and in your face, but there's so much more life in the K712's due to soundstage. At 2:46, when they shout out "we don't need no truthless heroes" with the M50's it feels literally right in your face, yet with the K712's it actually feels like they're a few feet away (like in the music video)

Huh.... For fun let's try Rammstein's "Sehnsucht", even if I'm not really a fan of their music anymore (especially after $150 nose bleed tickets when they visited Edmonton!!! No I didn't go, took one look at price and went NOPE!)
- "Engel" I... I....Man it's hard to decide, because of the simple fact that the differences in how the two pairs of headphones were designed and tuned, but I can say this: it literally feels like the M50's response was designed for this song. Sure, the soundstage is larger on the K712, and the female vocals are clearer, but the distortion in the guitars sounds like it "should" to me, and man do the guitars take front and center without detracting on the M50's. M50's definitely have a punchier bass.
- "Du Hast" because why not. In all honesty, I prefer neither of my headphones. K712's wider and more open sound with a bit more warmth, slightly moderately punchier bass would be awesome. M50's almost sound like they're coming out of a tin can in some regards (aka there's just no imaging it seems), and the K712's are too clinical and cold.

Last album since I'm getting too tired - KMFDM Attak
- "Attak/Reload".... M50's guitars are just too muddy compared to the K712's
- "Skurk".... Love just how open and wide the K712's feel with their sound, but it still has that slightly..... clinical, dry, or... "cold" kind of feel to the music compared to my M50's.
- "Dirty".... Don't know if this is me being too darn tired or not, but man do I like this song on the K712's for some reason, and just wish there was more of a punch to the bass.


tl;dr version: I want something that will find a common ground between my K712's and M50's - a wide soundstage that's still natural, but has more bass while retaining something resembling an even response across the various frequencies. Clarity of vocals and lack of extra distortion added into instruments is definitely paramount to me. Also, for comfort.... K712's are lovely on my ears (M50's kind of tug on the back on my ears after a while making them blatantly noticeable), but man the M50's are comfier for the top of my head, especailly the M50X's. Headband of my K712's likes to dig into my skull if I don't get it just right on the top of my head.

Also, volume knob being a "lean over and it's still a full arm's reach away" distance is annoying when trying to listen closely to get an idea of what one actually likes in a headphone.

Now I'm really wondering as to which of the two versions I would prefer for the MrSpeakers Ethers, but I still have a few moons to decide this as I'll be saving up for a reasonably high end setup (I'm still thinking Violectric V281+V850, but I'll be doing plenty of research on various other options out there too). I do know that I want to spend less than $5k USD on the whole setup overall (headphones, DAC, and amp), and doubly so because hubby will get an equivalent setup (whatever headphones he wants, alongside a V220+V850 combination or equivalent). With gear, all I know so far is that for a DAC I want solid state so I can leave it on 24/7 (because I have a bad habit of forgetting to turn things off)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rathborne View Post

@WhiteWulfe, I should probably give Combichrist or Grendel a try on the HD650s as I haven't done that yet, been too busy listening to deep house on them smile.gif .

I'm beyond curious as to what you find with such a setup, especially the albums "Today We Are All Demons" and the album that I can't write half the title of "What (blankitty blank) is wrong with you people?", and as for Grendel "Harsh Generation" is the album I'm curious about as it's the one I'm somewhat familiar with (haven't listened to Grendel too too much)

I really do want to give the HD 600's a shot at some point, and I know a local store that always has like three pairs in, and provided I'm willing to buy (or add to my financing account) they don't mind letting me try them out.
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JDS Labs O2 + ODAC Rev.B AKG K712 Audio Technica ATH-M50X 
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i7 3770k Maximus V Formula EVGA GTX 780 Classified Corsair Dominator Platinum 1866MHz 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Kingston 64GB SSDnow 200 CoolerMaster MasterLiquid Pro 240 Windows 7 64 Bit Dell E2213H 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G15 v2 EVGA 1000w G2 Open Bench Table Corsair M95 
Mouse Pad
3' wide battle mat 
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JägerWulfe
(19 items)
 
 
Gigadestroyer
(13 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i7-4770K Gigabyte Z87X-OC MSI GTX 980 Ti Gaming 6G Golden Edition G.Skill Triden-X 16GB DDR3-2400 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Seagate 2TB SATA3 Maxtor 2TB Black LG DVD-RW Cryorig R1 ultimate 
OSMonitorMonitorKeyboard
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit BenQ VP2210 BenQ VP2210 Razer BlackWidow Ultimate 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
EVGA SuperNova 1000G2 NZXT Phantom 820 Black Roccat Nyth Steel Series Worgen 
AudioAudioAudio
JDS Labs O2 + ODAC Rev.B AKG K712 Audio Technica ATH-M50X 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 3770k Maximus V Formula EVGA GTX 780 Classified Corsair Dominator Platinum 1866MHz 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Kingston 64GB SSDnow 200 CoolerMaster MasterLiquid Pro 240 Windows 7 64 Bit Dell E2213H 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech G15 v2 EVGA 1000w G2 Open Bench Table Corsair M95 
Mouse Pad
3' wide battle mat 
  hide details  
Reply
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