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Club for those with beastly mATX/ITX rigs. - Page 298

post #2971 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by friend'scatdied View Post

It will be able to use it, speaking virtually.
The front panel audio/mic isn't the issue. The power and reset switches are.
I've only seen one such SLI system on such an mATX board (the MSI Z68MA-G45-B3) and that was on a test bench, with no front panel connectors hooked up. It works (i.e. the whole dual-GPU SLI part of it with the bottom card), but don't expect to be able to turn the thing on/off/reset when it's inside a case.

The power and reset switch cables would be fine, they are cables, they bend. I had to do it in a setup prior to what I have now. Its really easy, plug in power/reset/hdd led/pwr led, then put the card in. Yeah the cables will bend but who cares. Its a perfectly viable setup and doesnt cause any issues.
 
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post #2972 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek1387 View Post

Then you havent heard a real sound card.

This.
     
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post #2973 of 13202
I put a dual slot card in a 2 slot board that came in my Acer AX1800. The board is upside down with the slots on top and there is a PCIe 1x closest to the CPU with a TV tuner in it, then the PCIe 16x with a 5670 in it and I cut a rectangle out of the top of the case for the graphics card heat sink lol.

The graphics card covered up the front panel power/reset buttons as well as the USB so I just soldered the front panel wires directly to the pins biggrin.gif Same with the USB.
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post #2974 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagle3092 View Post

The power and reset switch cables would be fine, they are cables, they bend. I had to do it in a setup prior to what I have now. Its really easy, plug in power/reset/hdd led/pwr led, then put the card in. Yeah the cables will bend but who cares. Its a perfectly viable setup and doesnt cause any issues.

Perhaps it depends on the card you have. Traditional coolers like the reference designs will almost certainly not work without bending the pins since the shroud covers the PCB and cooler pretty exactly. Most aftermarket coolers including the Asus DirectCU II 2-slot design (i.e. the one on their GTX 560s and 6870s) might not permit enough space to those cables without discomfort/stress onto the cables or pins.

If you pause this video somewhere appropriately (0:30 is most clear) and look at this card, it appears that certain cards like the vanilla Twin Frozr permit relatively comfortable connection of the front panel headers thanks to a very open shroud design. The clearance from the card to the header pins seems to be sufficient, even though the front panel headers themselves actually aren't connected.

Compare to something like this or this which have very obtrusive shroud designs. It might be possible if you just removed the shroud on the cards altogether.

Nonetheless, wouldn't you agree that fan controllers or miscellaneous peripherals would be a much more reliable reason to desire a 5-slot mATX case? Dual-GPU enthusiasts can just go with a 6990/7990 and something like this or, less optimally, two of these (or HIS's 7-series equivalent). At least with the Accelero setup you'd still be able to use your 4th card.

Or you could get creative like above ^.
Edited by friend'scatdied - 1/26/12 at 6:35am
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post #2975 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by friend'scatdied View Post
Nonetheless, wouldn't you agree that fan controllers or miscellaneous peripherals would be a much more reliable reason to desire a 5-slot mATX case? Dual-GPU enthusiasts can just go with a 6990/7990 and something like this or, less optimally, two of these (or HIS's 7-series equivalent). At least with the Accelero setup you'd still be able to use your 4th card.


Absolutely not. That is why we keep hounding you about sound cards and other such expansion cards. The concept of wanting two graphics cards with a sound card between them is not a novel concept. People do it all the time. And wanting in the smallest package is also no very new, thus the reason for multiple platforms ranging from "Awww, It's so cute" to "Blind Baby makers"

 

Having the extra slot room between the two GPUS is a whole heck of a lot better for the cards then a cheap single channel fan controller that your card can't utilize and then starve for air, run hotter on average and then have to do one of two things, rev the crap out of the fan driving anyone in ear shot absolutely mental or throttle the card which kinda kills the reason for having the card in the first place.

 

 

We get it you think the idea is as crazy as mixing water and computers.  But that doesn't mean you have repeatedly cram your opinions down our throats. With proper trial and error and innovation this could be the next big wave  in computers. How do you think water cooling started? Someone some where had a hair brained scheme and look at it now, it is a full on epidemic.

 

Ok I'll end my rant now.

post #2976 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by animal0307 View Post



Absolutely not. That is why we keep hounding you about sound cards and other such expansion cards. The concept of wanting two graphics cards with a sound card between them is not a novel concept. People do it all the time. And wanting in the smallest package is also no very new, thus the reason for multiple platforms ranging from "Awww, It's so cute" to "Blind Baby makers"

Having the extra slot room between the two GPUS is a whole heck of a lot better for the cards then a cheap single channel fan controller that your card can't utilize and then starve for air, run hotter on average and then have to do one of two things, rev the crap out of the fan driving anyone in ear shot absolutely mental or throttle the card which kinda kills the reason for having the card in the first place.


We get it you think the idea is as crazy as mixing water and computers.  But that doesn't mean you have repeatedly cram your opinions down our throats. With proper trial and error and innovation this could be the next big wave  in computers. How do you think water cooling started? Someone some where had a hair brained scheme and look at it now, it is a full on epidemic.

I didn't say "superior." Trust me, I'm all for better audio, and I don't think the idea is crazy. But with current motherboard designs it is not ready yet. Hence why peripherals are a more reliable (not superior) use of that 5th slot.

You can bend your motherboard pins or solder that power on pin and whatnot to get it working, but it's probably better to wait for mATX motherboards with a more optimized location for the power-on header. When will these come to fruition? It's difficult to say, if ever.

Until someone chimes in saying they've successfully done such a setup without resorting to questionable modifications, I'll stand by the validity of my argument. That argument is simply that a 1st slot + 4th slot dual-slot air-cooled multi-GPU setup is the flimsiest reason for a 5-slot mATX case right now and for the near future.

There are already a couple of options here -- go for a dual-GPU single-slot card with an aftermarket cooler or just get a Define Mini (or similar mATX case) and go for some watercooling fun. I don't think a 6990 (and 7990 later on) + Accelero setup or full-on mATX WC would be anything to scoff at. The former is air-cooled and would permit that sound card, while a watercooled setup would permit an additional expansion card. Or you could get an outboard sound setup.

My argument is not against 5-slot mATX cases. I have no grudges on the Dragon Slayer aside from aesthetics. If a manufacturer can pull off a 5-slot mATX case that isn't much bigger (if bigger at all) than a 4-slot mATX case, more power to them.

EDIT: Also, that middle paragraph is needlessly hyperbolic and I'd mirror that argument back to you with regards to the middle sound card and the top video card. Even moreso considering sound cards actually plug into the motherboard and actually have an obstructive PCB (unlike a cheap single-channel fan controller) that will certainly affect airflow. Seriously?
Edited by friend'scatdied - 1/26/12 at 3:57pm
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post #2977 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by friend'scatdied View Post

I didn't say "superior." Trust me, I'm all for better audio, and I don't think the idea is crazy. But with current motherboard designs it is not ready yet. Hence why peripherals are a more reliable (not superior) use of that 5th slot.
You can bend your motherboard pins or solder that power on pin and void your warranties and whatnot to get it working, but it's probably better to wait for mATX motherboards with a more optimized location for the power-on header. When will these come to fruition? It's difficult to say, if ever.
Until someone chimes in saying they've successfully done such a setup without resorting to questionable modifications, I'll stand by the validity of my argument. That argument is simply that a 1st slot + 4th slot dual-slot air-cooled multi-GPU setup is the flimsiest reason for a 5-slot mATX case right now and for the near future.
There are already a couple of options here -- go for a dual-GPU single-slot card with an aftermarket cooler or just get a Define Mini (or similar mATX case) and go for some watercooling fun. I don't think a 6990 (and 7990 later on) + Accelero setup or full-on mATX WC would be anything to scoff at. The former is air-cooled and would permit that sound card, while a watercooled setup would permit an additional expansion card.
My argument is not against 5-slot mATX cases. I have no grudges on the Dragon Slayer aside from aesthetics. If a manufacturer can pull off a 5-slot mATX case that isn't much bigger (if bigger at all) than a 4-slot mATX case, more power to them. But 1 + 4 SLI/CFX is still ridiculous with current motherboard layouts.
EDIT: Also, that middle paragraph is needlessly hyperbolic and I'd mirror that argument back to you with regards to the middle sound card and the top card.

i donno. sounds like the chicken or the egg argument here. mobo designers are waiting for case designers to build the case while the case designers are waiting for the mobo designers to build the board... eventually people like inwin will build the case, and eventually asus will realize the demand and redesign the gene-z to accommodate that 5th slot as long as demand persist. who knows, silverstone or corsair might jump in because they see the demand for high performance SFF case while gigabyte and asrock might also join the game from the board side. the point is. evolution of computer standard is demand driven. the more people want high performance parts, the more manufactures will design them accordingly. after all, we'd all still be using VESA local bus if that wasn't the case:D

don't let your own myopia blind yourself to the possibilities of the future. currently there is a 300w limit for PCIe slot for GPU's. but nvidia is already building cards that use closer to 400w if you allow it:D the demand for performance will rewrite the rule book. 15 years ago, i would have laughed in your face if you told me that GPU's would use twice as much power as CPU's, but I'm glad i was wrong:)
post #2978 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek1387 View Post

Then you havent heard a real sound card.

Define "real" soundcard.
    
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post #2979 of 13202
not the sub $30 sound cards. Ones that actually perform.

And...

re·al1    [ree-uhl, reel] Show IPA
adjective
1.
true; not merely ostensible, nominal, or apparent: the real reason for an act.
2.
existing or occurring as fact; actual rather than imaginary, ideal, or fictitious: a story taken from real life.
3.
being an actual thing; having objective existence; not imaginary: The events you will see in the film are real and not just made up.
4.
being actually such; not merely so-called: a real victory.
5.
genuine; not counterfeit, artificial, or imitation; authentic: a real antique; a real diamond; real silk.
post #2980 of 13202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek1387 View Post

not the sub $30 sound cards. Ones that actually perform.
And...
re·al1    [ree-uhl, reel] Show IPA
adjective
1.
true; not merely ostensible, nominal, or apparent: the real reason for an act.
2.
existing or occurring as fact; actual rather than imaginary, ideal, or fictitious: a story taken from real life.
3.
being an actual thing; having objective existence; not imaginary: The events you will see in the film are real and not just made up.
4.
being actually such; not merely so-called: a real victory.
5.
genuine; not counterfeit, artificial, or imitation; authentic: a real antique; a real diamond; real silk.




"HD" on board audio is nothing more than on board audio. I was a firm believer on sound cards being pointless. Then i bought a X-Fi Ti.... and game play and audio in general became 100x better. Its like going from stock audio in a car to aftermarket....

if you dont believe that there is a difference.......
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