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[Official] Corsair Obsidian 900D/800D/750D/700D/650D/550D/450D/350D/250D Club - Page 698

post #6971 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by riesscar View Post

Firstly, I just wanted to give a preliminary result regarding the drilling if plexiglass discussed above. Although I have yet to receive me coldzero midplate, I just so happened to have a 3mm thick piece of plexi laying in my shed (what luck!). I decided to see if the dremel alone could cut out the 3/8!inch holes that I'll need for my passthroughs, and I was able to drill them with no problem. I just went slow and stopped every 30sec or so to ensure the plexi didn't melt. Now, I am not familiar with acrylic manufacturing, so it could be that the coldzero 3mm plexi has a different composition and propensity to crack, but my preliminary testing was successful. I used the circular carving/engraving bit that came with the dremel.

I also just saw this comment and wanted to weigh in:



I own 8 SP120's and 4pwm noctua's. While the SP120's do have drawbacks, they push some serious air. It is not their performance that is the problem... it is their sound and -- to a lesser degree -- their bizarre pwm signal issues (assuming you have the pwm version). The SP120's give off a slight whining, which gets louder with rpm increases. So much so that running them at full speed is insufferable. The pwm signal is an issue I came across trying to control them with a swiftech 8-way SATA powered pwm splitter. It seems that the pwm signal required to control SP120's needs an amp when controlling more than 5 fans on a splitter, even if powered by an auxiliary connector. So, while there are issues with SP's, the statement "I would go with better fans than the 120's" only makes sense in reference to noise and pwm issues, not performance.

- Carson

I agree, the SP120 push a good amount of air through whatever rad you put them on. Performance is great, but they have an annoying pitch.
post #6972 of 8657





sp af corsair!!
750D
http://imgur.com/a/fJQhv
post #6973 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by riesscar View Post

Firstly, I just wanted to give a preliminary result regarding the drilling if plexiglass discussed above. Although I have yet to receive me coldzero midplate, I just so happened to have a 3mm thick piece of plexi laying in my shed (what luck!). I decided to see if the dremel alone could cut out the 3/8!inch holes that I'll need for my passthroughs, and I was able to drill them with no problem. I just went slow and stopped every 30sec or so to ensure the plexi didn't melt. Now, I am not familiar with acrylic manufacturing, so it could be that the coldzero 3mm plexi has a different composition and propensity to crack, but my preliminary testing was successful. I used the circular carving/engraving bit that came with the dremel.

I also just saw this comment and wanted to weigh in:

Originally Posted by LaBestiaHumana

If it does it will be a minimal difference. I also game with a headset and at first the noise doesn't bother you, but after a while it does start to get on your nerves.

Push pull is fine, but I would at least go with better fans than the SP120.

I have 4 SP120 hi performance laying around. Might put them on the market place soon.

I own 8 SP120's and 4pwm noctua's. While the SP120's do have drawbacks, they push some serious air. It is not their performance that is the problem... it is their sound and -- to a lesser degree -- their bizarre pwm signal issues (assuming you have the pwm version). The SP120's give off a slight whining, which gets louder with rpm increases. So much so that running them at full speed is insufferable. The pwm signal is an issue I came across trying to control them with a swiftech 8-way SATA powered pwm splitter. It seems that the pwm signal required to control SP120's needs an amp when controlling more than 5 fans on a splitter, even if powered by an auxiliary connector. So, while there are issues with SP's, the statement "I would go with better fans than the 120's" only makes sense in reference to noise and pwm issues, not performance.

- Carson


I have the same setup, just more fans. I'm running 16 sp120's off two swiftech 8 way sata powered splitters. Could you go into a little more detail about this pwm issue? I have been wondering about these fans for the last little while, I can run them full blast and I barley feel any airflow out of my rads.
post #6974 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by eliteone View Post

I have the same setup, just more fans. I'm running 16 sp120's off two swiftech 8 way sata powered splitters. Could you go into a little more detail about this pwm issue? I have been wondering about these fans for the last little while, I can run them full blast and I barley feel any airflow out of my rads.

The pwm issue about which I was referring would not explain poor cooling performance. How much air you feel coming through your rad depends upon the fin density and thickness of it. More importantly, feeling for airflow with your hand is not a good way to judge the cooling performance of your rad fans. What are your thermals like? What are the specs of your build? Is it overclocked? You'll need to give some more details for me to weigh in on your fans performance. Are they pwm versions of the SP's (i.e. four pin fans)? If so, are you able to control their speed? If they are not 4-pin fans, then the pwm issue is irrelevant.

If you do have pwm fans, I'll do my best to explain the SP pwm issue (as far as I understand it):

PWM controlled fans are speed modulated differently than regular three pin fans. Three pin fan RPM's are controlled by adjusting the voltage sent to the fans, while pwm fan speed is altered via the fourth wire/pin (usually blue). This is not to say that pwm fans cannot be controlled via voltage modification (although I have read that this is bad for the motor), but it means that pwm fans -- when controlled by a pwm capable device (i.e. your MB CPU header) -- will receive a constant 12 volts, and that rpm modulation is accomplished using a special signal via the aforementioned fourth wire.

Now, MB fan headers are usually limited to 1 amp, so you cannot just split 8 12 volt fans and expect the board to supply sufficient voltage... if you do this you will either have all 8 running at less than full speed or else some may be running full while others not at all. This is where the swiftech 8-way splitter comes in. By supplying the fans with power via a SATA connector you don't run into voltage insufficiency issues. So, you should be able to run all 8 pwm fans on the splitter and control their rpm's. The key word there is 'should'. Corsair SP120's (according to swiftech) seem to have a need for a stronger pwm signal when you connect multiple fans. So, while the voltage is adequate, a pwm amp is apparently needed to control their speed... this is a problem because I have never heard of a pwm amp outside of DIY ones built be those with the know-how. It seems that the max # of SP's that can be connected to the 8-way swiftech splitter is 5 or 6 (5 in my case). With 8 running on one splitter, their speed cannot be controlled: it's either full speed or off. My solution was to buy a second swiftech splitter and connect four to each; however, I have an aquacomputer aquaero 6 pro with multiple pwm capable fan headers (most MB's have only one, and that is the cpu header). Evidence that the issue lies with the Corsair fan pwm signal is provided by the fact that I can connect 8 pwm fans to the splitter and control their speed as long as all 8 are not SP's (in my case I connected 4 SP's and 4 Noctuas).

I would also like to mention that pwm functionality on a watercooled system is only useful if the fan curve is based upon the temperature of the water -- not the temperature of the cpu. So, if you want to vary your fan speed according to thermals in the interest of noise reduction, you need to get an inline liquid temperature sensor and connect those pwm fans to a fan controller capable of creating a fan speed curve based upon the water temperature. The reason for this is intuitive: in a watercooled system, the fans do not cool components directly; rather, they cool the rad fins which in turn allow for heat dissipation of the water. So, running pwm fans on a fan curve based upon the heat of a component as reported by your MB is not a good idea.

One last disclaimer: everything that I just wrote is to the best of my knowledge. I have only been doing custom water cooling and extreme rig building for a year or so. I therefore cannot claim to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination. I ran into issues and am pretty much regurgitating the info I received. I like to think that I understand the issue that I explained, but if I am mistaken I hope that someone with more knowledge will correct me.

-Carson
  
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post #6975 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by riesscar View Post



Now, MB fan headers are usually limited to 1 amp, so you cannot just split 8 12 volt fans and expect the board to supply sufficient voltage... if you do this you will either have all 8 running at less than full speed or else some may be running full while others not at all. This is where the swiftech 8-way splitter comes in. By supplying the fans with power via a SATA connector you don't run into voltage insufficiency issues. So, you should be able to run all 8 pwm fans on the splitter and control their rpm's. The key word there is 'should'. Corsair SP120's (according to swiftech) seem to have a need for a stronger pwm signal when you connect multiple fans. So, while the voltage is adequate, a pwm amp is apparently needed to control their speed... this is a problem because I have never heard of a pwm amp outside of DIY ones built be those with the know-how. It seems that the max # of SP's that can be connected to the 8-way swiftech splitter is 5 or 6 (5 in my case). With 8 running on one splitter, their speed cannot be controlled: it's either full speed or off. My solution was to buy a second swiftech splitter and connect four to each; however, I have an aquacomputer aquaero 6 pro with multiple pwm capable fan headers (most MB's have only one, and that is the cpu header). Evidence that the issue lies with the Corsair fan pwm signal is provided by the fact that I can connect 8 pwm fans to the splitter and control their speed as long as all 8 are not SP's (in my case I connected 4 SP's and 4 Noctuas).

I would also like to mention that pwm functionality on a watercooled system is only useful if the fan curve is based upon the temperature of the water -- not the temperature of the cpu. So, if you want to vary your fan speed according to thermals in the interest of noise reduction, you need to get an inline liquid temperature sensor and connect those pwm fans to a fan controller capable of creating a fan speed curve based upon the water temperature. The reason for this is intuitive: in a watercooled system, the fans do not cool components directly; rather, they cool the rad fins which in turn allow for heat dissipation of the water. So, running pwm fans on a fan curve based upon the heat of a component as reported by your MB is not a good idea.

One last disclaimer: everything that I just wrote is to the best of my knowledge. I have only been doing custom water cooling and extreme rig building for a year or so. I therefore cannot claim to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination. I ran into issues and am pretty much regurgitating the info I received. I like to think that I understand the issue that I explained, but if I am mistaken I hope that someone with more knowledge will correct me.

-Carson
Wow! what a great explanation thanks. I'm running two 480 60mm thick rads in push pull, and a 30mm thick 240 in push. My temps actually seem great, idling on an overclocked 4770k at around 32c and my two 780ti classys idle at the low 30's as well. Gaming temps for my gpu's usually top out around 45c-ish after a few hours and burn tests on my cpu dont go much over 60c.This is My first watercooling build, so I'm still getting used to the differences in airflow, I'm used to air rushing in and out of my case at the noise level of a jet engine. I can put a piece of paper on top of my rads and have it blow off at 800rpm so I suppose thats more than sufficient. I'm still waiting on my water temp probe to arrive, but in the meantime I've taped a thermal probe to the end tank of one of my 480's with a little thermal paste underneath. Probably not the most accurate But it's reading 5c delta. I think I just need to chill out and enjoy my new rig.

Thanks a bunch for the explanation, thats why I love this forum so much.
post #6976 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by eliteone View Post

Wow! what a great explanation thanks. I'm running two 480 60mm thick rads in push pull, and a 30mm thick 240 in push. My temps actually seem great, idling on an overclocked 4770k at around 32c and my two 780ti classys idle at the low 30's as well. Gaming temps for my gpu's usually top out around 45c-ish after a few hours and burn tests on my cpu dont go much over 60c.This is My first watercooling build, so I'm still getting used to the differences in airflow, I'm used to air rushing in and out of my case at the noise level of a jet engine. I can put a piece of paper on top of my rads and have it blow off at 800rpm so I suppose thats more than sufficient. I'm still waiting on my water temp probe to arrive, but in the meantime I've taped a thermal probe to the end tank of one of my 480's with a little thermal paste underneath. Probably not the most accurate But it's reading 5c delta. I think I just need to chill out and enjoy my new rig.

Thanks a bunch for the explanation, thats why I love this forum so much.

No prob... if it wasn't for these forums I'd be lost, so it's a true pleasure to give back smile.gif.
  
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post #6977 of 8657
Skimmed a bit but any 450D mods out yet?
post #6978 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBloodEagle View Post

Skimmed a bit but any 450D mods out yet?

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=127547 : General:
post #6979 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chomuco View Post

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=127547 : General:

So nice!



Well, finally decided then. I'm not going to switch out for an NZXT 440 and instead it'll be either the 350D or 450D. So inspired by these:

1. http://imgur.com/a/32cDo

2. http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/scorpion-gaming-desktop.187054/


Just going to mod it to hold 3 front fans. smile.gifsmile.gif
post #6980 of 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBloodEagle View Post

Skimmed a bit but any 450D mods out yet?

1* nice http://www.corsair.com/en-us/blog/2014/march/water-cooling%20with%20the%20obsidian%20450d
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