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post #241 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by magic-man View Post
If you don't see it, it is good. I have both boxes off for write caching, since my Vertex LE (Sandforce) does not have a built-in hardware cache (which is what this setting does).
Okay, thanks a lot for that magic-man. I wanted to know if you could tell me if my SSD is performing as it should. Here's the link to my post with the benchmark:

http://www.overclock.net/11775514-post910.html
 
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post #242 of 637
Quote:
it MAY or MAY NOT support trim
Excuse me here. I have been out of the thread for a while, some unpleasantries to deal with an all that.

I am just curious. As some of you know I own two 80 Gig. Intel X25 SSD's which of course support TRIM natively. Am I wrong to question, then, why anyone nowadays would fool around with SSD's that don't support TRIM?

Question for the Indisputable SSD Champ (that would of course be the redoubtable Magic-Man): Do you still have plans for an upgrade to your guide? Or have I missed it somewhere?

Personally in life I try to follow the 80/20 rule, i.e. it requires the same unit of work to complete or polish the remaining 20% of task-perfection that it required to complete the first 80%. Hard rule to follow with my OCD, but I try.

Translation: M-M, I don't think you owe us any more work to render perfect the remaining 5%. Let's leave that little posse of unknowns for the user to figure out on his own. Just one guy's opinion.
Edited by incurablegeek - 12/26/10 at 2:04pm
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post #243 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by incurablegeek View Post
Excuse me here. I have been out of the thread for a while, some unpleasantries to deal with an all that.

I am just curious. As some of you know I own two 80 Gig. Intel X25 SSD's which of course support TRIM natively. Am I wrong to question, then, why anyone nowadays would fool around with SSD's that don't support TRIM?

Question for the Indisputable SSD Champ (that would of course be the redoubtable Magic-Man): Do you still have plans for an upgrade to your guide? Or have I missed it somewhere?

Personally in life I try to follow the 80/20 rule, i.e. it requires the same unit of work to complete or polish the remaining 20% of task-perfection that it required to complete the first 80%. Hard rule to follow with my OCD, but I try.

Translation: M-M, I don't think you owe us any more work to render perfect the remaining 5%. Let's leave that little posse of unknowns for the user to figure out on his own. Just one guy's opinion.
His post is in reference to Intel's Matrix Storage Manager (typically version 8.9) which only works on Intel platforms. So, Intel's Matrix Storage Manager driver may or may not support TRIM. However, I recently learned that it doesn't and that Intel's version 9.6 (which was given the name "Rapid Storage Technology") is where proper TRIM support begins.

But now with an AMD platform, I am absolutely clueless about how to ensure that TRIM is working properly. I don't know if there's a driver just like there is with Intel's RST or what. I suppose there probably is since Intel has one, but I can't say for sure as I haven't become interested in it.

So, we're not talking about SSDs that may or may not support TRIM, but instead it's about the driver as it pertains to Intel platforms.
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post #244 of 637
Quote:
I don't know if there's a driver just like there is with Intel's RST
RST drivers as an alternative to AHCI?

My understanding as I have not sought to know more (obviously) than I need is that the newer SSD's support TRIM out of the box and Win 7 makes that even easier (yes, I know the ways, but wanted to be synoptic)

In short, I have an Intel X25M SSD.

1) Do I need to complicate my setup by involving RST drivers, which my reading say adds little or no benefit over AHCI?

2) Why would any mfr. of SSD's release a product specific to Intel boards only?

I apologize in advance for the ignorance of my questions. (If you guys are talking RAID specific applications of SSD's, please disregard my questions. RAID is of no interest to me.)
Edited by incurablegeek - 12/26/10 at 7:01pm
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post #245 of 637
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by incurablegeek View Post
Excuse me here. I have been out of the thread for a while, some unpleasantries to deal with an all that.

I am just curious. As some of you know I own two 80 Gig. Intel X25 SSD's which of course support TRIM natively. Am I wrong to question, then, why anyone nowadays would fool around with SSD's that don't support TRIM?

Question for the Indisputable SSD Champ (that would of course be the redoubtable Magic-Man): Do you still have plans for an upgrade to your guide? Or have I missed it somewhere?

Personally in life I try to follow the 80/20 rule, i.e. it requires the same unit of work to complete or polish the remaining 20% of task-perfection that it required to complete the first 80%. Hard rule to follow with my OCD, but I try.

Translation: M-M, I don't think you owe us any more work to render perfect the remaining 5%. Let's leave that little posse of unknowns for the user to figure out on his own. Just one guy's opinion.
The only reason I could figure for getting a drive without trim would be not knowing any better OR be on the mistaken idea that MS will support XP forever...

The updated guide will be soon.... Had some stuff to do first. Lung burst and had to get fixed... All fixed now. Still comming up with more stuff to put in and other stuff that can be removed, since some of it returns too little for the trouble. Gotta have a big bang for the free buck!

The main question / quandry is simple:
Should I edit the original messages (tutorial) or put up a whole new one and ask the powers to be to sticky it and remove the old one???
Edited by magic-man - 12/26/10 at 7:57pm
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post #246 of 637
Quote:
The only reason I could figure for getting a drive without trim would be not knowing any better OR be on the mistaken idea that MS will support XP forever...
OMG, MM, thanks for restoring some sanity to my world. SSD's and XP? Why not MFM hard drives and CPM? (some homework for the younger ones)

Sorry for the sarcasm. I was just so worried that there was a huge gap in my knowledge after printing, reading and rereading everything in the tutorial.

Magic-Man, we sure all wish you the speediest recovery. A lung collapse is scary to even imagine, much less experience I'm sure. Get well soon.

You Are, after all, Indispensable!


Quote:
The main question / quandry is simple:
Should I edit the original messages (tutorial) or put up a whole new one and ask the powers to be to sticky it and remove the old one???
Why not save yourself some time and simply edit (in red possibly) the topics you wish to amend or expand upon? Last time I checked, none of us has done more than just sing your praises; Sometime you need to get paid!
Edited by incurablegeek - 12/26/10 at 8:27pm
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post #247 of 637
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by incurablegeek View Post
RST drivers as an alternative to AHCI?

My understanding as I have not sought to know more (obviously) than I need is that the newer SSD's support TRIM out of the box and Win 7 makes that even easier (yes, I know the ways, but wanted to be synoptic)

In short, I have an Intel X25M SSD.

1) Do I need to complicate my setup by involving RST drivers, which my reading say adds little or no benefit over AHCI?

2) Why would any mfr. of SSD's release a product specific to Intel boards only?

I apologize in advance for the ignorance of my questions. (If you guys are talking RAID specific applications of SSD's, please disregard my questions. RAID is of no interest to me.)
No ignorance is assumed... We are here to help each other and learn ourselves while doing so... That said, lets answer your questions....
AHCI is an interface protocol, not a driver... The drivers and SSDs use this protocol to talk. AHCI is faster by nature than IDE.
1) RST drivers are only used IF you have an INTEL chipset for your SATA controller. Since you have an AMD processor board, I doubt you are using an intel chipset, but I could be wrong. In your case, I would use the microsoft drivers. They work just fine and DO pass TRIM commands to the SSD. In the real world, there is no real speed differance... We at OCN just like to get every ounce we can get!
2) They are specific to the AHCI protocol (interface)... Not specific to Intel, AMD, Etc. Intel is a big company that makes a LOT of chipsets (really cheap, too). It is up to the maker of your motherboard to choose Intel, AMD, or others.

Here is the bottom line.. Most will be extremely pleased with the speed of their SSD if they simply do the following:
1: Install the SSD
2: Install Windows 7.
3: Have fun and don't worry about what 'others' are getting in the synthetic bench-marks.
4: Go out in the sun once in a while and enjoy it while you can! (We get so little of it here)
5: When you have FINALLY gotten used to the speed (so it 'appears' slow to you), THEN start tweaking the stuff for a little more speed.


Edited by magic-man - 12/27/10 at 12:19am
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post #248 of 637
Having an AMD processor means that the chipset can either be AMD or NVIDIA, but not Intel.

But to make matters more confusing: having an Intel CPU means that you can have an Intel or NVIDIA chipset, but not AMD. This is because NVIDIA does both.
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post #249 of 637
Magic-Man and TwoCables, thank you both so much for the clarification and also from bringing me back from the brink which is where I seem to be camped out recently. Both M-M and TC have very precise minds and are truly assets to OCN. I PM poor TwoCables silly with questions - AND he always takes time to answer them as lucidly and completely as he can. You guys are a National Treasure.

1) Yeh, I know what AHCI is. What I did not know was what role RST drivers played in conjunction or as some form of alternative to AHCI. Ugh! So by becoming confused and then posting my confusion, I have just received an education in the arcane.

2)
Quote:
Here is the bottom line.. Most will be extremely pleased with the speed of their SSD if they simply do the following:
1: Install the SSD
2: Install Windows 7.
3: Have fun and don't worry about what 'others' are getting in the synthetic bench-marks.
4: Go out in the sun once in a while and enjoy it while you can! (We get so little of it here)
5: When you have FINALLY gotten used to the speed (so it 'appears' slow to you), THEN start tweaking the stuff for a little more speed.
Darn good advice. I can always elect to tweak after the fact. My mistake was in thinking all of this had to be done up front. Sorry.

3) Regarding "intelligence", the past 20 years I have employed and "hung out with" doctoral candidates (finishing their theses) from Cal-Tech, Berkeley and M.I.T. - and have held my own quite nicely. People of that academic caliber tend not to be "chest thumpers", because at their respective institutions there is always a bigger DOG waiting to pounce.

It's just that OCN is replete with people who are highly focused in their given area of interest. And, as you can probably tell, I don't tolerate nor acclimate to my not knowing as much as they do. I have always believed that ignorance is not a sin; acceptance of ignorance is however.

4) Re the New Manual: Magic-Man, have you given any thought as to how you can most efficiently present your new and improved version of the manual?

I had some second thoughts, that maybe a PDF link might be the least confusing for the user and, with your ability to simply cut, paste and add new material via a traditional WP, it could end up being the least laborious and certainly less confusing presentation. (You don't really want a whole bunch of "what do you mean by" questions if you simply edit as I suggested.)
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post #250 of 637
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by incurablegeek View Post
4) Re the New Manual: Magic-Man, have you given any thought as to how you can most efficiently present your new and improved version of the manual?

I had some second thoughts, that maybe a PDF link might be the least confusing for the user and, with your ability to simply cut, paste and add new material via a traditional WP, it could end up being the least laborious and certainly less confusing presentation. (You don't really want a whole bunch of "what do you mean by" questions if you simply edit as I suggested.)
Ya, I was thinking of that, just don't have a sit to put the file on that will allow re-edits of the file...
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