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post #11 of 27
the problem of bleeding the air is solved quite simply by getting a "y" splitter and a valve. install the splitter on the highest point of the wc system. it should be such that the splitter is used to connect two ends of a tube while the other end of the splitter is used to connect the valve open to the air. once u start the system, water will flow thru the splitter and u can slowly open the valve to bleed the air. once air is completely removed just simply close the valve and leave it be. u can use this valve to constinously bleed air throughout the life of the system.
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post #12 of 27
I Agree with cyrix about flow and HVAC about releasing trapped air--this can also be accomplished by keeping your components loose when filling the system so that you can manipulate them turning them this way and that as needed to let all the air escape from the loop.

As a side note--you can restrict flow by adding valves--but that's a lot of extra fittings for some experimenting
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post #13 of 27
Thread Starter 
Something like this right? Im assuming water/ liquid has the same principle as a "BRAKE LINE" once it has been bled the flow of liquid should be fine no matter how it has been splitted without adding a valve. Or am i wrong? And if the problem with with my first diagram is the load on the pump wouldnt it be better if i add a small pump inbetween the cpu and vga, so the flow from the cpu out going to the vga input would be faster?
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post #14 of 27
If you use a good pump like the DangerDenD5 I don't believe you'll need a relay pump. I have a TT SE setup (that I'm in the process of moddifing) and at first I used a gpu block as well as the cpu block as seen here. It worked ok but I didn't like the gpu block at all so I went back to the stock heatsink. Here is a drawing of the setup I'm thinking about.
post #15 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyrixMII300
as for greater flow from splitting the flow there exists no such thing. the flow of the pump is determined by the design of the pump and not the flow patterns. no matter how u direct the tubes, the flow will remain constant for any particular power consumption. what changes is the pressure drop.
I must respectfully disagree!

For any pump at a given voltage, flow goes down as head pressure (usually measured in feet of water) goes up. And head pressure goes up with increased resistance to flow.

Here's an example graph, from Dangerden:

http://www.dangerdenstore.com/files/...d_gpm_500w.jpg

And, for a given system, head pressure increases as flow resistance increases--from things like increased total tubing length, reduced tubing diameter, and constrictions in the system like waterblocks and tubing connectors.

Short form: more waterblocks in series ==> greater total tubing and constriction ==> greater flow resistance ==> less flow.

Perhaps a thought experiment will make it clearer: take a system (with a reservoir) that is functioning at a given flow rate, and kink a hose so that it is blocked (infinite resistance to flow). By your logic, total pressure drop would remain the same, along with flow. But we know that's not the case, and flow would stop.

Putting in additional waterblocks is like putting a constriction in a hose--not total blockage, but resistance goes up, and flow goes down.

Make sense?
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post #16 of 27
[QUOTE=shortfuse]Something like this right? [QUOTE]

Yep, that's the basic idea.

Your "valve" could be as simple as a screw down-clamp on one of the hoses--I remember we used them in chemistry lab all the time. Balancing it could be a simple as putting the clamp on the line to the WB with the lowest temp (and presumably the highest flow), and tightening it until the tradeoff in temps is what you like--no such thing as a free lunch.

All of this is conjecture on my part. I've never tried it. Free advice--your money back if not completely satisfied.
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post #17 of 27
Hey Guys,

Listen to Dr. Deville. He is right on the money. Plus, the graph tells it all. This works in ALL forms of fluid movement, all the way to the large industrial applications.
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post #18 of 27
Thread Starter 
Ok lets say i do use a valve right? and the main purpose of that valve is to restrict the current flow of water/liquid going to the gpu and cpu in order to do this u have to slightly close the valve right? now since thats the plan of the valve why not use a small diameter barb and hose if pretty much the same concept? smaller hose = restriction of water flow. or im understanding the purpose of the valve all wrong?
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post #19 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by shortfuse
why not use a small diameter barb and hose if pretty much the same concept? smaller hose = restriction of water flow. or im understanding the purpose of the valve all wrong?
You understand, same idea--restricting water flow. I'm just suggesting something adjustable, since I dunno how you'd be able to pick the right barbs and tubing to balance things.

I'd think you'd want to fiddle around, tweak, while watching cpu and gpu temps. I know that's my idea of fun. Really!

But it is kinda fiddly, and the barbs for the y-connections restrict flow, taking away some of what you're trying to gain by running waterblocks in parallel. And you're adding more parts and connections, which increases your likelihood of leaks.

That's why I just stuck with series operation. And if series was too much of a load on my dinky pump (doesn't seem so), I'd just buy one of those DangerDen pumps I'm coveting.
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post #20 of 27
ok mates i wasnt here yesterday so let me try to reply now to the disagreement. first lets start with some common definitions. all definitions are excerpts from Perry's Chemical Eng.s Handbook Rev. 7.

Total dynamic head - is total discharge head minus total suction head
Static suction head - the available head of liquid presented by a liquid level at the suction of a pump
Static discharge head - is the produced head presented by the net height of liquid level
Friction head - the required pressure to overcome the resistance in a flow piping and fitting.

Work performed in pumping. (page 10-23 of Perry's)
To cause liquid to flow, work must be expended. A pump may raise the liquid to a higher elevation, force it into a vessel at a higher pressure, provide the head to overcome pipe friction, or perform any combination of the above. Regardless of the service required of a pump, all energy imparted to the liquid in performing this service must be accounted for; consistent units for all quantities must be employed in arriving at the work or power performed.

having quoted the above, lets look at the following equation from the same page.

kW = HQ(ro) / 3.67x100000 ; (ro) is the density of the fluid being pumped.

in this case, kW is the power output of the pump, H is the total dynamic head and Q is the capacity of the pump. looking at the above equation, one should be able to realize that the density of any given fluid remains constant over all temperature conditions generally excepting for Newtonian fluids. then the power output of the pump can never exceed the power input for the pump multiplied by the efficieny of the pump. therefore the power output of the pump pretty much remains the same. as such what CAN change? the head and the flow can change. but then every pump is designed for a maximum flow for any given head. meaning when a mfg says max head of 3m and max flow of 400l/hr they mean the pump can achieve both the head of 3m and 400l/hr but not necessarily at the same time. it could probably reach a head of 3 m at 100l/hr or a flow of 400l/hr at a head of 1m. so what you are conjuring at this point is more or less correct. but then it is not accurate since you are omitting the fact that the head is constant.

the Static head of the system remains the same under any conditions unless you change the locations of the components. so now we only have a flow which can change according to the power output which is already shown to be constant. therefore for any given power consumption for any particular fixed system the flow will remain constant. this is the reason why in industrial applications, a VFD (variable flow drive) is utilized to control flow at different power consumptions. either that it is so much more common to utilize control valves to control flow by inducing a stop flow.

under no circumstances does the total head increase due to resistance unless u r talking about the friction head which would result in net drop of the Static discharge head and NPSH.

as for the graph remaining the same for all fluids u might want to think about compressor flow, piston pumps and two phase flow.
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