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[NyTimes] Imagining the Worst in BP’s Future - Page 5

post #41 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
What does the fact that its a British company have to do with anything?
It has to do with the fact that we're going to kick your butt this saturday at the World Cup. :0 ENOUGH with the England vs U.S. rhethoric. WE ARE ONE.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
And the fact that they "lied" about how much was leaking, the fact is they didnt know, nobody did, but every figure that was mentioned always had "estimated" before it.
Oh, how convenient. You're hearing this? They didn't know.

Go from 1,000 barrels-of-oil per-day to 40,000. [1 x 40]

Let's just assume it is 70,000+... afterall, "it's an estimate"

Ok, so it is clear they were negligent, now you're saying they're actually incompetent? Hmm, perhaps they're both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
I suppose the fact that several high ranking government officials/former officials have close affiliations with halliburton has nothing to do with the fact that they arent being crucified...
You're actually ok with this one. If you're being sarcastic of course.
post #42 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
What does the fact that its a British company have to do with anything?

And the fact that they "lied" about how much was leaking, the fact is they didnt know, nobody did, but every figure that was mentioned always had "estimated" before it.

I suppose the fact that several high ranking government officials/former officials have close affiliations with halliburton has nothing to do with the fact that they arent being crucified...
Your really caught up in defending your nation, remember that BP is a business


Also the whole "estimated" thing is rubbish, I could say "hey guys I just crashed my Ferrari and I estimate it will cost 2 dollars to fix" so your 'estimated' defense of BP is pointless.


Also this guy said it best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatlm View Post
What do you expect from a multi-billion dollar greed-driven imperialist-company of criminal negligent tea-sippers?
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post #43 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
Yes I am incredibly selfish for wanting the of 10's of thousands of people who make their living by harvesting from the gulf coast to be compensated for; the thousands of business that rely on those 10's of thousands of subsistence farms for lower priced products and the millions that rely on those thousands of business for food and other services
Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
Same can't be said about those local fisherman and businesses that rely on those waters. There are many corporations like BP, but there is only one gulf of Mexico.
Fishing and business will go back to normal after a little while. The real victim here is the shore, wetlands, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
EXACTLY! This is why BP going under is the least of my concerns because those professionals will just get a job elsewhere in that field. A field that harbors the richest corporations in the history of modern society.
So it's a crime to be rich, eh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
There should be a change in policy but BP should be a scapegoat for incompetence. If that change in policy requires BP to go under then so be it.
That's not how justice is supposed to work; they shouldn't be hammered into the ground just as an example. They should get the punishment that fits the crime (and you will have to accept whatever a judge/the government comes up with). Also, they have already, and will always, pay a huge price when it comes to their social standing.


Your line of thought is similar to that of most Americans. The hatred of oil companies, as well as any successful business, is very old and well-established. People love to hate, it's simple as that. It has little to do with this spill itself; it just gave people a reason to blast BP and they were waiting for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
Quite childish if you ask me, but then I supposed we should expect that from a country thats only a few hundred years old...
That has nothing to do with the issue and is borderline trolling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
Some people seem to have forgotten that BP isnt the only culprit here, but I havent seen Obama talking on the news about giving the other companies hefty fines. Its all BP's fault apparantly.
Your argument may have some merit, but it is BP's well and they are charged with overseeing it. Apparently they did not do such a good job on the "overseeing" part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach 5 View Post
My "cheap shot" was fairly true, although I will concede it was "cheap." This is just childish nonsense, and supports my point about how BP is to blame for everything.
No, it isn't true at all, mostly because it has nothing to do with the topic. A countries age has little to do with how it responds (I am guessing you are talking about the outcry by the people, and not the actual response to the incident).

Give up your "UK is better than US" perspective and take your own advice; stop your childish bickering about something that has nothing to do with the topic and is rooted in elitism and start talking constructively.
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post #44 of 55
1. 'Putting the boot on the neck of BP and demanding they don't pay dividends' is a great soundbite, but will never happen. The reason it will never happen is because in practice you'll be taking money away from Pension Plans both sides of the Atlantic. BP Sucks, Let's Starve Grandma - doesn't quite have such a palatable ring to it.

2. This is undoubtably a tragedy, and we in the UK are concerned about it. I heard that the slick would reach around most of the South Coast of Britain, so believe me the scale is not being downplayed.

3. Fact is, when problems are fresh, you need to point the finger at someone, rightly or wrongly. Depending on the situation it could be immigrants, a Leader, a company, or a different nation.

4. While yes, in my view BP should take overall responsibility, the snowballing of this story by the press & some spectating senators and the insinuation that BP has been dragging their feet is laughable. Afterall:
Quote:
Originally Posted by timAHH View Post
Do you really believe that? You think they like having their liquid gold spilling into the gulf?
I read that the Deepwater Horizon was being leased by TransOcean for nigh on $500,000 a day. Now is it me or is that a ridiculous amount of money? But hey! that's the oil industry I guess.

Something tells me that only a small number of deeply insecure people will be reassured by a senator trying to score points: "If it's in a British accent, said by British Petroleum, it's a lie" Can I stop whooping & Cheering now?

Personal Opinion Follows:
Man, Big business is scary stuff. Seems a lack of enforced regulations & checks played a part in this disaster. If checks and govt controls were tighter maybe this could've been caught, or pushed the onus onto companies to behave more responsibility.
Ultimately the onus is on BP though. Let's hope lessons are learnt, this time at least. Businesses need to be more responsible & concerned with safety, and we all know it will take governments to force them to do it.
Edited by AntiTalent - 6/11/10 at 9:56am
    
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post #45 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockery View Post
Fishing and business will go back to normal after a little while. The real victim here is the shore, wetlands, etc.
It is quite easy to say that fishing and businesses will go back to normal after "a little while" without knowing exaclt how crucial the GoM is to their livlihoods. A little while in reality cannot come sooner for people who cannot afford to keep paying employees, pay rent, pay for everyday-business-functions, etc, etc, etc.

You have to take into consideration the fact that we're 50+ days into this and it seems it will continue for at least another month. THAT IS UNSUSTAINABLE and somewhat out-of-touch with the reality on the ground.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockery View Post
So it's a crime to be rich, eh?.
Oh no, the capitalist card. What to do?!

...No one has implied that making profits is illegal. BUT, they have a legal obligation to FIX EVERYTHING as well as a moral obligation if their "social standing" is so important.

Now, the problem is that we seem to have different definitions as to what "making-it-right" is.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockery View Post
Your line of thought is similar to that of most Americans. The hatred of oil companies, as well as any successful business, is very old and well-established. People love to hate, it's simple as that. It has little to do with this spill itself; it just gave people a reason to blast BP and they were waiting for it.
...especially in difficult economic times, people look for a way to vent out their frustrations, but that is still irrelevant with how others expect the American public to react to this. It has ALOT to do with the spill itself, it is STILL GUSHING OUT at a "new" rate of 40,000-barrels-per-day... Ok, let us be realistic, it is a crisis no matter which angle you want to look at it from and given all the circumstances we have the damn right to be upset.[/QUOTE]
post #46 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trinnd View Post
BP has put more effort than they should have into this. This is what the Government is for... Not for bailouts and Universal healthcare.

Some of you just say "BP SHOULD GO UNDER" and imply that they did it on purpose?
If I hit somebody with my car I am still responsible and liable for the damages even if I didn't do it on purpose. BP is responsible for the damage even if they didn't do it on purpose. The way it is going the fines alone can run 15-20 billion dollars in this case, maybe more. There is no reason to let BP off the hook. The last thing BP deserves is leniency. Did you see the details of their emergency plan, it is either negligence or fraud. I don't care if BP goes under or doesn't, I just care that they pay for every little bit of this.
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post #47 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
EXACTLY! This is why BP going under is the least of my concerns because those professionals will just get a job elsewhere in that field. A field that harbors the richest corporations in the history of modern society.

Same can't be said about those local fisherman and businesses that rely on those waters. There are many corporations like BP, but there is only one gulf of Mexico.

There should be a change in policy but BP should be a scapegoat for incompetence. If that change in policy requires BP to go under then so be it.
They have around 100k employees. I highly doubt all the other companies have 100k open positions right now to fill. If that was the case, don't you think the millions of Americans clamoring for jobs would have accepted those positions by now?

As others have said, BP is doing what they can to stop it. Why? Because the entire public spotlight is focused on them to make sure it gets done. Guess what... all those local fisherman that lost their jobs fishing because of the oil are now the corral boats that are out corralling the oil. So guess what, they're still working. Whats the other reason? Oh yea, not only does it make them look bad BUT THEIR MONEY IS FLOATING AWAY.

Next issue: The oil rig was NOT owned by them. They lease that rig and it is maintained, overseen, and monitored BY ANOTHER COMPANY. ANOTHER COMPANY saw the warning signs weeks in advance and decided to ignore it, NOT BP.

I own no stake in BP, however I'm not ignorant to the fact that their going under would hurt TONS of people. If they go under, they aren't gonna fix that leak, clean the spill, supply 100k jobs, and all the other various public works that oil companies partake in with their money. You guys forget that oil companies are generally hated no matter what so they invest TONS of money into alternate fuel services (obviously with hopes that they'll pioneer harvesting and utilization techniques but still benefits everyone), they build playgrounds, they allow your sons and daughters to work in their convenience stores, they give your husbands and wives jobs trucking the oil all over the place.

Look at the big picture.

TL;DR : BP is the 4th largest company in the world. If they go under, it screws over TONS of people, INCLUDING the people affected by the oil spill AS WELL AS all their employees and shareholders and various other groups. Economic meltdown anyone?
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post #48 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedma11229 View Post
This might be a really good investment, I doubt BP will willingly go into bankruptcy. Hopefully a cap is going to be put in place which will stop the leak and if I buy their stock at $25 (if it goes down that low) in a few years I should see more than a 100% return on my investment.
Buying a few hundred shares of BP asap for this reason
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post #49 of 55
Thread Starter 
It's truly a wonder that humans can do what they do and we have not wiped ourselves out yet. With the intensity of problems arising around the world exponentially, I see the inevitable speed up of human entropy.

Start working together to solve our issues, or we will perish together!
post #50 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by PDXMark View Post
It's truly a wonder that humans can do what they do and we have not wiped ourselves out yet. With the intensity of problems arising around the world exponentially, I see the inevitable speed up of human entropy.

Start working together to solve our issues, or we will perish together!
A fatal assumption here is that humans have a massive impact on things (and that 'corporate greed induced catastrophes' are normal.)

This is not to say that humans don't have an impact, but it is far less than what most people assume.
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