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Building a Server

3K views 56 replies 15 participants last post by  Lozza 
#1 ·
A few friends and I got the idea to all chip in(three of us) and build a server. We'd want to use it as a webserver, fileserver, and to host a few games(it's possible to host multiple games on one server, right). Just if anyone can lend some advice on how much it would cost for a server like this, and what CPU, how much RAM, mobo, etc.

I'd probably put Linux on it, because I have experience with it(been a while though).

Any help is greatly appreciated.
 
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#5 ·
Your really could do with an Athlon 64, some nice value ram (and a lot of it). The thing you are going to have the most difficulty in providing is bandwidth across the internet. You need a huge upload pipeline to effectively host as a webserver, and to run multiple games as well will simply tax the system even more. If I had to guess, I would say that you would need a solid 5mBits to make all that work. My point is, your not so much going to be hardware limited as you are going to be connection limited.

However, just to let you know. I built a server this summer out of a Soltek SFF case, put 2gb of ram in it, a 3000+ venice and a 200gb hard drive (non-SCSI) and it works great. Has over 3 months uptime (had to take it down for winter break here at college in December) and runs CS:S, BF2 and a busy FTP. So you don't need absolutely rad hardware to make it work, surely not a 'server' processor. My ram is just some value ram and I modded the cooling to keep things nice and quiet while also cool.

Anyhow, good luck to you man!
 
#6 ·
So would I be better off getting a server mobo/processor, or just building a regular cheapo rig and using it as a server?

Also, I think I have decent bandwidth from my ISP. Anyone know how a server would turn out on a wireless network using Optimum Online? (my father also pays extra money for the business-type connection)
 
#7 ·
Tyan make great mobo's with 2 cpu sockets, if you could get a couple of opteron 2xx chips (2-way), you could run that, windows server edition 2003, and get 16GB of ram (preferably ECC and registered), a few SCSI drives, and a hefty power regulator to make sure a power surge won't kill it. That is of course you have the money. Remember, you want processes with servers not single performance.

Ram will be a killer, this is basic server memory:
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=178467

In other words £300 x 8 = £2400


A 2-way chip:
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=118546

This board is nice:
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=306296
(and no i'm not just picking the most expensive, it is good for the money, for a SCSI controller)

Remember the SATA drives only give 7200 rpm, and those 10000 WD raptors are a waste of money if you have SCSI. Fujitsu are ok (15k rpm):
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Produ...oductID=217973
Raid a couple of those together and you got a nice setup! Check what you have: SCSI 80pin or 68pin. Also check whether the SCSI controller is up to the job get a few reviews.

About the internet connection, you might be looking at getting a new line installed if you want exetremely fast stuff. It is impossible otherwise, unless you can invade your telephone exchange, kick BT out of there and put VDSL in it or something. You want upload speed, not just download speed, normal 2mb broadband has only 256kb upstream. For example, to get all those games and things running and a decent file server, you will need a 100mbit. think of if as 100 people with 1mb connection can connect to it, or 200 people with 512kb connection can connect to it. And having this line is going to be expensive!

But then again if there is 3 of you with £1500 each, you could manage it, if you get 8GB memory. Remember your monthly charge for the internet line too.

If your looking at some kind of business supercomputer, if you're a millionaire, get a server tower, some of these:
http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk8qw.html
This, with the expansion board, rack mount ready, can have an expansion board for 8 opteron 8-way processors!
Also get some racks, a few display switchers, and why not an extension on the house so you can worship your monsrosity!

If you want a more in depth answer to this server thing, PM me about it, I only had 5 minutes to type this.

Great, I killed the thread now
 
#8 ·
Well, yes, money will be a bit of a problem. Like I said, it's just a few of us, and we're 15.

I put together a mini-atx build on newgg for about $600. Just normal stuff, with a venice 3000+.

Our ISP is pretty decent. My upload speed is about 1.7mbps(we pay for a ton more, gotta call them about that). We've also run dedicated servers on our main rigs for special occasions, so they're capable of handling that.
 
#10 ·
Hello, I can most certainly lend a hand here. I myself run a personal/business web server.

A server like you want (and what I have) does not require anything special at all. Here are my server specs:

MSI Motherboard
2.5Ghz socket 478 P4 Northwood
Stock CPU Cooling
1 GB cheapo ram
350W power supply
Floppy Drive
CD-RW Drive
8 GB Compaq piece of crap hard drive
200GB Seagate Hard Drive
300GB Seagate Hard Drive
Fans all over the place
Full tower computer case
On board LAN

Ok, floppy drive is optional (but recommended), cd-rom can be taken out after windows is installed if you will not need it (but recommend keeping it in), CPU is from 2 years ago (used to be my main computer CPU), Motherboard is actually new, but only because my crappy ECS board fried like burnt toast, Ram is cheap stuff I got just because it was on sale (different kinds of sticks) Power supply is the old one out of my main comp case because I upgraded that, 8GB drive is out of my Compaq computer from 6 or 7 years ago? And really isn’t used at all, just needed a place for it, 200GB hard drive is the main drive for the computer (OS, web server, etc), 300GB drive is bran new and I only got it cause it was on sale for a good deal, the fans that are all over are simply old fans that I had laying around (fans are not really needed, perhaps a intake at minimum), the case is my 4 year old case that I used to use for my main comp.

I would recommend a full tower case, better air = better cooling, especially for no fan systems. On my server I run e-mail hosting, web hosting, mysql server, FTP server, Ventrilo server (voice chat), and IRC server. These services use little or no CPU processes (yes even the voice chat). Ram is only using 194MB, and if I wanted to I could host a game server or two (maybe more) with no problems.

A good thing to have is Cable Internet or faster, but not wireless Internet. The problem with wireless Internet is that it is slow in reality. Why? Well, wireless Internet must ping back and forth between satellites, this causes delays, especially noticeable on a game server. Think of it this way: 1) you hold a football (server), 2) You throw the football to another person (User requesting stuff from server), 3) Other person catches the ball (User getting PART of the file/data), 4) Other person throws ball back (User requesting the rest of the data not sent, 5) You throw the ball again (User getting more of the file/data), 6) repeat 3-5

So basically to get you started I would recommend the following:

Decent motherboard (probably a brand name, only need a 3pci slot board)
2GHz processor or higher (AMD or Intel)
1GB or more rams
200GB Hard drive (relatively cheap these days, get a bigger one if possible)

Also, a good surge protector is recommended, even better if it is a backup battery (don’t get a cheap so called 15 minute backup battery, get a good one, probably $100US or more)

Hope I didn’t leave anything out. Please feel free to ask questions.
 
#11 ·
you will be best off just building a "budget pc" kinda, but you need lots of ram, like 2gb+,the more the better and doesnt need to be any great stuff, i have found that Ultra brand ram is cheap but very good aswell, and and good old 3000+amd will work fine, and as mentioned above you definately need a good connection with high upload speeds....
 
#12 ·
Here's what I have picked out:

ASPIRE X-QPACK

Seagate Barracuda 250gb SATA II

BIOSTAR Tforce socket 939 micro-atx(with onboard geforce 6100)

Geil Value 2GB

AMD Athlon 64 3000+ Venice

I could actually plug the server directly into my router once I have everything set up, rather than using a wireless connection. Will this stuff work? I'd use the case PSU. Aspire is cheap, but generally reliable(though not top of the line).
 
#14 ·
Everything sounds good with the exception of the case.

Is space a problem? For that much (probably less) you can get a generic full tower case. These are much better for servers, especially for upgrades later (more hard drives). This one for example, http://www.compusa.com/products/prod...731&pfp=BROWSE. That one looks a lot better than the one I have, is better, and is cheaper than what I paid for mine 5 years ago by 40 or 50 US$. Of course if you don’t have a power supply somewhere you would have to get one. But this is just an example case.

Also, onboard graphics are the way to go with a server, even if you did not have on board graphics you can get a cheapo video card for 15 bucks. Servers do not need high graphics; all you turn the monitor on for is to load new software, etc. That is if you even have a monitor connected, most the time I don’t.
 
#15 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Neocold
Everything sounds good with the exception of the case.

Is space a problem? For that much (probably less) you can get a generic full tower case. These are much better for servers, especially for upgrades later (more hard drives). This one for example, http://www.compusa.com/products/prod...731&pfp=BROWSE. That one looks a lot better than the one I have, is better, and is cheaper than what I paid for mine 5 years ago by 40 or 50 US$. Of course if you don’t have a power supply somewhere you would have to get one. But this is just an example case.

Also, onboard graphics are the way to go with a server, even if you did not have on board graphics you can get a cheapo video card for 15 bucks. Servers do not need high graphics; all you turn the monitor on for is to load new software, etc. That is if you even have a monitor connected, most the time I don’t.

To answer one of your questions, I have a question. I know that moving the server from house to house would change the IP. Question is, is it possible to easily change the IP that the domain refers to? My guess is no. But if yes, then I'd like it to be portable. If not, then preferably very small. Space would be nice, cause it would have to sit on top of a shelf next to my router.

Also, that mobo does have onboard video, and to whoever asked, SATA II as well.

Oh, and I have a CD drive lying around somewhere.

And will a server really need anything more than 250gb? It'll pretty much be a game or two, and a webserver for a small site.
 
#16 ·
Changing the IP is very easy, however can sometimes take 30minutes-24 hours to change over completely (depending on your domain name host) because of update delays. Also, moving the server causes downtimes, which are bad for servers (the goal of a server is to be up 100% of the time). Also, why move the server around? If you setup FTP you can upload and download from remote locations, and if you setup a program (most you have to legally purchase, *cough* legally *cough*) you can connect to and control it as if you were at it.

As for the size of the hard drive, no, for your purpose you wouldn’t need a bigger drive but what if you guys decided to start storing stuff like music, movies, etc. on the drive? Then you would need the space, of course there is always the option to get more drives later if needed, assuming your case supports the expansions.
 
#17 ·
What OS do you guys recommend for a small server like the one we are referring to? The idea of my own server is definitely something that intrigues me. Also, will Comcast have to notified so that they can reallocate some of my bandwidth for uploading? As you can tell, I'm in the process of educating myself and any information that you can share will be greatly appreciated.
 
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#18 ·
Hello,

As for DNS issues (domains), you could use a service like dyndns.org for your servers. You can set it to automatically update and that is almost instant.

As for a server.. you can run good stuff on a 3000+ with 2gb of ram. People will say oh no you won't, but you can run a couple of game servers. You might have to allocate additional INTERNAL ip's using ipmasq in Linux or set stuff to different ports.. lets say you wanna run a CS server. Default port is 27015, so now you wanna run a second on at the same time. You either need a second external ip, or a second internal IP to run it on the same port. The port is in the config of the game. Those are only for games that run on the same ports, and I don't believe other games run on that port.

I have a 1.3ghz duron with 512mb ram dedicated.. I run a webserver, a CS server, and a RO server. It runs perfectly fine with a .25 load. It only goes higher when my website gets a lot more traffic, it shoots above 1.5 sometimes.

I can help with specific questions too.. ask away.
 
#19 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pythagoras
What OS do you guys recommend for a small server like the one we are referring to? The idea of my own server is definitely something that intrigues me. Also, will Comcast have to notified so that they can reallocate some of my bandwidth for uploading? As you can tell, I'm in the process of educating myself and any information that you can share will be greatly appreciated.
I think Comcast block outgoing http traffic unless you have a business account, and if you have a business account, I believe they give you a static IP address.

I would reccomend Fedora Core 4 (http://www.redhat.com/en_us/USA/fedora/) for the OS. Install Webmin (http://www.webmin.com/) for adding web users and other users. Webmin will make it pretty easy on you for managing user based stuff. There are modules that will automatically add web users. You can probably get a copy of plesk for $20 a month.. but I wouldn't reccomend it if you are just going to be running a couple of websites. cPanel is pretty expensive, but usually people run those two only if their going in to a business. I have a private server and I host about 20 websites for friends.. I use plesk.
 
#20 ·
Well I don't really know why we'd need to move the server around. I guess just in case we needed to. As for setting up the internal ports/IPs and stuff, I know all about that. I ran linux a few years ago, and I still remember my stuff. I'd leave it to my friend to config the game servers, cause he likes that sort of stuff, but I'd do all the networking, webserver, etc.

Can anyone suggest a very small case for a mini-atx that has some expansion space, but won't clog up space in my house?
 
#21 ·
Sitting on a shelf you say! Can you afford the room for a flat ATX desktop?
Just a thought
 
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#25 ·
For the OS I use windows XP, contrary to popular opinion it is very stable, just turn off all the eye candy to save memory. But I just use it because I have unlimited copies (school copy).

DO NOT CONTACT COMCAST if you contact them and ask about that they will tell you that you must upgrade to a business account. I use Comcast cable Internet myself, nothing is blocked with the exception of WinMX

The Duke brought up a good point. What he is talking about is basically a tower turned on its side; only it is made to be like that. Cheesy illustration:

Tower ATX: | Flat ATX: __
 
#26 ·
Dude i run a server at home and im round ur age too so i might add my 2 dollars worth(be that AU..). My server is a Celeron 2.4 with 1 gig RAM and it runs fine with Win Server 03. What i would really reccommend for if u want cheap is to get a cheap 64-bit CPU like Athlon 64 3000+ or one of the really cheap Dual Core intel like the 805... Basically if u get a cheap 64-bit CPU like i said(maybe even a sempron) then u can install Fedora Core 4 64-bit edition and that will mean ur server will have the edge over a powerful 32-bit system when under load. But also as the others said, dont skimp out on the RAM i would say a minumum of 1gb
 
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