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[Official] Starcraft 2 Strategy & Discussion Thread - Page 1275

post #12741 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sainesk View Post
just wondering, does marineking still go mass marines (with medivacs) no matter what the opponent builds? how does he deal with Colossi? does he ever throw in a few vikings?

stimmed marines are so fun...
anybody?

I personally can't seem to handle colossi/gate ball combo without throwing in some marauders and vikings...
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post #12742 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sainesk View Post
anybody?

I personally can't seem to handle colossi/gate ball combo without throwing in some marauders and vikings...
The way he does it has such insane pressure constantly that the protoss never even has the chance to get more than one colossus- they can't afford to ball up with 3 colossi if they're being constantly pummelled and needing to defend with gateway units.

Watch the Day9 about it, it explains that if you constantly stream marines to the front, you should never have to worry about a ton of colossus, and should be more concerned about HTs. But considering that HTs take forever and no longer come with storm on demand, you shouldn't have any problems.

The key with the strategy is starting your attack early and never letting up pressure. As soon as he has 2-3 colossus with range it's GG. But if he only has 1 at a time, your marines can snipe it without taking too much damage.

And make marines from bare barracks at first, don't bother with reactors- they take forever in the early game and cost gas which you should barely be mining. It's also easier to balance economy and barracks number with single marine production.

Just pretend you're doing a 7rax all in, but stop at 5 rax, keep up the pressure to keep him on 2base without many colossus, and then expand and add on another 7-9 barracks. Get upgrades, shield and armor first (you have no medivacs, stim is dangerous and should be used for sniping colossi) and throw down a ghost academy. Continue to stream marines to the front, add in ghosts for EMP if you see HTs.
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post #12743 of 25319
I played a game yesterday that made me remember how much I don't miss amulet. The 2nd game where my score was higher than the opponent in a 25 minute game and I lost.
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post #12744 of 25319
I've been playing around with hallucination and I have to say it's probably one of the most underused spells in the game. I was hoping to get some input from others to theorycraft a timed rush that implements hallucination.

VS Terran

Basically, I've crafted myself a timed VR push that is extremely powerful against terran. In fact, I've only lost 3-4 times using it (in 20-25 times doing it) and looking back I probably could have won those games after improving the timed push.

The strategy involves making early 2 gas and double gating, quickly blocking your ramp with 3 sentries to deny any kind of early attack from terran (this is where I reference back to FF being broken). Generally terrans will see all your early sentries and assume all of your gas is going toward them. The better terrans may suspect that something's up, and scan around your base for hidden buildings. This is why it's important to hide your stargate in a spot that's hard to find. Generally, if they suspect anything at all it will be DTs.

Essentially, mass zealots and chrono boost 2 VRs and push out. If the terran fast expands (most do) you'll probably win. The strat seems weak against terran timed pushes, though. Banshee rushes do not counter this strategy as these games end up in base trades and VR > banshee.

The problem arises when terrans mass up a force, THEN expand. I'm thinking hallucination could work wonders to bait part of the defending army to the mineral line by hallucinating a prism and sending it over the main's scvs. Once the mm moves to defend the mineral line, send in your army, FF the ramp and obliterate whatever was left behind to defend.

I was also thinking that IF the terran has no turret(s), hallucinated archons could be used to tank some damage. If there ARE turrets, hallucinate more VRs to make the real ones harder to find/shoot down.

VS Zerg

We all know that 4-gate kinda sucks against zerg (I'm talking early 4G pressure). But I think that once you add the smart use of hallucinations this could change. Same deal as above, send in a hallucinated prism and FF the ramp once the zerg moves from his expansion. I could foresee some issues where when moving out especially against early large sling/roach armies.

I really haven't tested hallucination besides a phoenix to scout/feign pressure though.

Thoughts?

Edit: VS Protoss

Hoping this isn't a "breakthrough" idea but I've never seen it in high level play. Protoss players always wait for an observer/prism to get high ground vision and warp in units there. Why not use a hallucinated flying unit? This would be much faster than waiting for t2 tech.
Edited by Lazorbeam - 4/27/11 at 12:41pm
    
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post #12745 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazorbeam View Post
I've been playing around with hallucination and I have to say it's probably one of the most underused spells in the game. I was hoping to get some input from others to theorycraft a timed rush that implements hallucination.

VS Terran

Basically, I've crafted myself a timed VR push that is extremely powerful against terran. In fact, I've only lost 3-4 times using it (in 20-25 times doing it) and looking back I probably could have won those games after improving the timed push.

The strategy involves making early 2 gas and double gating, quickly blocking your ramp with 3 sentries to deny any kind of early attack from terran (this is where I reference back to FF being broken). Generally terrans will see all your early sentries and assume all of your gas is going toward them. The better terrans may suspect that something's up, and scan around your base for hidden buildings. This is why it's important to hide your stargate in a spot that's hard to find. Generally, if they suspect anything at all it will be DTs.

Essentially, mass zealots and chrono boost 2 VRs and push out. If the terran fast expands (most do) you'll probably win. The strat seems weak against terran timed pushes, though. Banshee rushes do not counter this strategy as these games end up in base trades and VR > banshee.

The problem arises when terrans mass up a force, THEN expand. I'm thinking hallucination could work wonders to bait part of the defending army to the mineral line by hallucinating a prism and sending it over the main's scvs. Once the mm moves to defend the mineral line, send in your army, FF the ramp and obliterate whatever was left behind to defend.

I was also thinking that IF the terran has no turret(s), hallucinated archons could be used to tank some damage. If there ARE turrets, hallucinate more VRs to make the real ones harder to find/shoot down.

VS Zerg

We all know that 4-gate kinda sucks against zerg (I'm talking early 4G pressure). But I think that once you add the smart use of hallucinations this could change. Same deal as above, send in a hallucinated prism and FF the ramp once the zerg moves from his expansion. I could foresee some issues where when moving out especially against early large sling/roach armies.

I really haven't tested hallucination besides a phoenix to scout/feign pressure though.

Thoughts?

Edit: VS Protoss

Hoping this isn't a "breakthrough" idea but I've never seen it in high level play. Protoss players always wait for an observer/prism to get high ground vision and warp in units there. Why not use a hallucinated flying unit? This would be much faster than waiting for t2 tech.
You can get out hallucination even faster next patch too.
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post #12746 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomDash View Post
You can get out hallucination even faster next patch too.
warp gate tech is going from 140sec to 180 sec tho
zealot/stalker/sentry time is decreasing by like 5 seconds each as well.
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post #12747 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by thealex132 View Post
warp gate tech is going from 140sec to 180 sec tho
zealot/stalker/sentry time is decreasing by like 5 seconds each as well.
Its still PTR, usually there are some changes between PTR and the actual patch.
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post #12748 of 25319
So I'm going to make an effort play Z more in casuals for now, I played my first one vs a 650 master Terran so far. I won of course. It's nice being on the easy side for once. It feels so bad knowing how much work he is putting into it and just to slowly pick him apart with muta and 1a sling bane for the win... feels dirty.. but good none the less.
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post #12749 of 25319
carriers, are they OP in 4v4?

I just played a game where I had 2 zealots, 2 rays and all my other units carriers and like half of them had over 40 kills each...

I feel they can abuse most maps to their advantage so much...
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post #12750 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sainesk View Post
carriers, are they OP in 4v4?

I just played a game where I had 2 zealots, 2 rays and all my other units carriers and like half of them had over 40 kills each...

I feel they can abuse most maps to their advantage so much...
every single 3v3/4v4 I have played is always "lets rush them"
And never a macro game.
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Yuki
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Illya
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Neptunia
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Intel 2500K 5Ghz ASUS P8P67 Pro EVGA 1080 Ti FTW3 G.Skill RipJaws X 2133Mhz 16GB 
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240GB Corsair Neutron GTX RAID0 Samsung 850 Evo 1TB WD Red 8TB Corsair H115i GTX 
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EK Vardar fans Windows 10 Dell u2713hm Apple Cinema Display 
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Razer BlackWidow 2013 CoolerMaster V1000 Corsair 760T Artic White Logitech G502 Proteus Spectrum 
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CoolerMaster Swift-RX XL ASUS Xonar DX Schiit Magni Sennheiser HD650 
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