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post #22731 of 25318
any current masters terrans here
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post #22732 of 25318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anti!! View Post

Did you play sc1 at its early days?

No, why?
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post #22733 of 25318
I played Starcraft 1 in 1998 and didn't stop until CS 1.0 days. Spent thousands of hours playing on kali.net and hanging out in the battle.net channels "Clan ~nohunters" and "Clan -x17". Met and played some pros, played on Agent911's CS server ect.

Was around in the peak days of of battlreports.com, long before replays ect. Even used to write SC1 build orders on starcraft.org, or write them on paper to my buddies in high school. I'm sure they were dumb as crap looking back though lol.

As a SC1 player first I think the units in SCII that are very bad for the game are:

Marauder
Colossus
Oracle
Sentry
Tempest
Swarm Host
Broodlords.

I could break down why but if you just think about every one of those units is poorly designed in many ways. I also want to note SC1 didn't really have hard counters, so even outside that list everything that hard countered should be made more mild to make NOTHING a hard counter. Give people micro and skill to counter, not rock paper scissors. Kind of Starbow's mindset right now, and hopefully David Kim can open his eyes beyond win / loss ratios only.

There is one unit I've seen people debate in SCII, and that's the baneling. For a long time I hated banelings ( as a T player ), but I think even though they are much easier to use as far as micro goes than marines, they are the most exciting unit in the game because of the micro they force. They aren't entirely dumb either as you can still use them tactically / positionally to counter act micro counter acting.
Edited by DoomDash - 1/14/14 at 3:44am
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post #22734 of 25318
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomDash View Post

I played Starcraft 1 in 1998 and didn't stop until CS 1.0 days. Spent thousands of hours playing on kali.net and hanging out in the battle.net channels "Clan ~nohunters" and "Clan -x17". Met and played some pros, played on Agent911's CS server ect.

Was around in the peak days of of battlreports.com, long before replays ect. Even used to write SC1 build orders on starcraft.org, or write them on paper to my buddies in high school. I'm sure they were dumb as crap looking back though lol.

As a SC1 player first I think the units in SCII that are very bad for the game are:

Marauder
Colossus
Oracle
Sentry
Tempest
Swarm Host
Broodlords.

I could break down why but if you just think about every one of those units is poorly designed in many ways. I also want to note SC1 didn't really have hard counters, so even outside that list everything that hard countered should be made more mild to make NOTHING a hard counter. Give people micro and skill to counter, not rock paper scissors. Kind of Starbow's mindset right now, and hopefully David Kim can open his eyes beyond win / loss ratios only.

There is one unit I've seen people debate in SCII, and that's the baneling. For a long time I hated banelings ( as a T player ), but I think even though they are much easier to use as far as micro goes than marines, they are the most exciting unit in the game because of the micro they force. They aren't entirely dumb either as you can still use them tactically / positionally to counter act micro counter acting.

Ok, I just wrote 2 page answer to that and deleted it, because I got lost in my own explanations...

What I'm essentially trying to say is:
Marauder is epic - fix it, don't remove it.
Colossus is epic - fix it, don't remove it.
Oracle is made-up high-fantasy bull excrement, remove it.
Sentry is made-up high-fantasy bull excrement, remove it.
Tempest is made-up high-fantasy bull excrement, remove it.
Swarm Host is epic - fix it, don't remove it.
Broodlord is made-up high-fantasy bull excrement, remove it.
Carrier is epic - bring it back.

A game where it is impossible to win 1vs2, regardless of how much the map favors you, is broken. Let's not break it further by adding more units that some designer with 0 imagination came up with in one of his more productive visits to the toilet (like the "Reaver" - a mobile factory that launches explosive robots?! NO.)
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post #22735 of 25318

I liked the Reaver - each attack cost minerals so not using them efficiently/your opponent spreading units effectively could cost you the game, it was a unit that rewarded skill from either player. Colossus is still pretty much a-move style in my opinion (okay, some people move/position them a little). Also, Reaver and Corsair drops was much more like Medivac and Tank, whereas Colossus drops can simple be countered by just anti-air making them a not so terrifying ground drop unit as long as you notice it coming, whereas with a Reaver it gets dropped and all you have is anti air, then you have to react like you would to banelings/tanks making the match far more exciting than move my units away from minerals, move them back.

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post #22736 of 25318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sainesk View Post

I liked the Reaver - each attack cost minerals so not using them efficiently/your opponent spreading units effectively could cost you the game, it was a unit that rewarded skill from either player. Colossus is still pretty much a-move style in my opinion (okay, some people move/position them a little). Also, Reaver and Corsair drops was much more like Medivac and Tank, whereas Colossus drops can simple be countered by just anti-air making them a not so terrifying ground drop unit as long as you notice it coming, whereas with a Reaver it gets dropped and all you have is anti air, then you have to react like you would to banelings/tanks making the match far more exciting than move my units away from minerals, move them back.

Ok, imagine the SC universe was real. Why on Earth would the Protoss design or use such a unit?! A unit has to fit the *game* before it fits mechanical requirements. In other words, they could design a big hairy BUTT, that, from a mechanical standpoint, solves ALL problems of the game - you just replace the, say, Colossus with that Butt, and the game now has a Perfect gameplay! Perfect balance, perfect skill requirements, interesting gameplay.

Would you accept that? Would you accept a gigantic hairy A55 in your favorite game for the sake of balance? I wouldn't. The Reaver is that butt for me. It being there makes no sense at all. And even if it solves all problems SC2 has (it doesn't), I still wouldn't want it. smile.gif Hope that wasn't too graphic.
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post #22737 of 25318
A unit should be designed with the purpose of filling a certain role in a battle. Reaver perfectly fits a role of a powerful but slow and fragile siege unit which protoss kind of lacks at the moment. If reaver doesn't make sense for you then carrier shouldn't as well.

I'd take reaver over colossus any time. There's a lot of cool things you can do with the reaver in terms of both strategy and tactics. There's nothing interesting that can be done with the colossus. It's just kind of boring. Not as boring as swarm hosts though.
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post #22738 of 25318
Quote:
Originally Posted by poroboszcz View Post

A unit should be designed with the purpose of filling a certain role in a battle. Reaver perfectly fits a role of a powerful but slow and fragile siege unit which protoss kind of lacks at the moment. If reaver doesn't make sense for you then carrier shouldn't as well.

I'd take reaver over colossus any time. There's a lot of cool things you can do with the reaver in terms of both strategy and tactics. There's nothing interesting that can be done with the colossus. It's just kind of boring. Not as boring as swarm hosts though.

You obviously didn't understand anything of what I said smile.gif Oh well...
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post #22739 of 25318
Does anyone remember the awesome custom map days of SC1? I recently bought heart of the swarm because I thought maybe there would be more people playing custom games but I was extremely let down by the lack of community.. I miss the days of The Thing, RP maps, and the awesome dodge maps! But I guess nobody shared my enthusiasm.. I really wish there was a way to get people playing custom maps like they used to.
post #22740 of 25318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ddreder View Post

Does anyone remember the awesome custom map days of SC1? I recently bought heart of the swarm because I thought maybe there would be more people playing custom games but I was extremely let down by the lack of community.. I miss the days of The Thing, RP maps, and the awesome dodge maps! But I guess nobody shared my enthusiasm.. I really wish there was a way to get people playing custom maps like they used to.

i want them to make wc4 for the custom maps, not gonna happen though. we need more wow-crap apparently
Edited by perfectblade - 1/14/14 at 9:09am
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