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post #2761 of 25319
Platinum in 1v1 but probably would be diamond if i played more (Im 8-3). Im in diamond in team games.

What's wrong with your macro?

As for mutas, depending on how many there are, I like to split my stalkers in between my bases but in good position to move to the other base if needed. Keep zealots in front by choke. Sentries with stalkers may help but mutas usually fly away if there are more stalkers.

Phoenix is good against a small number of mutas esp if you know how to micro them but may be an unrealistic counter if your opponent goes for MASS mutas because you will need 2+ stargates to keep up with his muta production. If you go the phoenix route, use it to its full advantage by killing drones, overlords, and scouting for the spire.

Personally I think blink stalkers are the most efficient counter to this. If you can, upgrade armor to reduce splash dmg (works great if paired with guardian shield). Blink back the stalkers who have their shields drained and let your fresh stalkers take damage. If mutas fly away, blink stalkers to get a free kill or two.

Id throw up cannons only if the muta harassment is consistent and your opponent seems committed to it.

It's very important to not let your opponent contain you. You need to either harass, attack or scout during this time because your opponent may very well take every open expo (and macro like crazy) if you are contained. Use timing to your advantage like attack immediately after(or slightly before) blink is done.

Another good idea is to 4 gate your opponent if he techs straight to mutas or get an early expo
Edited by ThumperSD - 10/9/10 at 5:11pm
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post #2762 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThumperSD View Post
Platinum in 1v1 but probably would be diamond if i played more (Im 8-3). Im in diamond in team games.

What's wrong with your macro?

As for mutas, depending on how many there are, I like to split my stalkers in between my bases but in good position to move to the other base if needed. Keep zealots in front by choke. Sentries with stalkers may help but mutas usually fly away if there are more stalkers.

Phoenix is good against a small number of mutas esp if you know how to micro them but may be an unrealistic counter if your opponent goes for MASS mutas because you will need 2+ stargates to keep up with his muta production. If you go the phoenix route, use it to its full advantage by killing drones, overlords, and scouting for the spire.

Personally I think blink stalkers are the most efficient counter to this. If you can, upgrade armor to reduce splash dmg (works great if paired with guardian shield). Blink back the stalkers who have their shields drained and let your fresh stalkers take damage. If mutas fly away, blink stalkers to get a free kill or two.

Id throw up cannons only if the muta harassment is consistent and your opponent seems committed to it.

It's very important to not let your opponent contain you. You need to either harass, attack or scout during this time because your opponent may very well take every open expo (and macro like crazy) if you are contained. Use timing to your advantage like attack immediately after(or slightly before) blink is done.

Another good idea is to 4 gate your opponent if he techs straight to mutas or get an early expo
Yeah in my last Z game I went blink and I suddenly felt much safer. I'll get armor, that's smart.

The build I'm currently practicing and using against zerg is warpgate and cyber and then fast expand (without pressuring Z, attack when I get 3 or 4 warpgates) at around 30 food. So far it's worked 9 times out of 10 or something, the only time it didn't work was when I failed to realize my opponent didn't fast expand and he killed me with 1 base roach (and it was on Xel Naga caverns lol).

I know it's supposed to be 2 gate pressure. I should probably do that instead right?

Currently what's really wrong with my macro is that I don't use warpgates as soon as the cycle ends at mid game. I need to learn to look at the warpgate button on the right side of the screen.
Edited by thiru - 10/9/10 at 5:28pm
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post #2763 of 25319
I could use some hints on this PvP. I really wonder why I lost this game. It is a practice game against 800 toss. I had better macro (some supply blocks but not really game changing), more colossi and we were 1/1 vs 0/2 in upgrades. Yet he totally owned me in the final battle. There probably was a timing window when I could have attacked, but didn't because I was afraid of force fields. Maybe I could have harassed more with the back entrance to his base. Anyway I was ahead econ and army-wise and got totally obliterated. Any clues?

Edit: @thiru: I think your macro is pretty good for a silver player from what i remember, but it's generally just macro what's holding you back up to 1200+ diamond. I don't lose PvZ so if you're on EU give me a shout and I'll give you some tips. Btw if there are any good zergs on US I'd really like to play them.
Edited by poroboszcz - 10/9/10 at 5:40pm
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post #2764 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by poroboszcz View Post
I could use some hints on this PvP. I really wonder why I lost this game. It is a practice game against 800 toss. I had better macro (some supply blocks but not really game changing), more colossi and we were 1/1 vs 0/2 in upgrades. Yet he totally owned me in the final battle. There probably was a timing window when I could have attacked, but didn't because I was afraid of force fields. Maybe I could have harassed more with the back entrance to his base. Anyway I was ahead econ and army-wise and got totally obliterated. Any clues?

Edit: @thiru: I think your macro is pretty good for a silver player from what i remember, but it's generally just macro what's holding you back up to 1200+ diamond. I don't lose PvZ so if you're on EU give me a shout and I'll give you some tips. Btw if there are any good zergs on US I'd really like to play them.
I'm no expert but I think it's the 4 immortals.

I don't really lose PvZ either because not everyone goes heavy muta or does light muta harass effectively, but when they do it's really annoying.

edit: and yeah I'd ask but when I'm in game I usually can't think of anything in particular
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post #2765 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklobsta1109 View Post
I need serious help as protoss, I started as zerg and moved to the toss. Im still a crappy bronze player though.
You're probably not as bad as me. I only play Zerg and I absolutely suck against any Protoss player who has any skill. I almost feel like taunting the Protoss players I actually beat. Only good thing I can say about my game is I seldom lose against Terran. Good Zerg players usually beat me, though not as bad as the Protoss guys do.
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post #2766 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by thiru View Post
Well BigFan (Z), Tchernobyl (Z) and I (P) played a FFA... I won even though they pretty much only attacked me. Watching the replay reveals why: from 10 minutes to the end of the game, I had more workers than you two combined, and had the weakest army for the first dozen minutes. This is FFA, where it's not too risky to expand and focus on economy. Enemies will always start worrying when they leave the other players alone too long and retreat after dealing damage.
LIES! LIES! lol, seriously though, you are almost correct. You attacked me, I tried to strike back at your mineral line with mutalisks, but, you had some pc and stalkers nearby. Then I got attacked by Tchernobyl with his mass mutalisks and was able to repel him, although, he took my 2nd exp out, since, I just got it started. I kept on spreading creep and did some scouting of your base. I did see a carrier and some stalkers, thus, I tried to mass corruptors, but, was running out of resources and then you struck. It was too late to make more defense and I wasn't expecting a mothership to cloak, although, I did make some overseers to see your units, but, I wasn't able to micro them to attack other units due to the messy battle and you know the rest I was starting to get worried, but, I assumed you were massing zealots+stalkers+sentries and coming soon enough. I had no clue what Tchernobyl was up to, since, I didn't scout him base out. I was also hesitant to expand further. Mistakes: Not enough scouting and messed up my macro(less mineral intake than optimal).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucas Lamer View Post
You're probably not as bad as me. I only play Zerg and I absolutely suck against any Protoss player who has any skill. I almost feel like taunting the Protoss players I actually beat. Only good thing I can say about my game is I seldom lose against Terran. Good Zerg players usually beat me, though not as bad as the Protoss guys do.
protoss are harder to deal with than terran since fungal growth+banenlings are great vs. MMM ball
    
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post #2767 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by thiru View Post
Yeah in my last Z game I went blink and I suddenly felt much safer. I'll get armor, that's smart.

The build I'm currently practicing and using against zerg is warpgate and cyber and then fast expand (without pressuring Z, attack when I get 3 or 4 warpgates) at around 30 food. So far it's worked 9 times out of 10 or something, the only time it didn't work was when I failed to realize my opponent didn't fast expand and he killed me with 1 base roach (and it was on Xel Naga caverns lol).

I know it's supposed to be 2 gate pressure. I should probably do that instead right?

Currently what's really wrong with my macro is that I don't use warpgates as soon as the cycle ends at mid game. I need to learn to look at the warpgate button on the right side of the screen.
You can also build your first pylon at your natural expo then throw up a forge and cannon immediately. If your opponent does a 6 pool you would probably be screwed though.

And what are you comparing the 2gate to? A 1 gate?

As far as upgrades, I like to get the damage upgrade first if I am going against a smaller army of powerful/massive units; and get the armor upgrade against mass high dps units or splash dmging units.

This is the fast expo I like to go with vs zerg:
9 pylon @ expo (try to block with buildings of course)
12 forge
16 cannon
Pylon
Nexus
Gateway
Assimilator
the rest is up to what you want to do

Constantly warping in units will take some repetitive practice. Use hotkeys!!
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post #2768 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by poroboszcz View Post
I could use some hints on this PvP. I really wonder why I lost this game. It is a practice game against 800 toss. I had better macro (some supply blocks but not really game changing), more colossi and we were 1/1 vs 0/2 in upgrades. Yet he totally owned me in the final battle. There probably was a timing window when I could have attacked, but didn't because I was afraid of force fields. Maybe I could have harassed more with the back entrance to his base. Anyway I was ahead econ and army-wise and got totally obliterated. Any clues?

Edit: @thiru: I think your macro is pretty good for a silver player from what i remember, but it's generally just macro what's holding you back up to 1200+ diamond. I don't lose PvZ so if you're on EU give me a shout and I'll give you some tips. Btw if there are any good zergs on US I'd really like to play them.
I tried opening the replay but this is the error I got
"The launch of this game makes reference to mod or map dependencies which are no longer available"
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post #2769 of 25319
We should do a massive OCN FFA >_>
post #2770 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by poroboszcz View Post
I could use some hints on this PvP. I really wonder why I lost this game. It is a practice game against 800 toss. I had better macro (some supply blocks but not really game changing), more colossi and we were 1/1 vs 0/2 in upgrades. Yet he totally owned me in the final battle. There probably was a timing window when I could have attacked, but didn't because I was afraid of force fields. Maybe I could have harassed more with the back entrance to his base. Anyway I was ahead econ and army-wise and got totally obliterated. Any clues?
At the time of the final push, he was 2/0/0 while you were only 1/0/0 - your 2nd upgrade wasn't quite finished, and luckily for him he pushed at the right time. Despite the fact that you were both around ~170 supply, the fact that he had immortals and zealot leg speed tipped the scales in his favor. His zealots were able to charge in and keep your army tightly clumped for his colossi, while your zealots got caught in the back of your army. He simply had better army positioning that made a close fight look one-sided.

It looks like your macro was pretty solid the whole game; it just came down to a micro/unit spread issue at the end. Both sentry FF and zealot leg speed complement colossi and help to keep things clumped, so if you had worked one or the other into your army you could have turned the tables.

I'm by no means an expert, but those are a couple of things I noticed skipping through the replay for the first time.
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