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[Official] Starcraft 2 Strategy & Discussion Thread - Page 434

post #4331 of 25319
case on point: painuser vs mano1way tvt on deltaq. Siege tank vs siege tank lines with nukes.
    
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post #4332 of 25319
I think it was Jinro. 48~ min game on Delta? That **** was NUTS!!!!
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post #4333 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFan View Post
It's not that bad, really. I mean yes, it's a constant slings+blings for a while, but, if you can get the upper hand and get some mutas before him it's pretty much gg. Blings are also great against mass slings, blings and hydras, so, you only have to worry about mutas(leave some hydras+ 1-2 spores in base) as well as BLs and ultralisks which I haven't seen yet against another Z. I'll admit thought that the ZvsZ games I've played, it's a struggle to win and my APM usually reaches the highest I've ever hit(81-82 avg by end of game) but when you win at the end, it feels great


So, you're telling me that TvsT or PvsP isn't somewhat similar to ZvsZ? Yes, ZvsZ is more apm intensive due to having to micro your army well to avoid losing all your slings to some blings and fending off the constant attacks especially if your opponent has the upper hand, however, I can only assume TvsT and PvsP are *almost* as irritating since the strategies are similar for the most part
Just like Doomdash I picked up a different race for 1v1 just because of ZvZ. In 1400+ diamond, games rarely go past 12 minutes. It's a bling/sling fest and the slightest mistake is GG. I understand that mistakes are what make games, but in PvP and TvT you can afford some mistakes without throwing the game.

In ZvZ, you can lose the game with 1 bad click. It's far too precarious and RNG based, you can lose to a complete noob if he's lucky.

PvP has some pretty good diversity for a mirror match, I'd say. Common strats:
  • 2 Gate proxy
  • 4-5 gate T1 push
  • 3 Gate / Immortal / Colossus tech
  • Void ray push
  • DT rush (lol)
    
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post #4334 of 25319
You forgot korean 4gate
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post #4335 of 25319
Yeah PvP is also just way way better than ZvZ. ZvZ is worse than SC1 ZvZ some how. I still to this day swear up and down Zerg is the most fitting race for my play style yet I can't get over how awful ZvZ is.

Also for PvP I've seen Phoenix / Immortal builds. Hard counter to Colossi stalker.

Also those popular korean fast blink stalker, and now white-ra's fast warpgate warp prism timing pushes.
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post #4336 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by thiru View Post
You forgot korean 4gate
You're talking about proxy warps?

I consider those mega cheese really, few ways to counter it easily.
Edited by Lazorbeam - 11/5/10 at 6:20am
    
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post #4337 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomDash View Post
Yes I'm telling you that ZvZ is garbage. TvT is like the most methodical slowly played out game. People use nukes to move siege tank lines and hit, ect. Air battles for vision... gets nuts. No 1 base baneling bs. Baneling ruins ZvZ for me. Like I've been saying for ages I just hate the baneling.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I hate TvT more than I hate . I would rather have ZvZ all day than ONE TvT. With ZvZ, you got quick awesomely played micro war or race to muta war or mineral line box (with evo chambers and spawning pool and queen) than the LOOONG ass terran wall ins with tanks and turrets or thors or the straight up tank+viking mass up and and slow crawl for EVERY FREEKING INCH OF THE FREEKIN MAP. The game gets boring quick. and for saying that one small mistake cant cost you? well, if you unsiege at the wrong time bam, ur gone. Not only is it boring, but the stress level is just as high just by anxiety alone.

Z v Z is a lot more ACTION oriented than TvT, which is why I play this game.

Maybe its because i play random that I fell this way, but to be honest my TvT matchup may not be the greatest since it doesnt happen very often (when im terran, my opponent is usually protoss) but about 99% of the times, this is what happens in TVT

1. Go marine marauders with stim and take out your opponent quick with a drop or a timing push before he gets siege mode

2. BE the one who makes siege tanks and vikings and fight for air superiority while advancing with a handfull of tanks. Eventually when you get more vikings in the air, take out his, THEN proceed to land them in the tank line or in the other`s base. (most maps encourage this than others).

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooring.....
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post #4338 of 25319
Well since you have very little TvT experience, and you are in Platinum ( high or not ), I'm just going to say that you probably aren't familiar enough / good enough at the match up to know how good it is. I play 100% Terran in ladder, and I've had plenty of TvT's, and the match up is far far more dynamic than any other mirror match up period. PvP has recently been coming close, and has gotten much better... but if you like ZvZ you probably just like the game for different reasons than I do.

Go watch Jinro vs ManOfOneway on delta right now, that game is like a work of frickin art.
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post #4339 of 25319
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevaziah View Post
With ZvZ, you got quick awesomely played micro war or race to muta war or mineral line box (with evo chambers and spawning pool and queen)

The game gets boring quick. and for saying that one small mistake cant cost you? well, if you unsiege at the wrong time bam, ur gone. Not only is it boring, but the stress level is just as high just by anxiety alone.
You'll get owned with this muta strat in diamond. Only players with inhuman micro can manage to use these kind of builds.

Unsieging tanks is done at the 20 minute mark or whatever, and you can unsiege a few at a time.

A single baneling can blow up an entire zerg army 10 minutes in and finish the match (actually this is how it usually goes down). Slings and blings on creep move REALLY fast so mistakes are easy to make.
    
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post #4340 of 25319
I hate all mirror matchups, I do pretty well mindyou.
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