Overclock.net › Forums › Video Games › PC Gaming › [Official] Guild Wars 2 Discussion, Video & Screenshot Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Official] Guild Wars 2 Discussion, Video & Screenshot Thread - Page 335

post #3341 of 10385
I think this might be too soon personally. I'm not sure if 2 months is enough time to fix some of the problems. Like making the engine optimized (it still only uses 30% of my GPU), fixing all the camera issues (see spoilers below), fixing the pets bugs which make pet classes essentially broken, and working on pvp class balance a bit.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I feel that fixing the camera-related issues is the most important change Arena Net could possibly make. Making movement, and specifically the way the camera behaves, as natural as possible is the key to making the entire game feel _right_ while making it an enjoyable experience for everyone.

*Please Arena-net (in order of importance):*
* Remove the camera acceleration and camera snap (make camera movement 100% linear with mouse movement). This should be priority number one; players don't like playing games with non-responsive/laggy feeling cameras.
* Remove the smart-follow feature (aka, auto-follow or auto-face) or add an option to disable it
* Allow players to zoom the camera out more
* Increase the Field of Vision or add a FOV slider.
* Fix the 'camera glitch' that causes the camera to suddenly move a great distance and then reset the cursor to the middle of the screen.
* Increase the speed that the A and D keys turn the character/camera and remove the acceleration.
* Add an option to 'lock' the camera to the mouse (like it is when the RMB is held down) at all times and have a modifier key (like shift) bring up the free-moving cursor in-order to interact with the game world.
* Allow the camera to be zoomed out while the right-mouse-button is held down

For more details on each bullet point, please keep reading.


*Camera acceleration*, also know as camera smoothing, is when the movement of the camera is exponential (ie, it scales with mouse speed) rather than linear (ie, mouse movement is transferred perfectly to camera movement). To make this easier to understand, here's an example of camera acceleration: If you hold the right mouse button and move your mouse 1 inch at an extremely slow speed, the camera will turn about 15 degrees; If you move your mouse 1 inch at an extremely fast speed, the camera will turn about 360 degrees. It's scaling, or accelerating, the camera rotation based on mouse movement speed. In a linear movement system (one without camera acceleration), the camera would turn the same amount in that 1 inch, independent and unaffected by mouse speed. The majority of gamers strongly dislike camera acceleration, in fact, if you search the web, you will see most gamers will actually go out of their way to turn it off or remove if possible. Camera acceleration makes precise camera movement nearly impossible, especially at faster mouse speeds. It also makes the camera feel sluggish and unresponsive at slower mouse speeds.

*Camera snap* is the exaggerated camera rotation that happens when the game sees the mouse turning the camera at a very fast speed, it's closely related to camera acceleration. When the game picks up on this aggressive mouse movement, it will try to predict camera movement and then suddenly 'snap' the camera ~60 degrees to where it thinks you're trying to turn it to. This makes camera movement extremely unpredictable.

*+Solution+*: Keep camera acceleration and camera snapping on by default but add an option to disable it. This way, the very small minority of casual gamers that like this feature (because they dislike having to move their mouse hand as much) will have it on when they start the game up. The more advanced majority of players can then go into the options to disable this since they are more comfortable with the options menu in games and they would actually know what these options would do.


*Auto-face* (also known as Smart-follow or Auto-follow), is the automatic repositioning of the camera to be behind the character when moving. The problem with Auto-face is it severely limits a players ability to look around the world while moving without physically turning their characters body too. For example, if I'm running away from something, with the current system i can't turn my camera around while running away to select things (or aim AoE skills behind me) without the camera automatically turning back around to face forward.

*+Solution+*: Again, keep this feature left on by default for the casual players that aren't comfortable with the options menu, but add an option so more advanced players can disable this feature.


*Camera zoom* is the maximum distance away from the character that the camera can be set to. Ideal camera distance really just comes down to personal preference. Most players coming from an MMO background would prefer to be able to zoom the camera out significantly more than is currently allowed. Having the camera so close to the character can actually cause physical motion sickness in some players.

*+Solution+*: Add a 'camera distance' slider in the options menu so players can pick their preferred max camera distance. This is the ideal method of increasing the max camera distance instead of just allowing players to zoom the camera out more by default. I think increasing the max camera distance by 50% would be a good starting point, further would be ideal so players can pick what they like, but i can see how having it set too far can give some players an unfair advantage or cause frame rate problems or graphical problems (specifically with height collision).


*Field of Vision* is the extent of the observable game world that is seen on the display at any given moment. Currently GW2 has a very narrow FOV that can't be changed. The problem with a narrow and unrealistic FoV is that it induces a feeling of tunnel vision. This can lead to headaches, eye-strain, nausea, and other symptoms of motion sickness. Not only does increasing the FoV alleviate these symptoms, it also makes the game look more natural and increases the level of immersion. "Here's":https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/suggestions/Camera-Issues-Wish-list-and-Compilation/page/4#post222793 a good post in this thread that shows why an increased FoV is important.

*+Solution+*: Add a Field of Vision slider in options with a numerical read-out in degrees so players can pick a FoV that doesn't make them feel sick and also makes the game world look more natural. Even if increasing the FoV causes graphical issues i feel it should still be implemented. Most players that do suffer from motion sickness at narrow FoV's would probably prefer looking at the graphical anomalies than feel sick while playing.


The *Camera Glitch* causes the camera to suddenly shift a great distance with very little actual user input and then resets the cursor to the middle of the screen. This issue is difficult to describe so I'll just post these two videos to demonstrate:
"Guild Wars 2 camera glitch - BWE2":http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDfi7gmKo88&feature=youtu.be
"Guild Wars 2 camera glitch - BWE1":http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VoR63vO6yE
Also refer to Baxuz.1943 thread, Mouse Camera spinning out of control, found "here":https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/support/bugs/Mouse-camera-spinning-out-of-control/page/1#post193112.

*+Solution+*: Unfortunately there isn't an easy solution for this problem. It will require extensive bug checking and/or some recoding of the camera algorithm.


*The A and D keys* currently turn the player and camera at a very slow rate for whatever reason. This turn rate is completely unrealistic and uncomfortable to play with. The current turn speed makes the A and D keys completely worthless for both combat and navigation. There's also a great deal of acceleration with both the A and D keys. When first pressed it takes 2-3 seconds until they turn the character at the maximum speed.

*+Solution+*: Simply increase the turn rate for the A and D keys to about double what they're currently set at. The turn rate should be fast enough for the player to run in a tight circle (so a diameter of about one body length) while holding both W+A.


*Locked Camera*
In some third-person games (especially third-person shooter games), the camera is by default 'locked' to the mouse such that the right-mouse-button doesn't have to be constantly held down to turn the camera (and by extension the character). This makes moving the camera seem a lot more natural, especially in a fast-paced RPG like GW2 where movement and positioning is so important. It also can eliminate hand fatigue as well as the potential of developing carpal tunnel by not requiring the player to constantly hold the right-mouse-button at all times.

*+Solution+*:
Consider adding an option to lock the camera to the mouse. When this mode is enabled, it would also enable a secondary keybind (for example, 'shift' by default), When held down, this key would temporarily unlock the camera from the mouse and bring up a cursor that would allow players to still interact with the world when needed. Also, whenever a menu is open that requires the cursor (such as the Trading Post, the inventory, the loot window, dialogue/NPC interaction, etc) the mouse would automatically become temporarily unlocked and would automatically become locked again when the menu is closed.


*Please Arena-net*, I want this game to succeed as i think it has the best foundation of any MMO I've ever played. However, i feel that the current camera and movement system will turn a lot of players away, especially the more "skilled" or experienced player-base that are picky with game feel and responsiveness.

If anyone has anything else to add related to the camera (or player-control related to the camera), please feel free to post here.

Thank you biggrin.gif

post #3342 of 10385
Thread Starter 
according to some CBT leaks the camera issues have been worked out(and they're experimenting with a first person view), along with several other problems. there's a new guild system
(even though the old one was robust) and overhauls to mob telegraphing as well according to a recent interview.
post #3343 of 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLCLimax View Post

according to some CBT leaks the camera issues have been worked out(and they're experimenting with a first person view), along with several other problems. there's a new guild system
(even though the old one was robust) and overhauls to mob telegraphing as well according to a recent interview.
Do you have a link pretty please? biggrin.gif
post #3344 of 10385
Thread Starter 
post history,
post #3345 of 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLCLimax View Post

post history,
I went through your post history and don't see any links talking about camera changes.
post #3346 of 10385
2 full months to go, and I would bet at least 20 cookies that it will launch better than D3...
See Pee Yoo
(17 items)
 
Lian Mi
(12 items)
 
Craptop
(5 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
2500k asrock extreme4 980ti corsair vengeance  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial m3 seagate green lg dvdrw Noctua D14 
OSMonitorMonitorPower
win 7 64bit 2 x 1920 x 1080p (ASUS and LG) xl2420te ocz zx 1000w 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
haf bx g600 / / Roccat Savu Puretrak Talent Soundblaster Z 
Audio
sennheiser hd558 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
celereon g1610 g1 sniper m3 parema seagate barracuda 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
dvdrw windows vista vizio 3d tv rosewill green 530 
CaseMouse
lian li pc v354b logitech g300 
CPUGraphicsHard DriveOS
4810MQ GTX 870M samsung evo  Windows 8.1 
Other
Sager 8728 
  hide details  
Reply
See Pee Yoo
(17 items)
 
Lian Mi
(12 items)
 
Craptop
(5 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
2500k asrock extreme4 980ti corsair vengeance  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Crucial m3 seagate green lg dvdrw Noctua D14 
OSMonitorMonitorPower
win 7 64bit 2 x 1920 x 1080p (ASUS and LG) xl2420te ocz zx 1000w 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
haf bx g600 / / Roccat Savu Puretrak Talent Soundblaster Z 
Audio
sennheiser hd558 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
celereon g1610 g1 sniper m3 parema seagate barracuda 
Optical DriveOSMonitorPower
dvdrw windows vista vizio 3d tv rosewill green 530 
CaseMouse
lian li pc v354b logitech g300 
CPUGraphicsHard DriveOS
4810MQ GTX 870M samsung evo  Windows 8.1 
Other
Sager 8728 
  hide details  
Reply
post #3347 of 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickles View Post

2 full months to go, and I would bet at least 20 cookies that it will launch better than D3...

I see your 20 and raise you 100. Anet knows their s***....they have always been high quality.
reQuiem
(16 items)
 
  
Reply
reQuiem
(16 items)
 
  
Reply
post #3348 of 10385
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickles View Post

2 full months to go, and I would bet at least 20 cookies that it will launch better than D3...

no need for such fanboyism.
post #3349 of 10385
I wonder if anyone from Anet is registered to these forums....that would be cool.
reQuiem
(16 items)
 
  
Reply
reQuiem
(16 items)
 
  
Reply
post #3350 of 10385
we'll see how launch goes.
My System
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4770K @ 4.7ghz Gigabyte Z87X-UD4H EVGA GTX 980TI ACX 2.0  8GB G.Skill Trident X 2400 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB 3TB Toshiba  3TB Toshiba Custom Water 
OSMonitorPowerCase
Window 7 Ultimate 64 bit HP 23xi Corsair HX750i Phanteks Enthoo Luxe 
Mouse
Logitech G600 
  hide details  
Reply
My System
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4770K @ 4.7ghz Gigabyte Z87X-UD4H EVGA GTX 980TI ACX 2.0  8GB G.Skill Trident X 2400 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 830 SSD 128GB 3TB Toshiba  3TB Toshiba Custom Water 
OSMonitorPowerCase
Window 7 Ultimate 64 bit HP 23xi Corsair HX750i Phanteks Enthoo Luxe 
Mouse
Logitech G600 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: PC Gaming
Overclock.net › Forums › Video Games › PC Gaming › [Official] Guild Wars 2 Discussion, Video & Screenshot Thread