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[Official] The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Information and Discussion Thread - Page 298

post #2971 of 12885
So I just played whack-a-mole with a group of East Shipping guards. Was actually fairly entertaining. Them being the whackers and me being the klepto mole with a legendary daedric dagger dual enchanted with lightning and soul trap hell bent on teleporting behind them and slitting their throats or slicing off their heads. Game didn't last very long though. Don't you hate noobs who can't play the game? frown.gif
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post #2972 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by allan871 View Post

Never played Elder Scroll before but really tempted to try Skyrim because of this song..

Try is the wrong word. The word you are looking for is experience. If I had the money I'd but it for you to show you what I mean.
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post #2973 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by EfemaN View Post

.
I quoted this again from a couple pages ago, I didn't get an answer for it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xFyre View Post

That is an impressive post, thanks! Still, my cards frequently go all the way up to 99% in Skyrim. I pointed out Whiterun in my post because I was getting low fps without complete GPU usage.
Even if, say, I get 100FPS with both cards at 99%, then disable SLI and go back into the game, I'll still get the same framerate with just one card.
Quote:
Originally Posted by noahhova View Post

That makes sense. Its CPU intensive on 2 cores. Since it only uses 2 threads, the game is sensitive to clock speeds. Since most ppl are CPU bounds on Ultra settings (Vanilla) any extra clock speeds are very effective to increase frames per second.
The reason your GPU isn't 100% is the 2 cores on your 920 can't feed you card info fast enough hense the bottleneck. Unless your chip can go faster then 4.0Ghz its just the way the game was coded. (Really should use 4 cores or 3 at least. It is 2011)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dooginater View Post

Just wanted to add to the SLI debate that seems to be going on.
I'm Oc'd to 4.2 Ghz, when in sli mode, my cards never get above 45% usage, single gpu maxes out at 99%. Pretty sure the cpu isn't the bottleneck. Any sli profile fixes (like for witcher 2) out that I don't know about or maybe even an ini mod to help juice these bad boys up. Seems silly for me to get anything less than 60fps at all times. ^_~

First off, Doogs, if you don't disable the frame limiter, you will limit your GPU usage. So in most cases, that will be why your usage is lower than 99%.

One place that actually taxes my GPU's is indoors at Fort Amol (I think it's called). It's a ways just to the southeast of Whiterun, you probably have a map marker for it if you took the main road from Whiterun to Ivergard (Greybeard/7000 steps portion of the main quest). Try clearing that whole Fort, the building w/the Enchant and Alchemy benches in it gives me full 99% GPU usage.

If you cant' find that particular Fort, there's another Fort that's just a bit to the west of the watchtower where you have your first dragon battle in the main quest. I don't recall what it's called, but some of the indoor areas of that Fort will also give me 99% GPU usage, and 30-ish FPS.

You might try going to one of these two places, just so you can see that there actually are parts of this game that will tax your cards capabilities thumb.gif

However, it appears as though EVERYONE is getting low FPS/low GPU usage problems in certain parts of the large towns, looking in certain directions. (this is true for everyone except OCN'er Dustin1 ... I'm still trying to figure out his rig's magical properties ... but he won't let me eat it to find out frown.gif)

Two examples where this occurs: The beginning of Solitude, by the shops, looking down the main street ...and in Whiterun, looking down on the big tree in the middle of town from the path up to the Jarl's palace.

Noah, your explanation about a CPU BN in this game does make sense in some scenarios (such as with Efeman's case), but have a gander at Xfyres post above. Note that there's something about it that doesn't 'add up' in terms of the problem with Skyrim being entirely a CPU BN in all cases.

He says that he gets 100fps w/99% gpu usage on both cards in SLI, but then when he disables SLI, he still gets the 100fps, and (it seems safe to presume) the same 99% gpu usage on the one card.

Follow my logic here real quick:

Let's say that we accept that the base setup of his (the CPU + one GPU) is capable of running the game at 100fps, and in this scenario, the GPU usage is at 99%. He's definitely implied that this is the case, correct?

Given this 99% usage observation, we would normally logically presume that, unless we've achieved a rare singularity where the CPU and GPU FPS limits are identical, we are being limited by the GPU, correct?

Furthermore, we could also logically presume, based on the above, that two of his cards in SLI should be able to run the game at around 170fps (assuming 70% SLI scaling), correct?

However, his two cards in SLI still only run 100fps!

Given the same100fps w/two cards as well as with one, it now seems logical to presume that (despite the rarity of this coincidence) the 100fps exactly represents both a CPU AND a single GPU-bottlenecked scenario, wouldn't you agree?

So, given this set of logical presumptions, you can probably see where the problem arises w/the 'simple CPU BN' explanation wink.gif

As we established above, we *should* be able to assume that the two cards in SLI would be capable of 170-ish FPS. BUT ... we're stuck at 100fps, and we've already logically deduced that is due to that being the CPU's FPS limit, right?

So ... WHY is he still seeing 99% GPU usage on both cards in SLI, when they should be capable of 170fps, but are being held down to 100FPS based on a CPU bottleneck holding us back? Shouldn't his cards in SLI be at more like 60%, given that 1 card at 100fps is at 99%?

Bottom-line, the fact that the user is getting 100 FPS and 99% GPU usage, both in SLI and with a single card ... is downright bizarre. And this set of observations is counter-representative of a typical CPU BN situation.

Rather, it's a vexing and illogical phenomenon that's non-consistent with EITHER a CPU or GPU bottleneck.

My conclusion is that this game and/or the nvidia drivers have some kind of glitch that is hindering performance in this game in strange and unique ways. And my tests show that, at least in some parts of the game, their are problems with both SLI, and with single cards.
Edited by brettjv - 12/2/11 at 4:24pm
    
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post #2974 of 12885
So I assigned Susanna the Wicket as my body guard after summoning her back from the dead, empowered her to be the perfect Follower, and had her tag along. She actually has some pretty funny lines. I will let you guys experiment if you want and won't spoil anything.
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post #2975 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by OC'ing Noob View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by EfemaN View Post

The only bug I've experience in 1.2 are the glitching dragons; I've seen some fly backwards, stay flying but in one spot, or zip around at incredible speed. I just pretend they're on Red Bull.
I quoted this again from a couple pages ago, I didn't get an answer for it.

Have you tried the 4GB patch?

Yeah, I definitely have an LAA executable running
Quote:
Originally Posted by noahhova View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by EfemaN View Post

The only bug I've experience in 1.2 are the glitching dragons; I've seen some fly backwards, stay flying but in one spot, or zip around at incredible speed. I just pretend they're on Red Bull.
I quoted this again from a couple pages ago, I didn't get an answer for it.

That makes sense. Its CPU intensive on 2 cores. Since it only uses 2 threads, the game is sensitive to clock speeds. Since most ppl are CPU bounds on Ultra settings (Vanilla) any extra clock speeds are very effective to increase frames per second.

The reason your GPU isn't 100% is the 2 cores on your 920 can't feed you card info fast enough hense the bottleneck. Unless your chip can go faster then 4.0Ghz its just the way the game was coded. (Really should use 4 cores or 3 at least. It is 2011)

If only it could at least max out the CPU while it still has framerate to gain... it's funny to think that, in one or two CPU refreshes, when the "regular" OC may reach 5+ GHz, people will still be gaining minimum FPS in this game tongue.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post

snip

Solid post, but I think you may have confused what you were responding to; noah had quoted me, and my situation wasn't SLI-related.

I see what you mean. However, there are Skyrim benchmarking articles seeing ~%80 scaling for both Nvidia and AMD. Whoever you're referring to is an anomaly.
Edited by EfemaN - 12/2/11 at 4:06pm
post #2976 of 12885
I think I'm gonna make a new character and try to make him as weird as possible. Thinking about a heavy armor wearing lizard who specializes in conjuring and summoning lol. What do yall think?
post #2977 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by EfemaN View Post

Solid post, but I think you may have confused what you were responding to; noah had quoted me, and my situation wasn't SLI-related.
I see what you mean. However, there are Skyrim benchmarking articles seeing ~%80 scaling for both Nvidia and AMD. Whoever you're referring to is an anomaly.

Oops, you're totally right ... It was xfyre's experience with SLI (somewhat paradoxically) I was referring to. Anyways, I fixed my post, and basically re-wrote my logic to make my point more clear thumb.gif

Although I've yet to do my formal/proper 'CPU bottleneck' testing on the troublesome spots of the game (Solitude, Whiterun, etc... which I'll be doing tomorrow), my preliminary testing last week suggested that there's something MORE strange going on w/the performance of this game aside from just CPU BN's. I'm predicting that proper testing is going to prove it thumb.gif

Edit: Looking back at your original question one thing I can tell you is: you are FAR, FAR, FAR from being alone in having this issue. I have it too (in case you didn't reckon that), as do at least 10 others that've posted on OCN over the past couple of weeks, and at least another 20 people on other forums I've seen since I started trying to troubleshoot the issue.

I'm going to start a 'definitive Low FPS/Low GPU Usage in Skyrim' thread in the nV forums tomorrow, and post my research there. I'll post a link in this thread as well.

But like I said above (although I don't want to taint my research w/presumptions) I am somewhat suspicious that this 40fps w/75% GPU usage problem in the big towns may actually NOT be (entirely) caused by a CPU BN, at least not with your average CPU setup on OCN (i.e. a first-gen i7 at 4.0GHz, like I have).

And the thing that makes me most suspicious is that OCN'er Dustin1 has posted screenies for me showing that he can get 70fps (and 99% usage) in these troublesome spots, whereas I can only get around 38fps. Although he has a Sandy (and didn't tell me his clocks), there is simply no way that someone could be pulling down 80% higher FPS than me due entirely to CPU, when I'm running a 930 at 4.0GHz. No CPU in existence (unless it's under LN2) is 80% more powerful than mine.

Additionally, I've seen the exact same glitch (with a similar 40fps limit) reported by other people running Sandy's.
Edited by brettjv - 12/2/11 at 5:26pm
    
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post #2978 of 12885
What's everyone's favorite dragon kill? My favorite one has to be when my follower Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Cicero, the insane nutcase
took down a dragon and I got all the credit. I was near Dawnstar and the dragon came swooping in. I told him to attack it and I just ran towards the city since I only had a bow with a few arrows (I tend to sell everything I get and run low at times) and he kept getting messed up on the way over. Once I get to Dawnstar the guards and my follower start fighting the dragon and I just take a few shots at it with my bow (when I ran out I just looted dead guards haha). In the end, it flies over to a path near the Dawnstar and is finished off by a passing Mage on her way to somewhere, I forget.

Why is it my favorite? I did pretty much nothing, got the soul, the scales and etc., and in the end everyone is giving me praise for running away and observing the encounter lol. I've had dragon's get finished off by many different other factors, but this was my favorite since I didn't have to do anything to get the soul.
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post #2979 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by =Tac= View Post

What's everyone's favorite dragon kill? My favorite one has to be when my follower Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Cicero, the insane nutcase
took down a dragon and I got all the credit. I was near Dawnstar and the dragon came swooping in. I told him to attack it and I just ran towards the city since I only had a bow with a few arrows (I tend to sell everything I get and run low at times) and he kept getting messed up on the way over. Once I get to Dawnstar the guards and my follower start fighting the dragon and I just take a few shots at it with my bow (when I ran out I just looted dead guards haha). In the end, it flies over to a path near the Dawnstar and is finished off by a passing Mage on her way to somewhere, I forget.

Why is it my favorite? I did pretty much nothing, got the soul, the scales and etc., and in the end everyone is giving me praise for running away and observing the encounter lol. I've had dragon's get finished off by many different other factors, but this was my favorite since I didn't have to do anything to get the soul.

Mine just happened last night. I fast traveled to the area where Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
the blood dragon is asleep along the top of the word wall at Shearpoint. I didn't know there was a dragon there so that was a surprise. I shot him with an arrow and he flew to where the rocks are piled up. I would hide behind the rocks, pop up and take a shot and duck back down before he could hit me with his breath. Finally killed him and approached the dragon wall where the dragon priest Krosis appeared. This was my 1st encounter with a dragon priest btw. It took awhile but I finally took him out and got the Mask of Krosis.
post #2980 of 12885
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post

snip

I'll be paying attention to this thread for the link to your testing; I don't remember a game that has this incredible of a change in FPS due to clock speed and adjacent CPU architectures. I'd be glad to help you give data as well; we're running essentially the same CPU setup, except I dropped mine back down to 3.8GHz w/ speedstep and power-saving features for the winter.

I will say that I think the CPU is playing a big role in this... I can give you a screencap of where I was looking in Morthal; I gained 8 fps, with no visible drop in IQ (with screenshot comparison), from changing shadows from Ultra to High. If I remember correctly, Skyrim offloads all shadows processing to the CPU...
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