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Corsair TX series changes - what we did, why we did it, and how it affects you. - Page 10

post #91 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spct;11858074 
TheLaw,

While I am in partial agreement, the specs for the 6850 show a500w required

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150516


The 5770 require a 450w

GTX480 even more specific, Minimum of a 600 Watt power supply. (Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 42 Amps.)

From all the research i have done the lowest wattage PSU anyone suggests for a moderate gaming rig is a 650.

They massively exaggerate those numbers. Mainly because lots of people have terrible overrated PSU's.

A 6850 would be fine on a good 400W. Probably want somewhere around 500W for a GTX 480.

Nice to see some feedback from Corsair on this issue. Don't entirely agree with the CX series as it isn't top end performance in a budget sector but as long as the PSU's aren't going to catch fire while trying to output their rated wattage I'm not that bothered. I would like to see them all reviewed though - not that bothered about these TX units as long as their performance is very similar to the older models. It would be nice to know about the changes on products before it happens as if you don't publicly state what you're doing it leads to all sorts of rumours flying around.
Edited by Fusion Racing - 1/1/11 at 7:38pm
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post #92 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spct View Post
TheLaw,

While I am in partial agreement, the specs for the 6850 show a500w required

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814150516


The 5770 require a 450w

GTX480 even more specific, Minimum of a 600 Watt power supply. (Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 42 Amps.)

From all the research i have done the lowest wattage PSU anyone suggests for a moderate gaming rig is a 650.
AMD/Nvidia grossly overrate the amount of watts you need as a safety-net (blame generic PSU's). A *moderate* gaming rig would suffice on 450w or 500w.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLaw View Post
Yep. The computer power supply is a pretty ominous subject. People don't know how they work. They don't understand how much power they need...and that can lead to a TON of faulty information and TONS of misconceptions. Unfortunately, it takes a whole lot of manpower to convince a newbie that he shouldn't get that crappy "850W" PSU and trying to convince him to get a quality 400W.
Bingo.
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post #93 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorsairGeorge View Post
But full custom rigs are a lot more expensive than the H50/H70 are. Full custom watercooling rigs aren't the competition for the H50/H70. Aircoolers are.
Very true, although there are some pre-built custom kits, like the rasa kit, that come within $20-30 of the H70 and outperform it by a good amount. In my opinion, the prices of the h50/h70 should be brought down, but, people who are afraid of building their own loop with likely go with the h50/h70 based on marketing and brand name alone.
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post #94 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Behemoth777 View Post
Very true, although there are some pre-built custom kits, like the rasa kit, that come within $20-30 of the H70 and outperform it by a good amount. In my opinion, the prices of the h50/h70 should be brought down, but, people who are afraid of building their own loop with likely go with the h50/h70 based on marketing and brand name alone.
I think a more accurate term for the Rasa kit is that it is pre-packaged, because you still have to assemble it once it is received. I was looking at that kit a few months ago too, but in my situation, I just did not want to have to mess with testing for leaks and worry about any future maintenance. The fact that I was able to get my H50 for only $60 flat on sale with free shipping, was able to set it and forget it, did not have to worry about memory heatsink clearance (coming from a TRUE120), got appreciable performance that rivals other top-end air coolers, and just looks great in my case made it money well spent.

It certainly is nowhere near as flexible or scalable like the Rasa, though, but again it wasn't what I was looking for when I was shopping for one. I'm sure one day I'll get the itch to finally pick one up, but it will have to be when I have more free time to play around with that, as it has been said by someone here that the H50 is just a gateway drug. Every day, little by little, that seems to be more and more true.
     
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post #95 of 111
I don't know if my sarcastic wit has dulled with age or you guys fail at reading comprehension.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GameBoy View Post
This comment irks the hell out of me. It's like you're saying somebody that only needs about 400w of power should settle for a far inferior product rated at 30c. High quality isn't only for people that use power hungry components.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLaw View Post
Mostly true. But some people recognize that 400W is enough to run even a midrange gaming rig. Some peeople acknowledge that you don't infact need 1kW to run a 6850, and that it can be run on decent 400W.

However, I guess those people can go buy themselves a Seasonic S12II or something and the people just interested in a cheap power supply, can get a CX430.
The problem is that when built on the same good platform, the cost and MSRP difference between different wattage units is very little. People see that they only have to pay $10-20 more for a much higher wattage unit and most will spring for the extra bit whether or not they need it now.

How can that issue be solved? You can price the higher wattage unit even higher, but then you are more expensive than your competitors and sales goes down. You can price your lower wattage units even lower, but your cost didn't go down and you end up not making any money (or losing money). You can keep pricing the same, and sell very few lower wattage units because most pay the few bucks for the higher wattage units.

Solution: Make the lower wattage unit on a cheaper platform, thus you can price it less so there is a greater gap in pricing and thus it becomes a viable choice.

Bingo!

Oh crap! You've just made a CX430!
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post #96 of 111
Even if the CX430 ends up doing what it's rated at, a PSU with around 336W on the 12v rail is not a 430w period.
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post #97 of 111
So total wattage is defined by only the +12v rail now?
post #98 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkin93 View Post
So total wattage is defined by only the +12v rail now?
Yes. Modern computers use a tiny amount of 3.3V and 5V unless you have a lot of HDDs which almost always less than 50W combined for the two rails. The rest of the PSU's capacity should be available on the 12V which means the cx430 should have something like 380W on the 12V as a minimum. There is a case to be made for PSUs designed to handle older 5V heavy systems, where much more is needed on the 5V to power the CPU. But it's clear the cx430 wasn't intended for that with only 120W combined for 3.3V and 5V where you would want at least 200W combined on those two rails for an older 5V based system.
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post #99 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkin93 View Post
So total wattage is defined by only the +12v rail now?
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post #100 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zap View Post
I don't know if my sarcastic wit has dulled with age or you guys fail at reading comprehension.







The problem is that when built on the same good platform, the cost and MSRP difference between different wattage units is very little. People see that they only have to pay $10-20 more for a much higher wattage unit and most will spring for the extra bit whether or not they need it now.

How can that issue be solved? You can price the higher wattage unit even higher, but then you are more expensive than your competitors and sales goes down. You can price your lower wattage units even lower, but your cost didn't go down and you end up not making any money (or losing money). You can keep pricing the same, and sell very few lower wattage units because most pay the few bucks for the higher wattage units.

Solution: Make the lower wattage unit on a cheaper platform, thus you can price it less so there is a greater gap in pricing and thus it becomes a viable choice.

Bingo!

Oh crap! You've just made a CX430!
Quite true. There's just an overwhelming amount of factors in the production and component/design selection of a power supply...or there seems to be, from my perspective.

I guess this was how Corsair decided they would get their expenses/profits ratio to their liking.

However, 180uF on the PFC cap is still unexcusable. My 180W Dell HEC PSU from 2001 had a 220uF Hitachi.
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