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[Examiner] GeoHot releases PS3 key, asks for job from console makers - Page 3

post #21 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingzero View Post
How are they amazing if theyve taken 4 years to figure out what is apprently so simple ?

Epic fail on the hackers part to me.
Yeah I def wouldn't call them "hotshots", maybe more of "asshats."
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post #22 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth Pyros View Post
Bleh... I get what you mean Duckie, and I'm not tossing you aside, but I still feel it was no "epic fail," at least not in regards to how well the security did its job. As simple as the encryption was, it lasted longer than any of the other consoles. After seeing the Metldr key and the random number code used to achieve getting it I don't argue that it was horribly simple to crack; even I've done more complex coding than that and I've only done basic C++ and basic Java. The security did its job. Now just over 4 years old, PS3 is (might not even if Sony's patch is successful) now going to start suffering from piracy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingzero View Post
How are they amazing if theyve taken 4 years to figure out what is apprently so simple ?

Epic fail on the hackers part to me.
It is encryption. It is NP-complete problem.

While the solution may seem simple, it can be very hard to solve regardless. If I gave you a bunch of binary and asked you to find the pattern, how long would it take to solve? You are attempting to find pattern out of intentionally nearly random values.

If someone dropped a hint, who long would it take to solve?
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post #23 of 179
Thread Starter 
it really didnt take 4 years to fully break the console. When did Sony remove "Other OS?" April 2010? minus the date its cracked = 9 months?

im sure if Sony never had Other OS it would have been cracked alot sooner but I guess everyone was focused on linux. if it works why replace it?

snippet from "TheEscapistmagazine.com
""it's believed, although not confirmed, that Sony will have trouble changing this key without rendering a lot of PS3 software inoperable. If this is true, then there may be nothing that Sony can do to prevent people running their own homebrew software"
    
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post #24 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo;11885507 
It is encryption. It is NP-complete problem.

While the solution may seem simple, it can be very hard to solve regardless. If I gave you a bunch of binary and asked you to find the pattern, how long would it take to solve? You are attempting to find pattern out of intentionally nearly random values.

If someone dropped a hint, who long would it take to solve?

We aren't talking simply binary though you can't just compare it to a problem like that.
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post #25 of 179
If you notice in the video, they didn't say "epic fail" until they got to the specific part where they detailed the FAILURE to generate a random number. All the other systems were bypassed or ineffective, but they never screamed fail until they got to a portion of the security that fell apart due to a complete lack of effective design. Obviously the PS3 had a successful history of avoiding hacks, however that doesn't mean their security design wasn't a failure.

What if that number were actually generated properly?

Evaluating the difficulty of hacking the console security or the ability of the hackers just based on how long the console has been out is silly. Unless you know how many hours they spent working on this, you really have no idea how hard it was or how long it took.
    
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post #26 of 179
I'd like to point out is that they not only hacked the PS3 but made it so that any non-modded/stock PS3 running the latest official firmware can run homebrew signed with these keys... That is what makes it such an epic fail. Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think any console has ever been hacked this wide open.
 
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post #27 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingzero View Post
We aren't talking simply binary though you can't just compare it to a problem like that.
We aren't talking about binaries? The driver and signatures are not binaries? The signature at least is a binary or a string of characters.
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post #28 of 179
And...

Quote:
The key cannot be changed without hardware modifications (firmware updates are not enough), and even doing so would render current software inoperable. In short, Sony will have a hard time fighting hacks developed with this key.
http://www.techspot.com/news/41808-h...-root-key.html
    
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post #29 of 179
I wonder if this will give way to PS2 games being back? I really hope so
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post #30 of 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by _02 View Post
If you notice in the video, they didn't say "epic fail" until they got to the specific part where they detailed the FAILURE to generate a random number. All the other systems were bypassed or ineffective, but they never screamed fail until they got to a portion of the security that fell apart due to a complete lack of effective design. Obviously the PS3 had a successful history of avoiding hacks, however that doesn't mean their security design wasn't a failure.

What if that number were actually generated properly?

Evaluating the difficulty of hacking the console security or the ability of the hackers just based on how long the console has been out is silly. Unless you know how many hours they spent working on this, you really have no idea how hard it was or how long it took.
/This. If I could give you rep, I would!

One thing I would add to the discussion is that I doubt the ps3 "scene" would be where it is today without the usb jailbreak dongle, (essentially a cloned and adapted jig-stick). It was this initial leak that (IMO) gave the hackers the impetus to really start trying to unlock the console. It's only been 4 or so months, (I think), since the usb jailbreak arrived and I'd say that's a fairly swift time-frame to discover such a gaping security flaw.

Having a jig stick that would inevitably eventually get leaked perhaps isn't a 'fail' by Sony, but as Ducky said, using such ridiculously simple encryption certainly is - especially as Sony should have known that the security lapse would become a target once the debug jig stick was released into the wild.

It will be interesting to see what Sony's response is, considering it seems as though the keys cannot be changed now...

Edit:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow_UGZ View Post
I'd like to point out is that they not only hacked the PS3 but made it so that any non-modded/stock PS3 running the latest official firmware can run homebrew signed with these keys...
Yup

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow_UGZ View Post
Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think any console has ever been hacked this wide open.
Maybe the Wii? But even that doesn't use signing by official keys... so maybe!
Edited by iceblade008 - 1/4/11 at 9:00am
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