Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [Tom's] 2.1 Channel Speaker Round-Up
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Tom's] 2.1 Channel Speaker Round-Up - Page 6

post #51 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mygaffer View Post
In the end it all comes down to each individual's ear. What sounds like crap to some people others enjoy. In the end what matters, how good something is technically or how much enjoyment you get out of it?
No, that statement is flawed, it only means that listener has never experienced high fidelity sound. If that individual has only listened to Logitechs all his life then he'll think Logitechs are the best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by milkman6453 View Post
you all must never heard of the altec lansing 2.1 speakers
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Altec-Comp...X1221/12321677
cheap and loud, that is all.
Interestingly Tom's didn't include the Altec Lansing MX6021, those would hold a candle next to the ProMedias.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FearSC549 View Post
Z-2300 sounds lifeless. No mids with bloated/boomy bass
Logitech's sound lifeless period, with the exception of Z-2300. I have never heard of a set of Logitechs that has any high frequency whatsoever. I can attest to this because I am a system builder and over the years I have heard over a dozen different sets of Logitechs in my own room (you really can't get a accurate experience if you walked into a retail shop). When I say some Logitechs are made out of cardboard I'm being modest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericld View Post
Burn in on Z-2300s. All those desktop speakers reviewed are for kiddies and people who dont know any better. Its like which pile of dog crap doesnt stink as bad.
Well, I would say the Klipsch is an exception. You can't compare PC speakers to bookshelves or floor standing speakers. If so, my Paradigm Signature S2 bookshelf's blow many setups on this forum out of the water.
Edited by AzO - 1/8/11 at 6:14pm
Shhhhh!
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i7 930 Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R XFX 5870 1GB 6GB G.SKILL PI 1600MHz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
120GB OCZ Vertex 2, 2x Hitachi 2TB (7K2000) Pioneer Blu-ray BDR-205BKS, Samsung SH-S243N Windows 7 Ultimate x64/WinXP Pro SP3 Samsung P2570 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech Elite Keyboard Corsair 850HX Lian-Li PC-B70 Logitech MX510 
Mouse Pad
Gel 
  hide details  
Reply
Shhhhh!
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i7 930 Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R XFX 5870 1GB 6GB G.SKILL PI 1600MHz 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
120GB OCZ Vertex 2, 2x Hitachi 2TB (7K2000) Pioneer Blu-ray BDR-205BKS, Samsung SH-S243N Windows 7 Ultimate x64/WinXP Pro SP3 Samsung P2570 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech Elite Keyboard Corsair 850HX Lian-Li PC-B70 Logitech MX510 
Mouse Pad
Gel 
  hide details  
Reply
post #52 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by koven View Post
Sadly, that's the type of sound the general public likes/is used to. The more bass there is, the better they think the speakers are. Throw in some marketing buzzwords and a flashy design (Beats by dre, Bose, Skullcandy, etc) and people will run to Best Buy and pay retail + tax for sub-par sound quality/inaccurate audio reproduction... but meh, ignorance is bliss.
So True.
I have some Cambridge Soundworks 2.1s that I got 12 years ago for $150.


They were basically one of the first 2.1 PC-specific systems you could get. They still sound good for PC speakers, but when I compared them to a set of low end bookshelf JBLs, they sounded like mud.

I now have my PC hooked up to my home theater, which lets me avoid using the PC speakers most of the time. 7.1 Ascend Acoustics system FTW. I don't know why people keep their home theater and PC seperate. It's a match made in heaven.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Phenom II 940 3.7Ghz @ 1.5v ASROCK A785GMH/128M Sapphire HD 7950 Reference PCB and Cooler PowerColor HD5770 PCS+ 
RAMHard DriveOSMonitor
8Gig (4x2Gig) G.Skill DDR2 1066 250Gig WD Blue Window 8 Pro 64-bit ViewSonic P815 21" CRT + 2 17" CRTs 
PowerCase
CoolerMaster SilentPro 600W Lian-Li K62 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Phenom II 940 3.7Ghz @ 1.5v ASROCK A785GMH/128M Sapphire HD 7950 Reference PCB and Cooler PowerColor HD5770 PCS+ 
RAMHard DriveOSMonitor
8Gig (4x2Gig) G.Skill DDR2 1066 250Gig WD Blue Window 8 Pro 64-bit ViewSonic P815 21" CRT + 2 17" CRTs 
PowerCase
CoolerMaster SilentPro 600W Lian-Li K62 
  hide details  
Reply
post #53 of 76
Greetz
You guys posting in here crowing about "subjective standards" owe it to yourselves (if not your ears and your friends) to understand a few basic truths.

1) By definition there are no "subjective standards" since those terms are contradictions. A thing can not be personal and unique and also a standard since standard denotes a consensus or objective proof.

2) If you are happy with what you have you needn't defend that to anyone or offer any kind of proof.

However...

3) Audio playback systems are not musical instruments with voices, colours, or character. They are supposed to be transparent so that you hear exactly what was recorded (hopefully that process was transparent, too) as it was recorded and hopefully as it was performed. This is objectively testable by scientific means and instruments and communicable in the form of realistic specs, not sales brochures who routinely offer "dangling" (unqualified) specs.Often these read like this:

"Freq Response 20 - 20K" with no attendant information on at what volume level and how consistently and smoothly they perform at reasonable increments of frequency bands. Such a spec is absolutely useless. They might as well have said "Gravity to Light"

4) Regardless of your speakers if you start with a typical gaming soundcard you are never going to hear a live recording like you were right there in the crowd or any other accurate reproduction. They usually come with a bass boost to "make games pop". It is desirable to "make games pop" but that job should be done on-demand not as default, especially an unchangeable default.

5) I grant you that some small speakers have gotten some better over the years but if you can lift a sub-woofer without even the slightest urge to grunt, it's junk compared to the real deal if you hope to ever achieve even party levels of SPL, commonly and incorrectly referred to as "Volume".

6) If all you listen to is headphones you can get away with a few watts but real room speakers still require substantial power (and I don't mean just 20 watts either) to reproduce a full audio spectrum faithfully without adding distortion or colour.

7) If you ever get to hear a truly transparent sound system you will never be the same even if you don't know a decibel from an isobar. I don't care who you are or what you've heard before. You will drop your jaw and maybe salivate just a little

The point is that if you are happy with what you have, fine, but if you care at all about audio you should know the true facts and not delude yourself that what you have is as good as it gets (although you don't have to spend 20K on gold ribbon tweets to experience top notch quality) or that others agree with you that your gaming soundcard driven $150 10Watt system is anywhere near adequate to fill a room with music.
NewMain
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5 - 3550 Asrock Z77 Extreme4 Gigabyte GTX 760  4x2GB Corsair Vengeance 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Seagate SATA 2TB x 2  Plextor PX-891SAW CM-Hyper N520 Slackware 14, Studio KUbuntu, OpenSuSe 12.3, Wi... 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
32" Vizio HDTV + DLP Logitech Wireless Corsair HX-850 Antec Sonata I 
MouseMouse PadAudioOther
Razer DeathAdder 2013 dual ESI Juli@ CoolGear ExtSata Enclosure w/ Optical and 3TB S... 
  hide details  
Reply
NewMain
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5 - 3550 Asrock Z77 Extreme4 Gigabyte GTX 760  4x2GB Corsair Vengeance 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Seagate SATA 2TB x 2  Plextor PX-891SAW CM-Hyper N520 Slackware 14, Studio KUbuntu, OpenSuSe 12.3, Wi... 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
32" Vizio HDTV + DLP Logitech Wireless Corsair HX-850 Antec Sonata I 
MouseMouse PadAudioOther
Razer DeathAdder 2013 dual ESI Juli@ CoolGear ExtSata Enclosure w/ Optical and 3TB S... 
  hide details  
Reply
post #54 of 76
Wow, looks like another bought and paid for "review". If I were building an audio system again, Corsair would be nowhere on my list.

Please yall, don't get suckered into buying a 2.1 "media" setup... it WILL suck. Antec, Gigaworks, low-end Klipsch.... All have much better counterparts in the same price range.

I really hope that this sort of BS (computer companies making low-end speakers) doesn't become the next fad after 5.1 and "gaming" headsets.
BENDER-PC
(17 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i3-540 @ 4.23 GHz Gigabyte GA-H55-USB3 GTX760 SSC 4gb G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Sandisk Extreme Samsung F3 Samsung F4 LG Super-multi 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Xigmatek HDT-S1283 Windows 8 x64 S22B310B OCZ Fatal1ty 550W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
CoolerMaster HAF 912 Mionix Naos 3200 Steelseries Brainwavz HM4 Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
BENDER-PC
(17 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i3-540 @ 4.23 GHz Gigabyte GA-H55-USB3 GTX760 SSC 4gb G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
Sandisk Extreme Samsung F3 Samsung F4 LG Super-multi 
CoolingOSMonitorPower
Xigmatek HDT-S1283 Windows 8 x64 S22B310B OCZ Fatal1ty 550W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
CoolerMaster HAF 912 Mionix Naos 3200 Steelseries Brainwavz HM4 Headphones 
  hide details  
Reply
post #55 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
Greetz
You guys posting in here crowing about "subjective standards" owe it to yourselves (if not your ears and your friends) to understand a few basic truths.
Here's another truth, we do not all have the same hearing.

And here's some more truth, you forget companies have a business model to satisfy consumer, not graph. The graph does not have a wallet.
Audio Laptop
(7 items)
 
  
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7 4720HQ GTX 970M 16GB Micron m600 512GB mSATA SSD 
Hard DriveOSAudio
WD 750GB Windows 10 Audient iD14 
  hide details  
Reply
Audio Laptop
(7 items)
 
  
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7 4720HQ GTX 970M 16GB Micron m600 512GB mSATA SSD 
Hard DriveOSAudio
WD 750GB Windows 10 Audient iD14 
  hide details  
Reply
post #56 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
Greetz
You guys posting in here crowing about "subjective standards" owe it to yourselves (if not your ears and your friends) to understand a few basic truths.

1) By definition there are no "subjective standards" since those terms are contradictions. A thing can not be personal and unique and also a standard since standard denotes a consensus or objective proof.

2) If you are happy with what you have you needn't defend that to anyone or offer any kind of proof.

However...

3) Audio playback systems are not musical instruments with voices, colours, or character. They are supposed to be transparent so that you hear exactly what was recorded (hopefully that process was transparent, too) as it was recorded and hopefully as it was performed. This is objectively testable by scientific means and instruments and communicable in the form of realistic specs, not sales brochures who routinely offer "dangling" (unqualified) specs.Often these read like this:

"Freq Response 20 - 20K" with no attendant information on at what volume level and how consistently and smoothly they perform at reasonable increments of frequency bands. Such a spec is absolutely useless. They might as well have said "Gravity to Light"

4) Regardless of your speakers if you start with a typical gaming soundcard you are never going to hear a live recording like you were right there in the crowd or any other accurate reproduction. They usually come with a bass boost to "make games pop". It is desirable to "make games pop" but that job should be done on-demand not as default, especially an unchangeable default.

5) I grant you that some small speakers have gotten some better over the years but if you can lift a sub-woofer without even the slightest urge to grunt, it's junk compared to the real deal if you hope to ever achieve even party levels of SPL, commonly and incorrectly referred to as "Volume".

6) If all you listen to is headphones you can get away with a few watts but real room speakers still require substantial power (and I don't mean just 20 watts either) to reproduce a full audio spectrum faithfully without adding distortion or colour.

7) If you ever get to hear a truly transparent sound system you will never be the same even if you don't know a decibel from an isobar. I don't care who you are or what you've heard before. You will drop your jaw and maybe salivate just a little

The point is that if you are happy with what you have, fine, but if you care at all about audio you should know the true facts and not delude yourself that what you have is as good as it gets (although you don't have to spend 20K on gold ribbon tweets to experience top notch quality) or that others agree with you that your gaming soundcard driven $150 10Watt system is anywhere near adequate to fill a room with music.
Amazing post right here. And if it keeps people from bashing on things because its [B]my money/B], then so be it
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 3570k 4.8 Ghz ASUS SABERTOOTH Z77 atx MSI 660ti SLI Corsair Vengeance 1866mHz 16Gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Mx200 250 GB, 1TB WD Black Corsair H80  Win7 Home Premium Corsair 850HX 
Case
Carbide 400R 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i5 3570k 4.8 Ghz ASUS SABERTOOTH Z77 atx MSI 660ti SLI Corsair Vengeance 1866mHz 16Gb 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
Mx200 250 GB, 1TB WD Black Corsair H80  Win7 Home Premium Corsair 850HX 
Case
Carbide 400R 
  hide details  
Reply
post #57 of 76
This thread (and the link) make me VERY happy with my studio ref-mons; 3 bass-boosters for reference... stupidly good sound... better than ANY 2.1 PC spkr on the market and a very sexy £120
Oh... and an honorable mention must go to my studio sound-card.

It is not about the Watts... it is about engineering.


I am not normally "smug", but, today I will make an exception.
Edited by newphase - 1/9/11 at 1:06pm
My System
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 Asus Lappy GeForce GT520M 4096 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
500GB LG W7=64 ult + Slackware13.1_64 + MineOS HP w2207h 
KeyboardCaseMouse
logitech G11 Fugly, lol logitech mx518 
  hide details  
Reply
My System
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 Asus Lappy GeForce GT520M 4096 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
500GB LG W7=64 ult + Slackware13.1_64 + MineOS HP w2207h 
KeyboardCaseMouse
logitech G11 Fugly, lol logitech mx518 
  hide details  
Reply
post #58 of 76
There's valid reasons why we bash though. They've been brought up many times.

Plus, think about it. How many people have gone from Logitech speakers, for example, to bookshelf speakers and love the change? Lots and lots of people. Now how many people would go from bookshelf speakers to Logitechs? None.

That says a lot...
SFF Goodness
(17 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4770k ASRock z87m OC formula MSI GTX 780 GAMING 8GB G Skill Ripjaw DDR3 2400MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
SanDisk Extreme II 480 GB Seagate 2TB Noctua NH-D14 Windows 8.1 Pro 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2312HM x3 Das Model S Professional Silverstone Strider Gold Evolution 750w Silverstone SG10 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Logitech G500 Xfi Titanium HD Audioengine 5+ Velodyne Impact 12 
  hide details  
Reply
SFF Goodness
(17 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 4770k ASRock z87m OC formula MSI GTX 780 GAMING 8GB G Skill Ripjaw DDR3 2400MHz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
SanDisk Extreme II 480 GB Seagate 2TB Noctua NH-D14 Windows 8.1 Pro 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Dell U2312HM x3 Das Model S Professional Silverstone Strider Gold Evolution 750w Silverstone SG10 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Logitech G500 Xfi Titanium HD Audioengine 5+ Velodyne Impact 12 
  hide details  
Reply
post #59 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by MosIncredible View Post
Here's another truth, we do not all have the same hearing.

And here's some more truth, you forget companies have a business model to satisfy consumer, not graph. The graph does not have a wallet.
I have no problem accepting both of those things are true.

However
#1 So if you hear differently from me, wouldn't you still prefer to hear say a live concert recording the way you would have heard it had you been there? If not, whose ears would you like to emulate. If your system isn't flat and transparent to start with as a reference point, then you're still stuck with someone else's idea as to how it should sound. Furthermore if you picked it because it sounded good on the showroom floor that is no guarantee at all that it will sound that way in your room. However if you picked a flat system you have a reference place to start to adjust to your room.

#2 Certainly some business models will cater down to price, others to sound impressive to people initially (but cause listening fatigue over time) and yet others to actually be as transparent as possible at a given price point. While the graph does not have a wallet the consumer hopefully has a brain and once given the facts as to why it better to choose as transparent a system as you can find, will choose that sort instead some pandering POS that will sound crappy over time and in your room.

I remind you that I did not flame anyone or anything but rather explained the sensible value of a flat, transparent system over a colored one. If it is going to get colored, it should be you doing the coloring, not some tech or sales department.

"A single word, to the wise, is sufficient"
.
NewMain
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5 - 3550 Asrock Z77 Extreme4 Gigabyte GTX 760  4x2GB Corsair Vengeance 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Seagate SATA 2TB x 2  Plextor PX-891SAW CM-Hyper N520 Slackware 14, Studio KUbuntu, OpenSuSe 12.3, Wi... 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
32" Vizio HDTV + DLP Logitech Wireless Corsair HX-850 Antec Sonata I 
MouseMouse PadAudioOther
Razer DeathAdder 2013 dual ESI Juli@ CoolGear ExtSata Enclosure w/ Optical and 3TB S... 
  hide details  
Reply
NewMain
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel i5 - 3550 Asrock Z77 Extreme4 Gigabyte GTX 760  4x2GB Corsair Vengeance 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Seagate SATA 2TB x 2  Plextor PX-891SAW CM-Hyper N520 Slackware 14, Studio KUbuntu, OpenSuSe 12.3, Wi... 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
32" Vizio HDTV + DLP Logitech Wireless Corsair HX-850 Antec Sonata I 
MouseMouse PadAudioOther
Razer DeathAdder 2013 dual ESI Juli@ CoolGear ExtSata Enclosure w/ Optical and 3TB S... 
  hide details  
Reply
post #60 of 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet2 View Post
I have no problem accepting both of those things are true.

However
#1 So if you hear differently from me, wouldn't you still prefer to hear say a live concert recording the way you would have heard it had you been there? If not, whose ears would you like to emulate. If your system isn't flat and transparent to start with as a reference point, then you're still stuck with someone else's idea as to how it should sound. Furthermore if you picked it because it sounded good on the showroom floor that is no guarantee at all that it will sound that way in your room. However if you picked a flat system you have a reference place to start to adjust to your room.

#2 Certainly some business models will cater down to price, others to sound impressive to people initially (but cause listening fatigue over time) and yet others to actually be as transparent as possible at a given price point. While the graph does not have a wallet the consumer hopefully has a brain and once given the facts as to why it better to choose as transparent a system as you can find, will choose that sort instead some pandering POS that will sound crappy over time and in your room.

I remind you that I did not flame anyone or anything but rather explained the sensible value of a flat, transparent system over a colored one. If it is going to get colored, it should be you doing the coloring, not some tech or sales department.

"A single word, to the wise, is sufficient"
.
Much respect. I understand your outlook because I always look for the best price/transparent/space combination I can find whether house, car, or headphones. I also understand that the speaker should be as transparent as possible for the price given and the consumer should use the EQ to do the rest.

I would love it if everyone appreciated sound as much as me. Truth is though, when you or I speak like this, we sound foreign to the average person. I sometimes go on tangents at work about how when I listen to music, my mind separates every instrument into tracks and people look at me crazy.

Sometimes I like to give the other side a voice whether I agree with it or not. It's the lawyer in me.
Audio Laptop
(7 items)
 
  
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7 4720HQ GTX 970M 16GB Micron m600 512GB mSATA SSD 
Hard DriveOSAudio
WD 750GB Windows 10 Audient iD14 
  hide details  
Reply
Audio Laptop
(7 items)
 
  
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
i7 4720HQ GTX 970M 16GB Micron m600 512GB mSATA SSD 
Hard DriveOSAudio
WD 750GB Windows 10 Audient iD14 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Hardware News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [Tom's] 2.1 Channel Speaker Round-Up