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why did most people get an ASUS P67? - Page 9

post #81 of 130
asus because its asus=quality.id never entertain another make.
    
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post #82 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sin0822 View Post
yea idk why Gigabyte priced their whole lineup kind of high. One thing i do know is that ASUS gives away their boards to the top OCers, while Gigabyte doesn't. Gigabyte used to do this but I guess saw it really didn't do much for their sales, but ASUS is worth a few billion and Gigabyte is the 2nd largest at 110 million, so maybe that is why lol.
maybe because it cost them more to produce since they are essentially using according to you the same quality component Vrm as MSI minus the hi-c caps, but with double the amount of phases.

I wonder if asus did use Volterra the boards would price them out of competition, i would assume the business side decide to use cheaper digital vrm components but offer more sata ports, bluetooth etc to compensate, and plus their marketing strategy i believe asus is banking it with their p8p67 line up
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post #83 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by puffsNasco View Post
maybe because it cost them more to produce since they are essentially using according to you the same quality component Vrm as MSI minus the hi-c caps, but with double the amount of phases.

I wonder if asus did use Volterra the boards would price them out of competition, i would assume the business side decide to use cheaper digital vrm components but offer more sata ports, bluetooth etc to compensate, and plus their marketing strategy i believe asus is banking it with their p8p67 line up
Whatever they are doing is working because alot of people are buying the p8p67 boards
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post #84 of 130
well a lot of people always buy more ASUS boards just because of prior experience with the brand.

Many would be surprised to learn that ASUS is outsourcing more and more of its motherboard production every year.

i was a hardcore ASUS fan for 7 years. Now I sway towards gigabyte. ASUS didn't use volterra because well volterra cannot be used for VRD12 they don't have a solution for SVID, and it doesn't look like they will anytime soon. There was a key engineer who is also an OCer and he worked for EVGA and it was b/c of him that volterra was put on the board, other than on that board during this time only really GPUs use volterra.

The chil PWM on the R3E had many problems with getting cold and dependability, really it had to be under LN2 but the PWM had to be kept warm or else it had crazy problems, such as setting 2.1v would get you 1.8v. ASUS never found a fix for it, so the fix was to keep the PWM warm lol.

I can prove to you that the Driver MOSFETs MSI are using are the same quality was what Gigabyte uses. A different brand but same quality.

Volterra was a very odd Digital PWM system, instead of working in parallel like all VRM phase arrays to date, it used a serial method which was probably why it was effective. Now many extreme OCers loved Digital PWMs because of how they worked around the socket, only one capacitor, very easy to insulate for LN2 and other subzero applications and so on. Digital PWMs are the wave of the future but any improvements need to be made, the fact that it uses firmware instead of 100% hardware are to blame for most of its problems, as well as the fact that digital PWMs convert all the analogue signals to digital and then back to analogue. What is even more weird is that SVID and DVID are digital signals, but all Digital PWMs convert them to analogue and then back to digital.

Now the real difference apart from all the DACs and ADCs in digital PWMs is that they have the ability to control the load line inside the PWM, while analogue PWMs needs an GPIO(general purpose i/o) to have different versions of the Loadline equation, its just more expensive and hard to implement. In the past Digital PWMs had more presicse voltage control, but that is not the case anymore as for VRD12 PWM spec voltage has to be controlled in 5mv portions, such as 1.005 and then 1.010. This is the main reason why 70% of manufacturers just went digital, because it takes one hell of an analogue pwm to pull that off and there are maybe 1-2 companies in the business that can put out a PWM that can do this, and intersil is one of them. Gigabyte uses intersil for every PWM on X58 and P67 boards because they are the best of the best. They are the ones who have VRD12 certification on their newest PWM.


i am guess why Gigabyte's price is so high is because they build 100% of their boards in house. Whihc means that QC is very high. ASUS used to be this way, but now they outsource to ECS and Foxconn, but they still make their designs. I am sure ASUS still makes their own P8p and ROG boards, but a lot of their other products are outsourced because its cheaper.
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post #85 of 130
I just bought the board for two reasons.
-It's ASUS
-It came with my i5 2500K as a combo and I saved a few bucks.
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post #86 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sin0822 View Post
well a lot of people always buy more ASUS boards just because of prior experience with the brand.

Many would be surprised to learn that ASUS is outsourcing more and more of its motherboard production every year.

i was a hardcore ASUS fan for 7 years. Now I sway towards gigabyte. ASUS didn't use volterra because well volterra cannot be used for VRD12 they don't have a solution for SVID, and it doesn't look like they will anytime soon. There was a key engineer who is also an OCer and he worked for EVGA and it was b/c of him that volterra was put on the board, other than on that board during this time only really GPUs use volterra.

The chil PWM on the R3E had many problems with getting cold and dependability, really it had to be under LN2 but the PWM had to be kept warm or else it had crazy problems, such as setting 2.1v would get you 1.8v. ASUS never found a fix for it, so the fix was to keep the PWM warm lol.

I can prove to you that the Driver MOSFETs MSI are using are the same quality was what Gigabyte uses. A different brand but same quality.

Volterra was a very odd Digital PWM system, instead of working in parallel like all VRM phase arrays to date, it used a serial method which was probably why it was effective. Now many extreme OCers loved Digital PWMs because of how they worked around the socket, only one capacitor, very easy to insulate for LN2 and other subzero applications and so on. Digital PWMs are the wave of the future but any improvements need to be made, the fact that it uses firmware instead of 100% hardware are to blame for most of its problems, as well as the fact that digital PWMs convert all the analogue signals to digital and then back to analogue. What is even more weird is that SVID and DVID are digital signals, but all Digital PWMs convert them to analogue and then back to digital.

Now the real difference apart from all the DACs and ADCs in digital PWMs is that they have the ability to control the load line inside the PWM, while analogue PWMs needs an GPIO(general purpose i/o) to have different versions of the Loadline equation, its just more expensive and hard to implement. In the past Digital PWMs had more presicse voltage control, but that is not the case anymore as for VRD12 PWM spec voltage has to be controlled in 5mv portions, such as 1.005 and then 1.010. This is the main reason why 70% of manufacturers just went digital, because it takes one hell of an analogue pwm to pull that off and there are maybe 1-2 companies in the business that can put out a PWM that can do this, and intersil is one of them. Gigabyte uses intersil for every PWM on X58 and P67 boards because they are the best of the best. They are the ones who have VRD12 certification on their newest PWM.


i am guess why Gigabyte's price is so high is because they build 100% of their boards in house. Whihc means that QC is very high. ASUS used to be this way, but now they outsource to ECS and Foxconn, but they still make their designs. I am sure ASUS still makes their own P8p and ROG boards, but a lot of their other products are outsourced because its cheaper.
do you know the part number for adc, dac in asus p8p67 series? better yet where can i find spec sheet on their digital vrm design?
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post #87 of 130
ADC is an analogue to digital converter, DAC is a digital to analog converter, they aren't separate they are built into the Digital PWM or analogue pwm.lol they don't have part numbers as they 1/20th the size of the digital PWM which is the size of any chip on your board. Spec sheet wont tell you anything on the PWM. find the digital PWM and read the number off of it type it into google and if they have released the spec sheet then it will come up, intesill also has not released to the public. I can show you an example tho, as i will just to make you feed better.

here is an older version of both, first if a analogue pwm, second is a digital pwm.

listen man i don't just talk out of my ass, i can show you the article on the volterra vs interstil it think it has chil in there as well.

you honestly do not know what you are talking about and its ok, your not an EE i don't expect you to understand what is below, but you can see the different styles of how the signals are passed. The current Intersil and Chil pwms are under their own internal NDA, idk why but they are.

i just want to say tho, that is really doesn't matter and i hope asus got the certification, but earlier they did not. The PWM means very title to overall board or even VRm performance as long as the company didn't cheap out on it, which asus and gigabyte do not. All in all the powerhouse of the VRm are the MOSFETs which change 12v to 1-2v for the CPU and they are the ones that define the power of the board. When they say 16 phases they are talking about 16 MOSFETs, not a PWM with 16 phases are they don't make those, they make 4 -12 phase pwms and then piggyback MOSFETs and it works.

The ones pictured below are for the R3E and for the UD9/UD7/UD5/UD3
Now if I think the issue with ASUS's VRD12 crap was that Chil didn't redesign the whole PWM simply added a secondary DAC and ADC for SVID and then updated the firmware b/c that is the beauty of digital pwms, you can update the firmware, and thus change the operating parameters.

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post #88 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sin0822 View Post
ADC is an analogue to digital converter, DAC is a digital to analog converter, they aren't separate they are built into the Digital PWM or analogue pwm.lol they don't have part numbers as they 1/20th the size of the digital PWM which is the size of any chip on your board. Spec sheet wont tell you anything on the PWM. find the digital PWM and read the number off of it type it into google and if they have released the spec sheet then it will come up, intesill also has not released to the public. I can show you an example tho, as i will just to make you feed better.

here is an older version of both, first if a analogue pwm, second is a digital pwm.

listen man i don't just talk out of my ass, i can show you the article on the volterra vs interstil it think it has chil in there as well.

you honestly do not know what you are talking about and its ok, your not an EE i don't expect you to understand what is below, but you can see the different styles of how the signals are passed. The current Intersil and Chil pwms are under their own internal NDA, idk why but they are.

i just want to say tho, that is really doesn't matter and i hope asus got the certification, but earlier they did not. The PWM means very title to overall board or even VRm performance as long as the company didn't cheap out on it, which asus and gigabyte do not. All in all the powerhouse of the VRm are the MOSFETs which change 12v to 1-2v for the CPU and they are the ones that define the power of the board. When they say 16 phases they are talking about 16 MOSFETs, not a PWM with 16 phases are they don't make those, they make 4 -12 phase pwms and then piggyback MOSFETs and it works.

The ones pictured below are for the R3E and for the UD9/UD7/UD5/UD3
Now if I think the issue with ASUS's VRD12 crap was that Chil didn't redesign the whole PWM simply added a secondary DAC and ADC for SVID and then updated the firmware b/c that is the beauty of digital pwms, you can update the firmware, and thus change the operating parameters.
As you stated the digital PWM's firmware can be updated. Is it possible to update the firmware for the digital PWM's using a (BIOS/ EFI) update with them installed on the motherboard, or are they only able to be programed once at the factory?
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post #89 of 130
Correct me if I am wrong but all this talk about the quality of the components on the boards doesn't really matter at the consumer level right? Like if I just wanted to overclock to ~4.3-4.6GHz or on stock voltage then does the quality of the components matter all that much? I mean of course you can't put any old junk components on these boards but when you are comparing "better" to "best" does it really matter for the average person?

It seems to me that the only people after the highest quality hardware would be the ones pumping 1.6+ volts through their CPU's on DICE/LN2 to get to 6GHz+...
post #90 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtomicFrost View Post
As you stated the digital PWM's firmware can be updated. Is it possible to update the firmware for the digital PWM's using a (BIOS/ EFI) update with them installed on the motherboard, or are they only able to be programed once at the factory?
I am pretty sure it could yes, that is the whole point, you know how you can control switching frequency, extreme phase and those other weird options, well a BIOS update could set those to different defaults. If you can control it from BIOS then you can probably update it that way too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Semper Fidelis View Post
Correct me if I am wrong but all this talk about the quality of the components on the boards doesn't really matter at the consumer level right? Like if I just wanted to overclock to ~4.3-4.6GHz or on stock voltage then does the quality of the components matter all that much? I mean of course you can't put any old junk components on these boards but when you are comparing "better" to "best" does it really matter for the average person?

It seems to me that the only people after the highest quality hardware would be the ones pumping 1.6+ volts through their CPU's on DICE/LN2 to get to 6GHz+...
Yes there is not much different, it really doesn't matter but lets say you want to board to last 5-10 years OCed with 1.5v that is going to take a hard hit on the motherboard components. In the end tho for the moment, all the boards are hitting 5.6ghz even the ****ty ones upto the UD7 and M4E, so you really just want a board with features and looks you like.
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