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Maybe a Repost - but, Why Desktop Linux Sucks

post #1 of 61
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I like this video very much. Im not sure anybody that has been running Desktop linux in the past 3 years that cant sympathize with something in this video. That being said, in the past 3 years, I feel the "useability" of linux desktops have grown exponentially. I hate having to boot into windows to watch a netflix streaming video.

post #2 of 61
out of boredom and being slightly snowed in i watched this video.

i have often agreed with viewpoints such as this, as these are constructive arguments as to why linux sucks.

i like linux for a whole different reason, i don't game very often, have no need for video or audio creation, i do on the office front, but open office is "suitable" most of the time.

as a programmer myself, i often find myself in my projects telling my guys "we dont' want to many cooks in the kitchen" and that is the biggest problems with open source, but it is also its greatest benefit, which is sort of a paradox

for some projects it works great for, others it destroys them.

for a desktop linux is hit or miss, as a server i wouldn't trade it for the world
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post #3 of 61
Lol 4 posts?

post #4 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jotun View Post
Lol 4 posts?

i'm not trying to start anything, but you have 18.

post count isn't an indication of a person's intelligence, or their legitimacy. all it shows is how many times they've posted. that's it.
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post #5 of 61
nah the guy isn't trolling, nothing in the video is inflammatory.

the video is a bit long, about 45 minutes.

it address real problems that linux does face if it ever wants to be considered a real contender on the desktop market.

the lecture the guy gives is actually titled "why desktop linux sucks"
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post #6 of 61
Yeah, there are a few good points. I think Xorg is smoothing things out well though. Packaging isn't that much of a disaster, but trying to port people from windows it can look like it. And I agree, a standard should be set. I think if we are going to do packages we need to at least keep files in the same respected areas. /opt /var /usr /lib /bin ect... and not all jumbled up like it can be... I also think (no offense here) that distro's like Arch should scrap the BSD. I like Arch for what it is, but I don't like it's BSD style. Yes, that's the mother, but we aren't BSD. If your going to be a linux distro, stick to the Linux rules. That's one of the biggest problems, and it forever will be.

This brings up the old debate about Pulseaudio! A lot of people don't hate what they are trying to do, but rather they hate the fact that they are doing it all together. If we put that effort into fixing ALSA, getting it better internal mixing ect... Then we might be able to get professional audio, but not until this "lets make a new sound server" crap gets dropped. ALSA has a backend, it can do it's own mixing, stop trying to make a new mixer and work on current issues.

But yeah, there are a lot of good points in this.
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post #7 of 61
So from how my friend who got me started with Linux explained it the whole argument about package containers is moot right? They are just compression methods. However, why the hell are there so many different compression containers then?

To me Linux's biggest problem is not software or package differences but hardware. And I'm talking straightforward keyboard, mouse, audio, video, wifi, and webcam things. Now, from my experience that list gets narrowed down to just audio, video, and wifi problems being the big common three. And they are big enough to make me rather depressed at times. I don't know what it is but for audio and wifi i just can't have my cake and eat it. I mean in one distro I will get wifi working but there's no support for my mic. In another the mic works (along with Skype) but it's rather pointless since wifi is out of the question. And to make things more confusing; depending on the distro i will get different hardware reported for audio and wifi when doing "cat...". Also, I don't know if it's still a big issue but ATI cards I avoided because of the horror stories I heard about them.

So as far as I care I'd be more than willing to even shell out some dough for a distro that regardless of hardware would actually fully work with all hardware. Compared to getting hardware working software problems have been much easier. And a computer is useless without hardware support from the OS.
     
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post #8 of 61
i agree with you.

i think there should be some sort of distro consortium, some sort of branding mark, if you don't have these standards, you can't call yourself "linux", there should be more to it than just running the kernel, as from what i can see, as there are a billion and 2 ways to create a distro, that is great.

its a liberating expierence to have the choices, but imho it is damaging the community having so many choices, we don't need 15 different audio systems, or 400 different package managers, why reinvent the wheel?

same with desktops itself, i've used a lot of them, the two i like the mot are kde and gnome, xfce is pretty nice, but its a bit lacking to me.

i do like the choices in linux, but with some of the scales of some of the projects, some of the choices are just redundant, if the pulse guys got with the alsa guys and the oss guys joined the team, i would imagine we'd have a good audio subsystem in linux in the matter of a few short months, and if the kde guys got with the gnome guys, what could they do together?

i'm not saying that is what should happen, but it would be nice if a lot of these projects joined forces instead of working against each other, and trying to outshine each other.

the other thing that annoys me about the open source community, is the anomosity held between successful distro's or projects that do the same thing.

i see a lot of it between the debian guys and the ubuntu guys, the debian guys feel they do all the work and the ubuntu guys get all the glory, that might be true to an extent, but i'm not involved directly with either camp so i can't say for sure if that is what really goes on.

the other things i see are how other distro's and distro users treat ubuntu, lets face it, ubuntu is here to stay and will more than likely will continue to draw more and more users from other distro as time goes by.
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post #9 of 61
I see Ubuntu becoming the first major partners with proprietary/corporate sponsorship. It's gonna happen with a distro eventually and I see them as the first. They build off one of the most stable distro's now, debian. And in many ways Debian does do all the work, but then what about linus and the kernel? When does he get to ***** about every linux distro and their far cousin catching all the fun and glory? Suck it up! lol

Heck, to prove things even more, I've actually booted Arch Linux with my Debian kernel. Yes it was accidental, but it ran everything just as it should. Why? Because the kernel itself does have standards, making it so rock solid. If you don't believe me, pass the wrong root= to the kernel during boot while booting off another drive's kernel. You'll get a funky startup, but it can work.

We need these standards, not for the consumer, but for development work. This is why I was so pissed about the libgl problem in Arch, even my hackintosh can build xorg crap without complaining. It's called standards, and we need to abide by them.

Now, what can you as a consumer do? We can donate, buy commercial software, support popular distro's. Before I get the "well I like Arch because it gives me control" bull**** there is a reason for this. Small nich and spin off distro's won't ever give us the major push we need. If you want Linux to ever become something that people will know and like it needs to have the backing of major distro's. That means they need to prove the following:

They have users, and plenty of them.

They will purchase software or donate.

They can do this easily, FOR EVERYONE.

This can be done by a lot of distro's, except for the fact that they don't have the user base. Ubuntu has it, it's growing extremely fast and I can see some of the major companies (Adobe, Valve, ect...) releasing software for it. We don't have the space or time for nitch distro's, especially if they don't grow at a fast enough pace. Slackware/Gentoo is great for some things, but in the long run it will get us nowhere in development and support. This is the corporate world now, you play by their rules.
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post #10 of 61
@transhour: I'm with you on the consortium idea (which would be great and I'm pretty sure everyone and their mom who uses linux thinks of it) but with a different focus. I love the choices and variety that these competing projects give and don't want any of them to fail or vanish into mergers. What I do want is them to view their projects as branches of a unified front. That means share the hardware compatibility that you've had with everyone else so that you all can focus then on the other differences. Maybe just a unified backend with different choices for GUI mixers would be nice. Some kind of alsa-oss merger could really get things going but it basically kills the competition aspect that might have (not sure if it did) driven them in some small way.

Now, I'm feeling like I'm forgetting that this hardware problem isn't because of just competing projects but because the hardware makers are so tight up their own a$5es that they won't make or help in someway with making support for their hardware possible.

I feel at times that Linux gets left out of things not so much that it's to difficult to develop for it but that there's just not much grounding all the distros together. They essentially are/will be like trying to cross develop from windows to osx.

@mushroomboy: I don't think we would need to get rid of all the variants if they could find something much more of solid ground. Maybe it's because I know so little about Linux but I view distros more as a change of packagemangager, repos, and philosophy/user mentality. I think if those were truly the among the few differences then Linux could explode in use.
     
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