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20TB server. need help lol - Page 2

post #11 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by xXxT0MBstonexXx;12186210 
wow MalVeauX. thanks for the time you spent writing that lol. good to see someone has already done what im aiming for. can you help me with a parts list please? I know thats asking alot. I build custom PCs as a side job so i know just how much trouble goes into making a parts list but im in the dark on this one. Ive come up with some parts so tell me if you think its overkill. I prefer to get "value" instead of the cheapest price and this is what i came up with.

Im going to use these as my HDDs: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152245
Im only going to buy 4 of them to start and add more as i need them.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103817 for my CPU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145251 for my RAM

as for the SATA/RAID card i have no idea what companies are good

now the only thing im worried about is if my motherboard even works lol. its been sitting in my HAF 932 case for about 2 years now with the side panels off and buried under dust lol

Heya,

You're very welcome. When you're about to drop a pretty penny on a project, it pays to do a lot of research and basically get in touch with someone else who is/has done what you're trying to do at least.

Those drives are ace. Such a good price for great little drives. But again, remember, redundancy with this amount of data is important. These drives are cheap and have high capacity, but they're not perfect, they will fail one day possibly. I've had drives that failed in a week, and others that still kick 10 years later. General rule of thumb though, is that you're more likely to replace those drives with even higher capacity drives in a few years, so don't worry too much about life span long term. Redundancy helps take that worry away. Odds of losing BOTH sets of data is so much lower in that time frame before you replace them for capacity increase that it makes the cost of this worth it over going with enterprise level setups for mass storage and redundancy.

That CPU you chose is fine. It's 80watts at max load, which it never will be, but that's ok. I would suggest a 45watt or 65watt even CPU if you plan on doing any real work on that server if it's going to be on 24/7. If it's not on 24/7, get whatever CPU you want. Mine is one 24/7, so I use a 45watt CPU (and I let it process a few other things other than file serving, so it does get used a little bit, but I keep power consumption low due to 24/7 use so that my electric bill doesn't come back ridiculous). Keep that in mind depending on how you plan on using this thing.

CPU Note: A 45watt Sempron (single core) will also run your file server just fine. You won't notice the difference in use from a single core and a quadcore when it comes to serving files over a network. It has nothing to do with it basically in the home environment. The CPU only matters if you plan on using encoding/decoding on that particular machine (ie, Playback from that machine). If your server is simply going to stream out to another machine some where else, get a $35 sempron and call it a day. If you will play movies ON this machine (to the display hooked to it, be it an HDMI output TV or whatever, get a dualcore.

RAM is RAM when it comes to this. You're not building a server that is running a business, so you don't need high end server ram with error correction and all that. Basic DDR memory that fits your motherboard is sufficient. 2Gigs is MORE than enough. It will not even do anything with it. 4Gigs won't even get touched. But RAM is cheap, so get whatever you please there. You're not doing virtualization, you're not running several service on virtual machines and you're not using it as a server that clouds out to terminals. You're not going to be needing RAM. A file/movie server for home use only needs enough RAM to turn on. 2Gigs is again more than enough, depending on what operating system you use (windows server 2008 R2, or Windows 7 for example--both work flawless for this on just 2Gigs of ram). Get 4 if it's about the same price, just know, it's not going to make a difference.

As for controller cards, here's a list of SATA II cards that have 4 internal SATA ports: link. Very inexpensive for SATA II. The second one on the list would be perfectly fine (even as a PCI card). Company name doesn't matter here. The controller chipset is more what you're looking at. Since you're not looking at high level expensive hardware RAID or alternative solutions, this is not a big thing to worry about.

Motherboard Note:

That motherboard you have, is way overkill for this. It's $150 new even now. I would sell it to someone that wants 4 PCIe slots. And get a cheaper motherboard with built in GPU that costs around $60~75. Then add a SATA controller card. That's just my opinion though. It may be too much hastle for your liking. But the motherboard you listed is a very good board for Folding@Home people due to the PCIe slots. It will sell FAST if you choose to go that route and they will give you a good price. I simply say that because you won't be using that motherboard's potential at all as a server. That motherboard is built to house 4 GPU's. Flipping it for a less powerful, less GPU featured board while helping the Folding community is a win-win thing in my mind. I'm sort of selling the point though, aren't I, since I'm a Folder (smile.gif).

Power:

Something I forgot to mention. You may already have it setup, but you want an uninterpretable power supply (UPS) on your file server, a decent one that will give your machine 5 minutes to terminate everything and shut down should your power go out, or prevent a crash and data slash during a copy if the power blinks. Trust me on this, you do NOT want to deal with a power drop during a huge TB+ copy session. I grabbed a $45 or so Cyberpower UPS that keeps the machine on for long enough for it to shut down safely should the power drop, connects via USB. Plus it has more plugs so you can use it to connect other things too (and you can choose what is going to be on the backup battery and what's not). Definitely get one if you do not already have one. You don't need heavy duty here. Just something that will cover about 150 watts at the most for like 5 minutes. That's really on the low side. I went a bit higher.

Very best,
post #12 of 37
Thread Starter 
well that motherboard was from my old gaming rig so its not like i bought it for this server. BTW, what is folding lol. you dont need to give me a whole essay again =P
how large should my PSU be?
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post #13 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by xXxT0MBstonexXx;12187052 
how large should my PSU be?
That depends on the spin-up power required by the hard drives. The Western Digital 2TB WD20EARS use ~15W on spin-up (which is unusually low). Typical spin-up is around 20~30W per drive with majority of the current coming from the 12V rail. I haven't seen reviews on the Samsung F4EG yet but if it's like the Samsung F3EG, then start-up power draw will be around ~15W same as Western Digital. Go with a 12V single-rail PSU so you don't have to worry about load balancing.

+1 on the Sempron 145. For a file server, there's really not much sense in a gaming CPU such as the Phenom II X2 Callisto. For around the same price, you're better off going with an Athlon II X3 Rana or Athlon II X4 Propus in the event that you might want to transcode.

For redundancy, I suggest you look into unRAID or FlexRAID. I think the best description for them would be JBOD + parity. When you're dealing with 20TB of data, it's not really easy on the pocket to do 1:1 back-ups of all your data. For DVD and Blu-ray rips, unRAID or FlexRAID would allow for some measure of protection.

Needless to say, priceless data such as family photos and videos, financial documents, etc, should be backed up separately, preferably in multiples with at least one off-site copy.

Here are some power consumption measurements for my 9-drive server.

Specifications:
  • Case: Antec Three Hundred
  • PSU: Corsair HX520
  • MB: Abit AB9 Pro
  • CPU: Intel Celeron 430
  • OS: unRAID Server Pro version 4.3.3
  • HDD: 9x Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 1.5TB

Power Consumption
  • Boot: 264.0W
  • Idle (all drives spun-up): 145.0W
  • Idle (all drives spun-down): 77.0W
  • Parity Check: 169.0W

For a 10-drive server, the Corsair CX400 would have been the perfect inexpensive PSU. Unfortunately, I don't know if the newer Corsair CX430 adheres to the same level of quality.
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post #14 of 37
@OP:

Can't really add much more to the thread, but I'll try. tongue.gif As others have said, a dual-core processor is fine for storage use. You'd get away with 2GB of RAM, but 4GB won't kill you.

On the networking side, it's GigE all the way, and if you can get an Intel-based NIC for your server and for as many client machines as possible, you're golden.

As for storage, me and MalVeauX are going to disagree. If you were using 1TB drives, that'd be 20 drives, and 20 drives in a single array is asking for trouble, even with RAID 6. For you, since you are using 2TB drives (and therefore 10 drives in total), RAID 6 is in fact fine, in terms of hitting an array failure. RAID 5 is good for up to 7 drives before the paranoia sets in. If you're paranoid, add in a hot spare, and learn about data scrubbing.

On another note, there's an issue with (and a fix for) those 2TB Samsungs - they need a firmware update before they are put into use. Look here for more information.

The real issue with running RAID is that all of the drives will be active all of the time. That's around 60-70W of power, and double that on startup. If you're happy with that, all's good. If not, then software like FlexRAID and UnRAID would probably suit you better. For a major use of FlexRAID, look here. The guy ended up using FlexRAID because the power draw on 50 drives was simply too high.

Other choices are:

a) OpenFiler
A storage-focused OS based on GNU/Linux.

b) FreeNAS
Another storage-focused OS, which is based on FreeBSD and includes the ZFS filesystem, an incredibly robust filesystem which blends RAID-like data redundancy with volume management and automatic data consistency checks and corruption repair.

c) Amahi Home Server
A much more "home server"-type operating system based upon RedHat's Fedora. Amahi is closer to Windows Home Server than it is to the above two options, and includes Greyhole - a technology similar to WHS's Drive Extender, allowing you to pull individual drives into a single storage pool and specify varying levels of redundancy.
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post #15 of 37
I would personally go buy a Dell PowerVault or Equilogic SAN if price wasn't an issue... Hot swap everything - drives, power supplies, RAID cards, NICs, etc... drool.gif (Or HP / IBM equivalent)
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post #16 of 37
i would check out a raid 6 setup, you can loose two drives without data loss, and can do hotswap backups if you so desire, and you only loose 4 tb of space as opposed to 10 in raid 1

your board is overkill, sell it of and get a motherboard with integrated graphics and a dual core processor, as said before 2 gbs of ram should be more than enough.

for the power supply i wouldnt go over a 500W maximum, that would be overkill

good luck with your server, i would also recommend going headless, you can save a monitor and mouse/keyboard
Edited by rdrdrdrd - 1/30/11 at 7:08pm
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post #17 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdrdrdrd;12193514 
i would check out a raid 6 setup, you can loose two drives without data loss, and can do hotswap backups if you so desire, and you only loose 4 tb of space as opposed to 10 in raid 0 RAID 1.

Fixed. In fact, if he was running RAID 0, he'd end up losing 20TB of data. tongue.gif Also, with RAID 4/5/6 what space you "lose" is a matter of perspective. If you need 20TB of space, go get 20TB worth of drive space, then add on however many parity disks you need - for RAID 6 that's 12 drives total.
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post #18 of 37
You should look into a freeware called unraid.
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post #19 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by JedixJarf;12197420 
You should look into a freeware called unraid.

unRAID Server Basic is only free for max 3 drives (1x parity, 2x data). A 6-drive license (unRAID Server Plus) is $69 while a 21-drive license (unRAID Server Pro) is $119.

One caveat with RAID-6, good hardware RAID cards can be expensive. Of course, you could always go the Linux software RAID route.

@parityboy
Didn't know FreeNAS supported ZFS. I've always wanted to try it, but going with OpenSolaris and having to set up everything has always seemed a bit daunting. Have you tried FreeNAS w/ZFS? How is it?
Edited by rui-no-onna - 1/30/11 at 9:29am
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post #20 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by rui-no-onna;12198221 
@parityboy
Didn't know FreeNAS supported ZFS. I've always wanted to try it, but going with OpenSolaris and having to set up everything has always seemed a bit daunting. Have you tried FreeNAS w/ZFS? How is it?

I haven't tried it personally. However, I've gleaned a lot of information from places like ZFS Build, the ZFS Guru thread, this thread on OpenSolaris variants and this Building your own ZFS fileserver thread.

Bear in mind that the ZFS version on the OpenSolaris variants is ahead of the one shipped with FreeBSD, at least for now.
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