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post #21 of 29
Thread Starter 
Alright cool. thanks alot guys

I just wanted to know if I was missing out on the full potential of my G700 by not using it at 5700DPI....now it makes sense that I am not missing out on anything....and 5700 max DPI is just a preference thing....not a performance thing

Thanks again!
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post #22 of 29
IME most of my friends use too high of a DPI and I help them get better by lowering it.

The two most important features of a mouse by a long shot are:

1. its ergonomics (no mouse will be good if its not comfortable for your own preferred grip)

2. its sensor's reliability (which DPI is very little if anything to do with, in fact some of the most reliable sensors are some of the first opticals with only 400DPI)

The primary advantage in a 5000+DPI mouse is its customization as most will let you fine tune and hone in on a perfect DPI for your own needs such as 1100 instead of being stuck with the most common preset figures like 400, 800, 1600, 3200, etc...

The next big advantage, particularly after picking a reasonable DPI, is the ability to increase or decrease the DPI on the fly. For instance if you pick 1200 as your primary DPI you can still have settings like 400 and 800 for steadier control such as long range sniping or 2400 and 4800 for maximizing control response out of otherwise excessively sluggish gun turrets.
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post #23 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuad;12378280 
Higher DPI = less accuracy. Let me show you with a nice little experiment. ....
"Aiming" doesn't really work that simple way.
Quote:
Let's say it moved one inch. Well DPI = Dots/Counts per inch. So if you have 5700 DPI, you're going to move 5700 dots over that distance your mouse travels. If your DPI is 400, it's going to move 400. You lose precision with higher DPI
That doesn't apply to FPS where higher CPI are compensated by a lower ingame sensitivity.

Higher CPI compensated by a lower ingame sensitivity (resulting in the same overall sensitivity) are in fact more precise/accurate in the sense of that you can make smaller movements.
(not taking possible hardware and software issues into account)
If this gain in accuray/precision is only theoretical for real world gaming (depends on sensitivity and resolution) or if you are physically able of that accuracy/precision is ofc another question.


Backing up your theory or opinion by posting a pic of your skill or ingame performance isn't a good idea, it doesn't prove anything, it just makes you look like a douche (that is absolutely not meant as an offence).

According to your theory you would even be better with 100 CPI but in fact it would most likely hinder your aim, just as "only" 400 CPI hinders the possible aim of players with higher sensitivies.
post #24 of 29
So basically your conclusion is that higher DPI combined with lower sensitivity leads to way better accuracy for small cursor movements right?

I wonder, is there any formula to calculate DPI to pixels traveled? My guess is
Code:
# Dots * sensitivity = pixels traveled
or something roughly like that. A while ago I did a half a**ed search but found nothing really.
Somehow I always end up on 800DPI in FPS since upgrading to optical & laser sensors. God knows what DPI ball mice had.. *shudder*
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post #25 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosi;12383837 
So basically your conclusion is that higher DPI combined with lower sensitivity leads to way better accuracy for small cursor movements right?
Not really, only in a perfect world.
In the real world higher CPI have a tendency to be less precise (more movement data but also more "false" one), ofc it gets compensated by the lower ingame sensitivity to some degree.
Quote:
I wonder, is there any formula to calculate DPI to pixels traveled?
Depends on Engine/Game.

http://phoon.us/mouse/

That's for Q3, should work for CS1.6 and some other games too.

With a little bit of calculation you can also show how much one count from the mouse really means at certain settings and at some point you get an accuracy you simply can't benefit of.

You need to be able to shot him in the head, not in the right or left nostril, which you actually can't even see. biggrin.gif


So my conclusion is that you need enough CPI, not more.
post #26 of 29
Put this into perspective, I'll try to explain the best I can.

Kid A:

Uses an in game resolution of 1920x1080
A Mouse resolution of 400 CPI
A FoV of 90
A Windows sensitivity of 6/11 or raw input (CSS)

Last but not least, an in game sensitivity of 2.0
(IE: an estimate of 51cm or 20"/360)

Kid B:

Uses an in game resolution of 800x600
A mouse resolution of 400 CPI
A FoV of 90
A Windows sensitivity of 6/11 or raw input (CSS)

Last but not least an in game sensitivity of 2.0
(IE: an estimate of 51cm or 20"/360)

At the desired CM or Inches/360, both setups are perfectly fine given the FoV of 90, but there is quite a large difference when we start messing around or factoring in other requirements such as resolution and sensitivity.

Resolution Vs Sensitivity (Fov 90):

Example:
Kid A notices that all of his favorite pro players are using 400 CPI and decides to copy every setting except monitor resolution. Kid A finds that the in game sensitivity of "2" is too low and then decides to raise it to his personal preference of "4". While his movements are much faster and easier to execute, his mouse resolution of 400 CPI can't keep up with his much larger desktop resolution of 1920x1080. Tracking thus becomes flawed due to his cursor needing to skip pixels to compensate for the speed in which Kid A wants his cursor to travel.

Kid B also notices that all of his favorite players are using 400 CPI and decides to copy every setting including the monitor resolution of 800x600. Kid B also has sensitivity issues and decides to raise his sensitivity to "4". Unlike Kid A, Kid B's in game resolution of 800x600 has much larger pixel spacing and thus, he is able to use a much higher sensitivity without losing pixel precision.

-With a set CPI of 400, you either:
Lower your resolution to compensate for a higher sensitivity.
Lower your sensitivity to a point where the speed is low enough to prevent pixel skipping.

If you prefer a Higher resolution, you:
- Use a higher CPI mouse to compensate for your preferred sensitivity

Although, there is a limit to what actually is helping and what's hurting.

Resolution Vs Sensitivity Vs FoV:

While a 400 CPI resolution shouldn't have problems with a low resolution, scalable and ultimately lower FoV's also require more CPI and or lower sensitivity due to movements in the area of view being much smaller.

Example of Scalable FoV:

-Right click down the sights like in CoD
-Use a sniper rifle to scope in.

Like before, you can either lower your sensitivity or use a higher CPI mouse to compensate.

(pi * g) / (i * tan(f / 2))

for a calculator:
http://phoon.us/mouse/

Personal note: These are estimates. individual sensor characteristics play a role in CM or Inches/360.

tl;dr

-Higher DPI is fine if you prefer it, but you shouldn't try to adjust to it because some brand or person said it's more accurate.

-Playing style also plays a factor in this, although that's another subject I don't really want to get into.
Edited by Skylit - 2/15/11 at 7:04am
post #27 of 29
Yes, of course if your mouse is sending false data then you could end up with jitter in your cursor movement.

Just fired up Q3a RA3 to do some testing. I set my mouse to 100 DPI and 800 DPI to have some contrast. Original sensitivity was 9 on 800 DPI. Set 100 DPI and sensitivity 9*8 = 72 to compensate for DPI loss and indeed turning was way more coarse grained and skipping pixels. Then I reduced resolution from 1280x1024 to 640x480 to compare. The granularity didn't change a bit, and the required inch/360° was identical.
So I can't agree to the DPI setting being affected by resolution. At least not in the old Q3a engine.

Added bonus, I still can do that map backwards.. at least partially so I must've spent way too much time there years ago eek.gif

*edit*
Since the equation works both ways, I increased DPI to a moderate 2600 ouf of 5600 and adjusted sensitivity appropriately. Turning was now even smoother so by all means this thread has probably changed the way I setup my sensitivity settings from this day on.
Edited by mosi - 2/15/11 at 4:30am
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post #28 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosi;12392745 
Just fired up Q3a RA3 to do some testing. I set my mouse to 100 DPI and 800 DPI to have some contrast. Original sensitivity was 9 on 800 DPI. Set 100 DPI and sensitivity 9*8 = 72 to compensate for DPI loss and indeed turning was way more coarse grained and skipping pixels. Then I reduced resolution from 1280x1024 to 640x480 to compare. The granularity didn't change a bit, and the required inch/360° was identical.
So I can't agree to the DPI setting being affected by resolution. At least not in the old Q3a engine.
That should result in about 5.8cm/360°.
For that sensitivity at 1280*1040 you need almost 1800 CPI for "pixel perfect aiming".
For every count your crosshair jumps 18 pixels, at 640*480 it' still 9 pixels, no wonder you you don't really see a difference as both situations suck. biggrin.gif

Quote:
Since the equation works both ways, I increased DPI to a moderate 2600 ouf of 5600 and adjusted sensitivity appropriately. Turning was now even smoother so by all means this thread has probably changed the way I setup my sensitivity settings from this day on.
No wonder, as mentioned above 1800 CPI are allready enough. wink.gif
post #29 of 29
Quote:
That should result in about 5.8cm/360°.
For that sensitivity at 1280*1040 you need almost 1800 CPI for "pixel perfect aiming".
For every count your crosshair jumps 18 pixels, at 640*480 it' still 9 pixels, no wonder you you don't really see a difference as both situations suck.
Yup, both situations sucked, the 100DPI even more than an industrial vacuum cleaner biggrin.gif
Indeed it's about 5.8cm/360° ingame.
I also think I got Skylit's last explanation wrong. My take was that on higher resolutions you need more sensitivity to have the same cm/360°. Must be the damn antibiotics redface.gif

Seriously though.. how did I never notice this whole thing. *shakes head in disbelief*
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