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Intel E7600 / I3 540 vs AMD Phenom II X2 565 and X4 955?

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
Hi,

I am pondering on moving from Intel to AMD but before I do that first I need to check if I have the correct picture. It seems to me the AMD is a lot faster and cheaper than Intel - but if I were right then everybody would have AMD and that is not the case.

So: I have an Intel E7600 - 3.06 GHz Core 2 Duo, 2 cores. If I wanted to buy this new now I would have to pay around £100. You may say this is an old model and you are right. So I also checked Intel I3 540 which is 3.06 GHz again. This costs around £105.

The competitors: AMD Phenom II X2 565 Black Edition 2. 2 cores, 3.4GHz, 7MB cache... Seems faster that Intel E7600 or I3 540 (although I couldn't find any speed comparison test for these two) and it costs only £65. Big difference. Also, look Phenom II X4 955 - 3.2GHz, 4 cores and it costs £105, just like Intel I3 540. But this AMD has 4 cores while I3 540 have 2 only (but again, I could not fine a Phenom II X4 955 and I3 540 performance comparison test).

So... Why AMD's are so cheap? Why Intel is so expensive? Also, I would need this computer for gaming. I noticed that most of the gamers have Intel? Why, Intel? AMD seems to be cheaper and more powerful? I feel there is some bits that I miss? Please help me to see this more clear.

(My situation is that I have an old Intel E2140, and and Intel E7600 processor, a motherboard that supports these (but not Intel I-series) and that supports DDR2 (but not DDR3), and also 2GB DDR2-6400 (extra fast 4-4-4-15), and 4GB DDR2-8500 memory. I am pondering (far from deciding yet) over selling the two processors, the mobo and the 2+4GB memory modules (both are 2*1 modules kits) and buy something new from their price. Question is: I3 or Phenom II? (I won't say I5 as it an I5 650 starts at £145 and it still has only two cores!) Or maybe I should keep my existing (Intel E7600) config??

I checked these:
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/204?vs=143
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/88?vs=143
but I am not any more clever now... In fact more confused. How comes that some test say Intel is better while others say AMD is better? How can you decide? And how is that the slower 2 core Intel often beats the faster 4 core AMD? Hmm...

I am pretty confused. The whole question is a mess :-) Can't find any definite answer... Please help.

Thank you.
    
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post #2 of 18
AMD is nowhere near as fast as Intel, not sure where you got that from. AMD's current top of the line of Phenom II processors are clock for clock slower than the 45nm Core2Quad series (q9550). AMD can only compete based on price, which is something that they are usually good at. Hopefully Bulldozer is awesome.

In regards to why a dual core Intel beats a quad core AMD, it's because not all applications are multithreaded. If an application only uses 1 thread, it doesn't matter if the CPU has 1000 cores, it's whatever is architecturally faster on 1 thread.

Honestly, you should keep your E7600 setup. There is absolutely no real world difference between DDR2 and DDR3, the amount of memory is much more noticeable in real world performance vs the speed. Going to the x2 565 would be a sidegrade, and using DDR3 has no tangible benefits unless you are benching a ton. If you want an upgrade, I would get something like a used Q9550.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against AMD. If building new the X2 565 is great. It has the possibility of being unlocked to a quad/tri core with the proper motherboard and can utilize either DDR2 or DDR3. But in your situation it would be a sidegrade, and not worth the hassle of selling and buying new stuff.
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post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopamin3;12618430 
AMD is nowhere near as fast as Intel, not sure where you got that from. AMD's current top of the line of Phenom II processors are clock for clock slower than the 45nm Core2Quad series (q9550). AMD can only compete based on price, which is something that they are usually good at. Hopefully Bulldozer is awesome.

In regards to why a dual core Intel beats a quad core AMD, it's because not all applications are multithreaded. If an application only uses 1 thread, it doesn't matter if the CPU has 1000 cores, it's whatever is architecturally faster on 1 thread.

Honestly, you should keep your E7600 setup. There is absolutely no real world difference between DDR2 and DDR3, the amount of memory is much more noticeable in real world performance vs the speed. Going to the x2 565 would be a sidegrade, and using DDR3 has no tangible benefits unless you are benching a ton. If you want an upgrade, I would get something like a used Q9550.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against AMD. If building new the X2 565 is great. It has the possibility of being unlocked to a quad/tri core with the proper motherboard and can utilize either DDR2 or DDR3. But in your situation it would be a sidegrade, and not worth the hassle of selling and buying new stuff.

Thank you very much! This is the most useful info I ever got so far! Thanks!!
    
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post #4 of 18
Quote:
AMD is nowhere near as fast as Intel, not sure where you got that from

-rep...

Not true at all. AMD processors usually slower in apps and such including multitasking. When gaming - they show the same performance.

AMD Phenom II X4 955 is MUCH faster than the i3 1156 processors, especially when the game is quite heavy and cpu dependant. Since you need the computer for gaming, AMD will satisfy you without a single doubt. I wouldn't take a dual core these days, so get the 955.
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post #5 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by -X3-;12618526 
-rep...

Not true at all. AMD processors usually slower in apps and such including multitasking. When gaming - they show the same performance.

AMD Phenom II X4 955 is MUCH faster than the i3 1156 processors, especially when the game is quite heavy and cpu dependant. Since you need the computer for gaming, AMD will satisfy you without a single doubt. I wouldn't take a dual core these days, so get the 955.

Compare a 990X or 2600k to any of AMD's offerings. I rest my point, and deduct 2 rep from you sir. Don't forget to factor in how well Sandy Bridge overclocks compared to Thuban or Deneb.

Just so you know, the Phenom II quads are clock for clock slower than the Q9550. So AMD can only compete with LGA 775, meanwhile Intel has released LGA 1366 and LGA 1155 which house CPUs wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy faster than anything AMD can offer. Some of the 1156 CPUs to get trumped by Phenom II, but Intel still makes the fastest processors. This is not an opinion, but rather fact. AMD does offer great value, and is great for gamers. However some people do more than play games all day or want a faster CPU...

edit: and oh he already has a board which supports core2quads... why would it be a good idea for him to sell his board + processor (and potentially memory) just to buy a 955 + board (and potentially memory) when it would be a sidegrade? Why not just upgrade the CPU on his current board? Less hassle and equal, if not better, performance.
Edited by Dopamin3 - 3/5/11 at 1:58am
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post #6 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopamin3;12618573 
Compare a 990X or 2600k to any of AMD's offerings. I rest my point, and deduct 2 rep from you sir. Don't forget to factor in how well Sandy Bridge overclocks compared to Thuban or Deneb.

Just so you know, the Phenom II quads are clock for clock slower than the Q9550. So AMD can only compete with LGA 775, meanwhile Intel has released LGA 1366 and LGA 1155 which house CPUs wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy faster than anything AMD can offer. Some of the 1156 CPUs to get trumped by Phenom II, but Intel still makes the fastest processors. This is not an opinion, but rather fact. AMD does offer great value, and is great for gamers. However some people do more than play games all day or want a faster CPU...

Why would you deduct 2 reps from mine, when you simply don't read what is relevant to the thread? I'm amazed :O
Quote:
Also, I would need this computer for gaming

Pure gaming.
Sure, if he needs a computer for a large server, or very high multitasking demands, he would take the i7 processors. The thing is... He is not doing that !

While the 990x is 7.14 times the price of the Phenom II 955, and the i7 2600k is 2.53 times the price of the 955, they show similar results in games (Not games like batman or cod, where the frames are way more than 100FPS..., but games like BF:BC2 that are quite heavy), especially when playing on gamers settings (FHD, vh and such).
*And I didn't take into account the boards price differences !

The Overclock thing... Does he do that as well? You may want to answer this.
And man, please don't make those false assumptions, just because you have an intel system, and you want to protect it, be objective instead...

Your EDIT: Q9550 is quite expensive those days...
Edited by -X3- - 3/5/11 at 2:04am
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post #7 of 18
AMD procs are USUALLY slower clock for clock when compared to intel.

ALso its the architecture that matters. IF your Budget allows intel is the way.

Or wait for Bulldozer which is roumored to own intel. But wel see.
post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 
Thanks for all of you. Presently I think I most probably will keep my Intel E7600 with my 2x2GB DDR2 1066 memory modules. (Also, I spare a Windows re-install! :-)) I did not even overclock my E7600 yet. Some says that many of them overclockable from 266 to 333 MHz which (as the multiplier is 11.5) means 3.83Ghz istead of the original 3.06GHz. (I'm not sure if that works with mine, I did not try it yet...) I have a literally HUGE (and heavy :-)) all copper Zalman heatsink with a huge fan on it (it never revs up from its base rev! except a bit when I stress the processor 100% with Orthos small steps for half an hour...) so overheating will not be a problem.
    
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post #9 of 18
Well, that's your opinion:)

My E7200 is not enough for me though^
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post #10 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopamin3;12618573 
Compare a 990X or 2600k to any of AMD's offerings. I rest my point, and deduct 2 rep from you sir. Don't forget to factor in how well Sandy Bridge overclocks compared to Thuban or Deneb.

Just so you know, the Phenom II quads are clock for clock slower than the Q9550. So AMD can only compete with LGA 775, meanwhile Intel has released LGA 1366 and LGA 1155 which house CPUs wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy faster than anything AMD can offer. Some of the 1156 CPUs to get trumped by Phenom II, but Intel still makes the fastest processors. This is not an opinion, but rather fact. AMD does offer great value, and is great for gamers. However some people do more than play games all day or want a faster CPU...

edit: and oh he already has a board which supports core2quads... why would it be a good idea for him to sell his board + processor (and potentially memory) just to buy a 955 + board (and potentially memory) when it would be a sidegrade? Why not just upgrade the CPU on his current board? Less hassle and equal, if not better, performance.


Oh, come on. You sound like a typical Intel fanboy. Who in their right mind compares a $1000 CPU to a $230 CPU or a $330 CPU to a $190 CPU?

As of now, Intel and AMD are attacking different markets. AMD is delivering the best performance for $200 when it comes to multi-threaded apps like video encoding/rendering, 3D modeling, and scientific applications. Intel is delivering the best gaming and single-threaded performance at that price point.

And yes, all you are saying is OPINION and to say else is disingenuous. The only Sandy Bridge CPU that competes with AMD's at $200 is the 2500k, and that's without factoring in platform costs.

Another thing:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopamin3;12618430 
AMD is nowhere near as fast as Intel, not sure where you got that from. AMD's current top of the line of Phenom II processors are clock for clock slower than the 45nm Core2Quad series (q9550). AMD can only compete based on price, which is something that they are usually good at. Hopefully Bulldozer is awesome.

In regards to why a dual core Intel beats a quad core AMD, it's because not all applications are multithreaded. If an application only uses 1 thread, it doesn't matter if the CPU has 1000 cores, it's whatever is architecturally faster on 1 thread.

Honestly, you should keep your E7600 setup. There is absolutely no real world difference between DDR2 and DDR3, the amount of memory is much more noticeable in real world performance vs the speed. Going to the x2 565 would be a sidegrade, and using DDR3 has no tangible benefits unless you are benching a ton. If you want an upgrade, I would get something like a used Q9550.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against AMD. If building new the X2 565 is great. It has the possibility of being unlocked to a quad/tri core with the proper motherboard and can utilize either DDR2 or DDR3. But in your situation it would be a sidegrade, and not worth the hassle of selling and buying new stuff.

Don't know where you got this idea that the Core i3 540 is as fast as the Phenom II X4 955BE. It's not. Not even close.

The Phenom wins in 25/31 tests in Anandtech's CPU Bench. It won 4/4 in all the gaming tests, too.

As for over-clocking, the Phenom II X4 955BE (C3) on average achieves around 4.2GHz. The i3 540 achieves 4.5GHz. Not that big of a difference there.

To the OP:

You're better off getting either a used, refurbished, or new (as long as the price is reasonable; don't pay $300) Core 2 Quad Q9550. The difference in performance in comparison to your current E7600 will be huge. If you decide to go with Lynnfield/Clarkdale, prepare yourself for disappointment. The Core i7 (first series) only provide a difference of around 13% clock-for-clock against the C2Q 9xxx series and you'll have to sell your mobo and RAM.
    
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Overclock.net › Forums › General Hardware › General Processor Discussions › Intel E7600 / I3 540 vs AMD Phenom II X2 565 and X4 955?