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[CNET] White House wants new copyright law crackdown - Page 9

post #81 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by _GTech View Post
So is tracking what people do online...

But wait, what about privacy laws?

Does everyone have a right to tap your line to see what your doing?

Even Service Providers?

You can't have privacy if everyone can watch your internet traffic, correct me if I'm wrong, please...
You're quite right to raise this issue. THIS is the real sticking point. How do we enforce copyright laws when piracy is so easy and ubiquitous? Can we do it without sacrificing personal privacy? In my opinion, we must enforce the laws, but I also hold personal freedoms and privacy as of the utmost importance.

Get it wrong one way, we have Big Brother watching us. Get it wrong the other way and we have Chinese IP protection. I don't think anyone wants either of those things.

I wonder if we can equate movements on the internet with movements, say, in a car. Normally, the police don't know where you're driving or where you've been driving. However, when you speed past a police officer on a road, in violation of a law, the government becomes aware of your location. Similarly, the government should not be able to tell where you're going or where you've been on the internet unless you happen to break a law under the observation of a police officer, e.g. downloading an Ubisoft game via torrent on a tracker which is being monitored by law enforcement.

Just thoughts...
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post #82 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Peen View Post
You cannot stop piracy. It's as easy as that.
Quote:
June 1971: Nixon officially declares a "war on drugs," identifying drug abuse as "public enemy No. 1."
You see how long ago we declared war on drugs and we have not stopped fighting because we are loosing. Piracy will be the same. I nonstop battle regardless of how badly it fails.
     
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post #83 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick7269 View Post
You see how long ago we declared war on drugs and we have not stopped fighting because we are loosing. Piracy will be the same. I nonstop battle regardless of how badly it fails.
That's an interesting analogy. I don't think it's quite the same thing, though. The drug trade deals in contraband, while IP piracy is theft. While I agree that there is a possibility that piracy will never go away completely, I think you're comparing apples and oranges in two ways:

1. Contraband like drugs are goods which are disallowed in a country. Piracy is the unlawful copying of legal material.

2. Consider the effects of legalizing both of these practices. In the case of drugs, use might increase for a few years, perhaps as long as a decade, but the drugs themselves will be purer, safer, and cheaper. Also, the state governments will collect sales tax and the federal government may levy an import tariff. The money would increase the quality of government services. The increased demand would spur the creation of legitimate and legal marijuana, coca, and poppy farms worldwide, and all the jobs that come along with them. The only people who lose are the drug lords in South America and elsewhere. Fine by me.

Legalizing the free copying of IP would have catastrophic effects on the entertainment industry. If it was perfectly fine to copy music, movies, and games, who in their right mind would ever pay for them? I'd venture to say very, very few people. All of a sudden, the entertainment industry's revenue drops to almost zero. In a matter of months, an entire industry and all its jobs would be wiped out.


While piracy will likely never completely go away, piracy and drugs are two different things.
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post #84 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlayerS_`Archduke` View Post
I probably can't convince you that you're wrong, so what I'll say instead is that the law disagrees with you.

The question I have for you is this: What is the consequence of 'copying' all the games, music, and movies you want? If everybody copied these things and didn't pay for them, who in their right mind would make the content? Nobody! The only reason art exists is because people can make a living at it. Mozart made a living with his music. Kurosawa was paid for his craft. Miyamoto designed games for a profit. If nobody can make money by being a musician or a director or a game designer, who will entertain us? No one.

This is why it's illegal to pirate digital content; to protect the creators of the content. They came up with it. It's theirs, not yours. The only reason they made it in the first place is because they could get paid for it and make it worth their time and efforts. If everybody stops paying for entertainment, there will be very little of it left.

tl;dr: If you can't afford to buy this stuff, then you don't deserve to consume it. Pay up or shut up. Pirates are going to destroy digital entertainment.
I never said that piracy is right/wrong, I just pointed out that piracy is not stealing. You have valid points that if every single person pirated, no one would be creating content and so on. But that doesn't change the fact that you're still copying and not stealing. And just because the law says piracy is illegal doesn't mean that piracy=stealing just because both of them are illegal.

And you seem to be under the impression that 99% of all people actually pirate every movie/game/tv show/software they use. You couldn't be more wrong in that regard. Just look at revenue/profits and you will see that content creators are making plenty of profit.
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post #85 of 101
Don't worry guys.

Soon this will all be over.

Soon you won't have to think anymore.

Soon you will just allow yourself to be pissed on by the government, and all items that contained questionable content will be censored and removed.

Don't worry, it's like sleeping... Once you go to sleep you will live out your life as a drone who accepts the new rule of the president, your high up leader, your god.

We won't need to burn books, the government will do it for us.

Now take your pill, and go to sleep... It's so much easier to not think about the future, about politics, having opinions is pointless.

Just accept me as your leader, and bow, if you don't you will be made a example of.

America TM
"Because here the people don't have a voice! =)


--But seriously though, I want a change on copyright laws.. but in the words of the matrix... not like this.... not like this...
Edited by HappyDave - 3/17/11 at 4:06pm
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post #86 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlayerS_`Archduke` View Post
That's an interesting analogy. I don't think it's quite the same thing, though. The drug trade deals in contraband, while IP piracy is theft. While I agree that there is a possibility that piracy will never go away completely, I think you're comparing apples and oranges in two ways:

1. Contraband like drugs are goods which are disallowed in a country. Piracy is the unlawful copying of legal material.

2. Consider the effects of legalizing both of these practices. In the case of drugs, use might increase for a few years, perhaps as long as a decade, but the drugs themselves will be purer, safer, and cheaper. Also, the state governments will collect sales tax and the federal government may levy an import tariff. The money would increase the quality of government services. The increased demand would spur the creation of legitimate and legal marijuana, coca, and poppy farms worldwide, and all the jobs that come along with them. The only people who lose are the drug lords in South America and elsewhere. Fine by me.

Legalizing the free copying of IP would have catastrophic effects on the entertainment industry. If it was perfectly fine to copy music, movies, and games, who in their right mind would ever pay for them? I'd venture to say very, very few people. All of a sudden, the entertainment industry's revenue drops to almost zero. In a matter of months, an entire industry and all its jobs would be wiped out.


While piracy will likely never completely go away, piracy and drugs are two different things.
Piracy and the drug industry are much closer together than Piracy and stealing.

Legalizing the 'piracy' of IP actually has a very important benefit. If all I care about is money, am I going to make a good album? NO. I'm going make an album that plays the system. Thus pop music. But, if I don't expect much or any monetary gain from my work, I'm doing it because of my passion. Real, GOOD, bands become easier to find, and I'm more likely to actually pick up a CD in the store on a whim because it'll actually probably be good.
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post #87 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyDave View Post
Don't worry guys.

Soon this will all be over.

Soon you won't have to think anymore.

Soon you will just allow yourself to be pissed on by the government, and all items that contained questionable content will be censored and removed.

Don't worry, it's like sleeping... Once you go to sleep you will live out your life as a drone who accepts the new rule of the president, your high up leader, your god.

We won't need to burn books, the government will do it for us.

Now take your pill, and go to sleep... It's so much easier to not think about the future, about politics, having opinions is pointless.

Just accept me as your leader, and bow, if you don't you will be made a example of.

America TM
"Because here the people don't have a voice! =)


--But seriously though, I want a change on copyright laws.. but in the words of the matrix... not like this.... not like this...
+1

Everybody scrambling for their little pieces. The corporations and government most of all, and now more than ever. It's the human way. We're such greedy little shats.
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post #88 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirrel View Post
I never said that piracy is right/wrong, I just pointed out that piracy is not stealing. You have valid points that if every single person pirated, no one would be creating content and so on. But that doesn't change the fact that you're still copying and not stealing. And just because the law says piracy is illegal doesn't mean that piracy=stealing just because both of them are illegal.

And you seem to be under the impression that 99% of all people actually pirate every movie/game/tv show/software they use. You couldn't be more wrong in that regard. Just look at revenue/profits and you will see that content creators are making plenty of profit.
I don't believe that 99% of people pirate. It's probably not even 10% of people, and most likely even a lot less than that.

The difference between piracy and stealing is a technical one. Namely, that the original is not removed or destroyed by making a copy, like you say. The effect is the same, however. If I make a game, it is my intellectual property. I may do with it as I wish. By the same token, you have no right to use what is mine without my consent. This is how property works. The only reason there is business at all is because there is property and robust laws which protect that property. If there were no laws to protect property rights, what value would it have?

As for my doomsday predictions for the entertainment industry, we've already experienced the effects of piracy first-hand. When we play Ubisoft games, we have to stay connected to the internet at all times. Starcraft II has no LAN mode, which has ruined many competitions like the MLG Dallas Grand Finals. Companies implement DRM measures because there are pirates. No piracy, no DRM. Games get easier for us to enjoy.

Besides DRM, we see publishers focusing their developers on console games. How many PC games have been released in recent years as console ports? Even CRYTEK seems to be in the console gaming business these days. Why? Less piracy, more profit. If you were a developer or publisher, what would you do?

We know exactly who to blame for this, too. This is a true case of a few idiots ruining it for us all.
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post #89 of 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlayerS_`Archduke` View Post
I don't believe that 99% of people pirate. It's probably not even 10% of people, and most likely even a lot less than that.

The difference between piracy and stealing is a technical one. Namely, that the original is not removed or destroyed by making a copy, like you say. The effect is the same, however. If I make a game, it is my intellectual property. I may do with it as I wish. By the same token, you have no right to use what is mine without my consent. This is how property works. The only reason there is business at all is because there is property and robust laws which protect that property. If there were no laws to protect property rights, what value would it have?
I am not using what is yours, I am creating my own copy of it. You can still use it as you wish. It's not like I take your car and you're left without your car. If you had a patent on some fancy version of pizza, would I be wrong to make my own using your recipe? Would I be stealing your intellectual property? Yeah, right.

Saying that the difference between piracy and stealing is a technical one is like saying the difference between copying and stealing is a technical one. It's not. It's two different things. And there are laws to protect property rights, including copyright laws. And I repeat, I never said that there shouldn't be laws regarding it. All I'm pointing out is that it's not stealing, that's all. I'm not saying that it is legal or should be legal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlayerS_`Archduke` View Post
As for my doomsday predictions for the entertainment industry, we've already experienced the effects of piracy first-hand. When we play Ubisoft games, we have to stay connected to the internet at all times. Starcraft II has no LAN mode, which has ruined many competitions like the MLG Dallas Grand Finals. Companies implement DRM measures because there are pirates. No piracy, no DRM. Games get easier for us to enjoy.

Besides DRM, we see publishers focusing their developers on console games. How many PC games have been released in recent years as console ports? Even CRYTEK seems to be in the console gaming business these days. Why? Less piracy, more profit. If you were a developer or publisher, what would you do?

We know exactly who to blame for this, too. This is a true case of a few idiots ruining it for us all.
Console games get pirated just as much. Piracy is hardly an excuse not to develop for PCs. We all know why they aren't developing games for PC's and it's not piracy.
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post #90 of 101
I'd buy more content if it was worth the money I would pay for it...Or worth the time I would spend watching commercials....Most of entertainment today is complete crap in that regard
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