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[BitTech] Farewell to DirectX? - Page 7

post #61 of 107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HybridCore View Post
So that's what API means. After reading the article though, I don't see how directX bottlenecks graphics for games.

API is a software layer. A developer cannot always implement the most efficent code through the API.


If you want better performance.... do you tweak VB or assembly? You can do only do what a language or API supports/allows.
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post #62 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post
Why cant developers make game with 4 different setting for 4 generations of cards. For example a new game comes out.

Low Settings: HD3870/8800GT 1 Core CPU
Medium: GTX260/HD4870 2 Core
High: GTX460/HD 5850 3 Core
VHigh: GTX570/HD 6970 4 Core

This way its much easies to make.
Wait wait. I think he is on to something. 3DFX was on to something like this. They had something that would disable certain features in the GPU workload to gain performance. I wonder if they should attempt this again?

Maybe they can take a similar approach. Although Nvidia and AMD have massive differences in their shader count, the end result is quite similar. There are still "pipelines" of uniform cores. Are they not? Maybe they can have the game coded for both architectures and simply remove features that were originally designed to run on that "pipeline". If the user does not have enough "pipelines" or lanes or whatever they are called, the GPU would simply not process extra features like some lighting effects, or a shadow effect, or full dynamic lighting, or something on those lines. From here they can keep the efficiency but have an easier time developing.

Basically, if said graphics card does not support 200 lanes for this level of work, remove so and so feature to match what the said GPU has.

I wonder how that would work? Insight?
post #63 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post
There is a long-term solution.... GPUs are becoming GPGPUs. With every generation, they are becoming more common and general usage. In maybe a decade, the CPU and GPU will merge.
This solution could happen as fast as then next generation of GPUs if AMD lets C# be ran on the GPU like Nvidia. Then AMD and Nvidia would need to create an instruction set for GPUs.
post #64 of 107
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post
Wait wait. I think he is on to something. 3DFX was on to something like this. They had something that would disable certain features in the GPU workload to gain performance. I wonder if they should attempt this again?

Maybe they can take a similar approach. Although Nvidia and AMD have massive differences in their shader count, the end result is quite similar. There are still "pipelines" of uniform cores. Are they not? Maybe they can have the game coded for both architectures and simply remove features that were originally designed to run on that "pipeline". If the user does not have enough "pipelines" or lanes or whatever they are called, the GPU would simply not process extra features like some lighting effects, or a shadow effect, or full dynamic lighting, or something on those lines. From here they can keep the efficiency but have an easier time developing.

Basically, if said graphics card does not support 200 lanes for this level of work, remove so and so feature to match what the said GPU has.

I wonder how that would work? Insight?
No, it is not that simple. Core count is only one aspect... you have to also account for cluster count, core arrangement, texture units, ROPs, memory size, memory bus, supported functions, programable differences, etc.

A simple example would be the difference between the GF100 and GF110. Most just think the GTX580 is a cooler and fully "unlocked" GTX480. However, the GF110 also adds two new features. The GF110 supports better FP16 filtering.... it can do 2 per clock while the GF100 can only do 1 per clock. In addition, the Z-Cull performance of the GF100 is 10% better. If a developer wrote code the took advantage of the faster FP16 filtering and then ran the code on a GTX480, he might not understand why the code is taking a 30-40% performance hit.

DirectX 9 had something called "cap bits". The code would have to check the hardware and its capability. The developer would have to spend weeks/months optimizing the code based on different cap bits. Developers would need spreadsheets of every video card and every possible feature supported. Then have to optimize their code for every case....

Quote:
Originally Posted by dir_d View Post
This solution could happen as fast as then next generation of GPUs if AMD lets C# be ran on the GPU like Nvidia. Then AMD and Nvidia would need to create an instruction set for GPUs.
C++ I believe....


Yup, it will take at least 2 more generations.... NVIDIA plans to have the Denver ARM CPU on GPUs with Maxwell. That may allow developers to write code easier?
Edited by DuckieHo - 3/16/11 at 1:42pm
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post #65 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post
DirectX isn't going anyway.

Consoles are very different from PCs.
They have a designed GPU, a designed CPU, and both are designed to worth with each other to the best they can.

On a PC, you have different GPU makers, different CPU makers.
So you have the need for drivers, and standards, and each company wants its own standars and does things differently (shaders, streaming, different memory size, cube and other).
So you have to have an API which connects it all.

And that is where DirectX comes. It makes the developer's life a whole lot easier. They don't need to think too much about the GPU, unlike consoles, which you have to write directly to it, and limited by its functions, and you can't go above them.
QFT This is what erks me when reading the same comment over and over again comparing Consoles HW to PC HW. Just foolish IMO
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post #66 of 107
Why can't we program with Open GL? Or do we face the same problems?
post #67 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5entinel View Post
Why can't we program with Open GL? Or do we face the same problems?
OpenGL is an API as well.
It faces the same basic limitations.

OpenGL also is not as supported as DirectX is when it comes to easy of development for game developers.

On the other hand; it is equally as capable as DirectX 11 in making a 3D image. It actually is better in some regards.

Though as stated, can be harder for devs to work with.
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post #68 of 107
Great article!
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post #69 of 107
Now I understand better why CryEngine 3 is going to own. Before I really didn't care about the fact that it will help to design games for crapsole and PC at the same time, cos I don't care for crapsoles, but now it makes sense, because they can instance all the trees to increase the number of draw calls for the PC edition, therefore making the PC obliterate crapsoles.
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post #70 of 107
Now that xbox is so successful, Microsoft has a major financial incentive to choke the PC community with directx (if that is in fact what is happening)
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