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post #4701 of 10697
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inverse View Post
I gave up on 5ghz. I'm just irritated. I can do Blend for hours on my 5ghz settings, pass IBT~ no issue... but that 1792 test kept failing, even when I went up to 1.43v and higher and I'm not going to pump that much voltage in there just to pass that one test. Especially when 1.36v nets me 4.8 easily (even with the 1792 test)...

...so that's it. I'm at my ceiling, because of this one test~ but are we just looking for tests to fail overclocks, or does this test actually reflect real life stability? If it doesn't reflect real life stability (as blend does in my experience) what's the point of it?
Point is that the usual Prime95 Blend preset will hit that 1792FFT many hours out in the test anyway. Can't remember now, but I think it will hit it long after 6 hours into the test.

So, if you cannot pass the 1792KB FFT for 15 minutes, the usual Blend preset will also fail when it hits that FFT after many hours. This is a shortcut to reveal if you can handle a 12 hours + run Vcore wise. Since this particular FFT seems to be the one requiring the most Vcore.

In short words, little point starting a 12 hours + run if you cannot run this FFT. So it will save people alot of time.

And I say this again, we're talking Vcore wise here. If other stability problems this 'rule' might not apply at all.

So the whole point of just running this FFT is to give you better odds of passing the usual 12 hours + preset.
Edited by turrican9 - 10/15/11 at 4:52pm
    
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post #4702 of 10697
Quote:
Originally Posted by turrican9 View Post
Point is that the usual Prime95 Blend preset will hit that 1792FFT many hours out in the test anyway. Can't remember now, but I think it will hit it long after 6 hours into the test.

So, if you cannot pass the 1792KB FFT for 15 minutes, the usual Blend preset will also fail when it hits that FFT after many hours. This is a shortcut to reveal if you can handle a 12 hours + run Vcore wise. Since this particular FFT seems to be the one requiring the most Vcore.

In short words, little point starting a 12 hours + run if you cannot run this FFT. So it will save people alot of time.

And I say this again, we're talking Vcore wise here. If other stability problems this 'rule' might not apply at all.

So the whole point of just running this FFT is to give you better odds of passing the usual 12 hours + preset.
Ah~ this makes sense. If the Blend is going to hit this late in the game, now I understand why you would start here. Makes a lot of sense now, thank you. So basically it's to give you a realistic test of where it would be in a long endurance run so I don't waste my time when going for the 12 hour just to have it die 8-10 hours in.

I appreciate it, sorry just got really flustered, but yeah it does reveal to me that 5ghz is probably not in the cards for me if I have to go above 1.42v to reach it. That's just a bit too much for comfort when it comes to speed versus vcore ratio. A jump from 1.36 for 4.8ghz, to needing more than 1.42v for 200 more mhz doesn't sound too worth it.
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post #4703 of 10697
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inverse View Post
Ah~ this makes sense. If the Blend is going to hit this late in the game, now I understand why you would start here. Makes a lot of sense now, thank you. So basically it's to give you a realistic test of where it would be in a long endurance run so I don't waste my time when going for the 12 hour just to have it die 8-10 hours in.

I appreciate it, sorry just got really flustered, but yeah it does reveal to me that 5ghz is probably not in the cards for me if I have to go above 1.42v to reach it. That's just a bit too much for comfort when it comes to speed versus vcore ratio. A jump from 1.36 for 4.8ghz, to needing more than 1.42v for 200 more mhz doesn't sound too worth it.
Excactly So instead of wasting 8-10 hours (Or in that range. Can't remember excactly when it hits. But it's late in the Blend preset.) only to make it crash when Blend is hitting the 1792KB FFT, it is better making sure you can pass this before you start the usual 12 hours + run. Since this seems to be the one FFT, out og all FFT's in a 12 hours + run, that require the most Vcore

I actually first discovered the 1344KB FFT, and then the 1792KB FFT by luck. Because usually my old 2500K always BSOD'd in the Blend test when I was asleep. But a few times it stopped on error. So i took notice of the FFT and began testing it.

I hope I have saved alot of time for people with this discovery
    
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post #4704 of 10697
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by turrican9 View Post
Excactly So instead of wasting 8-10 hours (Or in that range. Can't remember excactly when it hits. But it's late in the Blend preset.) only to make it crash when Blend is hitting the 1792KB FFT, it is better making sure you can pass this before you start the usual 12 hours + run. Since this seems to be the one FFT, out og all FFT's in a 12 hours + run, that require the most Vcore

I actually first discovered the 1344KB FFT, and then the 1792KB FFT by luck. Because usually my old 2500K always BSOD'd in the Blend test when I was asleep. But a few times it stopped on error. So i took notice of the FFT and began testing it.

I hope I have saved alot of time for people with this discovery
Just to let you know bud and im sure you're already aware, the FFT's are not that reliable for some, meaning they may not pass with the same settings. Also on that note, a member here has found that he couldn't pass the 1792 for an X amount but was able to pass the 12hour blend, I'll try and see if I can find it here in the hundreds of pages lol.

EDIT:

Here we go, there are plenty of reports regarding the FFT's, there good for some but NOT for everyone. Couldn't find the member that actually failed the 1792 (maybe it was donkrx) but passed a lengthy prime blend run.



Quote:
Originally Posted by $ilent View Post
Yes but ive passed 20 mins of a 1344 one minute, then tryed the exact same test and got bsod or its failed after a minute. There just not reliable full stop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by munaim1 View Post
I understand that 1344 FFT and 1792 FTT are harder on the CPU, however, people are putting too much emphasises on it and creating a scenerio that makes their cpu unstable.

If you can go for atleast 10mins of those FFT's and can run a 12 hour blend, then there is NO reason to run those FFT's for longer than 10mins. If you do, then you widen the basis of stability for your own system. Remember guys it's about making the system stable not creating scenerios for it to fail.


Bouf0010

I would only use those FFT's for when 'finding' my overclock, so that means if it can run more than 2 mins then it could mean you can increase your overclock, keep doing so until your happy with voltage and temps, ultimatly my goal is running 12hour blend at a minimum not trying to survive those FFT's for an X period of time. That's like running 10 vs 500 runs, eventually it will fail at some point.


Just run a standard blend test or with 90% of your RAM, when you start worrying about particular FFT's there is more to it than people think. THEY ARE NOT CONSISTANT which basically means their not that reliable, however if they work for you then great, but if you get wierd crap happening then leave the FFT's and just concentrate on the blend test.
Quote:
Originally Posted by donkrx View Post
Does anyone else feel the 1344 is random, can you guys actually pass it every time?

Also, am I supposed to be running the 1344 with high ram usage like the Blend test? I know munaim1 said just change the 15 to 1 min cycles, but I want to be sure.

EDIT: HOW did I miss this?!?! In bold and red font!!
^^^ my experience ^^^
Quote:
Originally Posted by donkrx View Post
2) I notice that when I run a Blend test, by the time I get to the 1344 FFT, the cores are staggered quite a bit (they are 2 min apart basically). Would that be more stable than all the cores starting right together?

An update for me:

I started running the 1344 FFT in a 15 min cycle (ie the exact same way the blend test runs it) and it seems to be very similar to doing 1 min cycles... it still fails really fast if the settings are wrong. My vcore on load is at the upper end considering the spreadsheet here.

-- My VTT seems to be best between 1.051 and 1.077, not sure which is best yet. It starts to fall off around 1.103... at 1.129 a worker fails, at 1.14 it fails in less than a minute.

-- As for PLL it seems that 1.750 is still the best for me, but I say seems because I'm not sure yet. 1.709 has been kinda meh though.

-- Spread spectrum doesn't seem to have any effect now that I've tried both ways and got better results without it.

This FFT feels so random..... and given that it sounds like its a bit unreliable from others' tests, is it even worth using it (and by that I mean running 25.11 instead)? I mean, what if the 1344 just creates an unrealistic loading scenario that the SB chip tends to mess up on... this particular FFT seems MUCH harder to pass than the rest and requires a lot more voltage, my question is WHY?


Yeah, I still got that in mind, however I failed at the 1344 in the blend test once too. So now I'm running it at a 15 min cycle and finding it does the same thing, failing pretty much 80% of the time.

One thing I wonder is the comment I mentioned above in (2), does the loading in a blend test shift it more gradually or stagger things so that its not as intense. When loading the 1344 FFT in Prime ALONE, I notice my temps spike to what they do under a SMALL FFT. In other words my peak temp during a standalone 1344 FFT is equal to my peak temp in Prime over a 12 hour period. However, when I do the blend test, my temps during 1344 FFT are normal (~7C less than my peak) for the entire duration... no spiking. Makes me kinda think, why is that happening?
Quote:
Originally Posted by donkrx View Post
I haven't bothered too much with the 1792 but it always seems easier to get through for me than 1344. These FFTs are included in the blend test, so I can either run them alone and find out in 15 minutes or less, or run it in the blend test and find out in 3 hours. I passed 10 hours in version 25.11 (which does not have 1344), added .010v, then switched to version 26.6 and failed at the 1344 FFT 3 hours into the blend test.

That being said, these FFTs are indeed really fickle and I'm not sure how useful they are in the grand scheme of things. Being able to get through 12h+ in blend (without the 1344) but not 2 minutes of 1344 on its own, seems a bit suspect...... however people in this club are still passing the version 26 blend with 1344 so I would like to as well.

One thing to consider is that it might be easier to pass 1344/1792 in the middle of a blend test compared to running it on its own. Maybe the gradual staggered loading in the blend test is easier on the CPU than starting 4 threads synchronously instantly from idle? (after a couple hours of blend testing the individual workers will be a few minutes apart in progress, this could help)



Edited by munaim1 - 10/15/11 at 5:23pm
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post #4705 of 10697
Quote:
Originally Posted by munaim1 View Post
Just to let you know bud and im sure you're already aware, the FFT's are not that reliable for some, meaning they may not pass with the same settings. Also on that note, a member here has found that he couldn't pass the 1792 for an X amount but was able to pass the 12hour blend, I'll try and see if I can find it here in the hundreds of pages lol.
I am aware of this. All I have claimed is that it will give a strong indication and a better chance of success in the usual preset.

Me personal have sometimes had success with the 1792KB FFT but failed in the 12 hours + preset. Even though it was only Vore related.

I relate this to the Vcore fluctuations when switching between different problem sizes.

But there is no doubt the 1792KB FFT is the one requiring the most Vcore. And if you can not even pass this one for 5 minutes you will most certainly not pass a 12 hours + test. In other cases, if you're close to stability Vcore wise, it can pass one time and not the next time.

In my experience with the P8P67 PRO I can be stable at a certain Vcore, but not the next time. So I've found I have to compensate with a 'safe/high enough Vcore'.

So this could also be it, motherboard related. Explaining why one can pass the 1792KB FFT and not the 12 hours + preset. At one time I passed a 12 hours + test at Offset + 0.005v, after a shutdown it required + 0.025v to be 12 hours + stable at 4.7GHz. + 0.025v has never failed at 4.7GHz.
Edited by turrican9 - 10/15/11 at 5:17pm
    
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post #4706 of 10697
munaim1

Yet another fact here, when you say some failed the 1792KB when ran separate, but got through the 12 hours + preset without errors, could be because many people type in to use more memory when trying the 1344KB and 1792KB FFT's, because they are told to do it.

But when they run the usual 12 hours + preset they just use the standard ammount of memory, putting lesser strain on their system.

As to my problems, I think I can relate them mostly to my motherboard, some times needing lesser Vcore on a certain speed (same times I could boot with Internal PLL disabled at x50 + multi's. This was with the 1850 bios), because I always type in 6000MB in Prime95.
    
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post #4707 of 10697
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by turrican9 View Post
I am aware of this. All I have claimed is that it will give a strong indication and a better chance of success in the usual preset. ~snip~
That's why I don't emphasize on those FFT's anymore, I would usually recommend it first time round but always add that if shows any sign of inconsistancy then forget them and just stick to the prime blend. It could be motherboard related as you say, however not everyone is running the same mobo so the method is not really universal. I beileve anything that does a 'quick' testing will always be flawed as with overclocking it requires patience.


Quote:
Originally Posted by turrican9 View Post
munaim1

Yet another fact here, when you say some failed the 1792KB when ran separate, but got through the 12 hours + preset without errors, could be because many people type in to use more memory when trying the 1344KB and 1792KB FFT's, because they are told to do it.
nope because 90% of the time I recommend running with max RAM available and even with those particular FFT's and those that had problems were using 80/90% RAM. So that is why I deemed them unreliable.
Edited by munaim1 - 10/15/11 at 5:29pm
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post #4708 of 10697
Quote:
Originally Posted by munaim1 View Post
That's why I don't emphasize on those FFT's anymore, I would usually recommend it first time round but always add that if shows any sign of inconsistancy then forget them and just stick to the prime blend. It could be motherboard related as you say, however not everyone is running the same mobo so the method is not really universal. I beileve anything that does a 'quick' testing will always be flawed as with overclocking it requires patience.




nope because 90% of the time I recommend running with max RAM available and even with those particular FFT's and those that had problems were using 80/90% RAM. So that is why I deemed them unreliable.
Most people have confirmed the 1792KB FFT needing much more Vcore VS other FFT's. And there is no magic making it any different when it turns up in the usual 12 hours + preset VS running it separately. Other than the system has been running for hours and maybe Vcore fluctuations when switching between different problem sizes.

When I first discovered the 1344 and 1792KB FFT's it failed one these two time and time again when running the regular preset. I saw this when I got aware of them, and knew when they would hit.

1344KB FFT is not that interesting, because the 1792FFT is the one needing the most Vcore. So ignoring this FFT and waste 8-10 hours without using 15 minutes to see if you can at least pass this one is not very wise. But each to his own.
Edited by turrican9 - 10/15/11 at 5:41pm
    
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post #4709 of 10697
Latest BIOS update 2001

post #4710 of 10697
Thread Starter 
Very nice buddy!!! 4c drop in temps! +rep for contributing yet again to the stable club. Appreciate it.

I'll update the spreadsheet in a min
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