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Yet another upgrade thread.

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
These forums are enormous, which is good.

Ok, here's my story/question.

For far too long I was running the system below

*A single MSI 9800 GT 1GB model
3GB of non dual-channeled DDR2 666 ram *long story*
An Athlon x2 4100 *2x 2.1ghz* Try not to stab me for that.
Windows XP Pro.
Random LCD @ a res of 1366x768
Some random crappy proprietary E-machine mobo.

* Exact video card http://www0.shopping.com/MSI-MSI-N96...ideo-Card/info
The only important aspect the site doesn't list is the card has 64 Steam Processors.

I was enjoying many games, especially source engine games at a great consistent framerate, I thought it was great in Team Fortress 2 and older games like that, I had been out of the PC hardware biz for many many years.

So the proc in that pc died, then I decided it was time to upgrade.

I then upgraded to this system

Athlon II x4 630 *4 x2.8ghz* 95 Watt
Same video card
8GB Dual Channeled *2x 4gb* G.Skill Sniper DDR3 1333 PC 10666 ram.
350 watt PSU.
24" Asus LCD @ 1920x1080
MSI 785GM0P45 (MS-7623) Mobo, Bios updated as well.

With this new setup I nearly shat my pants when I saw Team Fortress 2, I was maintaining 50+ FPS *Vsync on* while also maxing out everything whereas before on lowest settings I was still lagging fairly bad.

Obviously that's just how far behind my Proc was before as the new quad one is levels above the first gen dual core, which was essentially the highest A64 single core but split.

So needless to say it's great, but now it's obvious my video card is a massive bottleneck and a new video card is worth getting whereas before it wouldn't of mattered with such a bad proc.

Several days ago I noticed my video card was quieter than normal, and it bugged me, then that same day i heard random loud noises that sounded like the 9 year old hdd I had was finally giving out, so I shut down, then rebooted, assuming it was the hdd, it wasn't. skipping some details, I eventually noticed my GPU fan was never speeding up to compensate for heat. All the software out there detects it as speeding up but it's obviously not, and the temps also show that it's not as it's idling at 60c and spikes up to 90 quickly. So I obviously don't game on it now.

Now it's not worth hunting down another obsolete card like that when for $60 more I can get a significantly more powerful card, which is what I'm making this about, I just felt some back story was needed to explain how far behind in hardware I am/was so performance increases should seem drastic for me but less for others.

I have a Micro ATX mobo, and a mid size case.

First off it's obvious if I get any card above the 9000 series I'll have to stop using my X-FI Fatality as the genius's who made this mobo put the only PCI slot directly below the PCI-E slot and the 9800 only has a fan and it's only 1 inch away from the sound card, but it's not choking it, so obviously all the cards above the 9000 series are 2 slot cards b/c of the heatsink.

After lots of research and reading many comments about heat, power consumption ect.. it seems that this would be the best choice for me
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814261088


A few additional comments are that I can go up to 200 for a better card but I'm only seeing 3 combination's that meet my criteria.

My criteria

1GB of mem
HDMI
at least a 256bit interface
at least a 460 GTX
Under $220

The only combination's that meet my criteria are

1, The Palit GTX 460 SE, no problems with size, heat, or power, great price.
2, The Zotac versions have heat issues, and the 2 that meet my criteria cost more.
3, 200+ ones but many have severe heat issues, as well as others.

I think I can open up the range more by allowing the card to have a mini HDMI port as most cards come with a mini HDMI to HDMI connector, which shouldn't be an issue? I use HDMI to connect to my Plasma but I simply haven't experienced the mini HDMI connectors before. I'm assuming it's just been miniaturized for space and assumes people will use a mini HD-HD cord.

And last but not least, I need a PSU rated for the video card I choose.
I don't want or need a $120 modulated PSU that can rip off it's own arms.


Qualifications for the PSU

Must boot the card, 2 hdd's, 2 case fans, video card, type and amount of connectors needed for the VC yet is unknown, must also be able to boot a socket AM3 95 Watt Proc and mobo - AMD obviously.

-------
---------
-----------
Main Question !!

At the very least, would the Palit GTX 460 SE destroy the 9800 GT 1GB model in performance, take into consideration the other hardware I'm running, Or would spending a bit more be worth it ? Keep in mind I need a new PSU too.

------------
----------
--------

So fire away people ! I look forward to hearing ideas !.

If you took the time to read this giant wall of text, I appreciate it.
Edited by Ascii Aficionado - 3/20/11 at 3:08am
post #2 of 22
These cards fit your budget and criteria:

ASUS 5850
HIS 6870

The 6870 would perform slightly better, but the cooling isn't as good as the 5850. (your choice)

PSU: Antec EarthWatts 500w http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371035


Oh and the 460 SE would destroy the 9800, but the cards I linked you would absolutely obliterate it.
 
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post #3 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetalBeerSolid View Post
These cards fit your budget and criteria:

ASUS 5850
HIS 6870

The 6870 would perform slightly better, but the cooling isn't as good as the 5850. (your choice)

PSU: Antec EarthWatts 500w http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371035


Oh and the 460 SE would destroy the 9800, but the cards I linked you would absolutely obliterate it.
Edit - gave you + rep

Thanks for replying, it appears you actually read the entire wall of text too.

What would be the Nvidia equivalent(s) of those 2 cards you linked ?

From what I've seen It appears the GTX 470 would be one but it costs much more, that's why apparently those ATI cards were a sweet spot, you just have to deal with terrible driver design.
Edited by Ascii Aficionado - 3/20/11 at 3:05pm
post #4 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascii Aficionado View Post
What would be the Nvidia equivalent(s) of those 2 cards you linked ?

From what I've seen It appears the GTX 470 would be one but it costs much more, that's why apparently those ATI cards were a sweet spot, you just have to deal with terrible driver design.
The 560 Ti is aimed directly at 6870, but is moderately faster than it and should be around the same price.
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post #5 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilmaypoop View Post
The 560 Ti is aimed directly at 6870, but is moderately faster than it and should be around the same price.
Gave you + rep

You appear to be correct, the very small price increase is worth the performance gain. I'm also seeing amazing comments about temp levels in this series of cards which is a great.

Would this PSU be able to boot this card ?

That's only with 2 hdd's, 2 fans, 1 optical drive, and a 24 pin main connector leeching power, I don't know how to figure out the ampage for the 12v rails.
post #6 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascii Aficionado View Post
Gave you + rep

You appear to be correct, the very small price increase is worth the performance gain. I'm also seeing amazing comments about temp levels in this series of cards which is a great.

Would this PSU be able to boot this card ?

That's only with 2 hdd's, 2 fans, 1 optical drive, and a 24 pin main connector leeching power, I don't know how to figure out the ampage for the 12v rails.
Yup, that's a good 500w, it can handle all your stuff no problem. You'd need a 650-700 watt if you wanted SLI eventually though.
 
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post #7 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilmaypoop View Post
The 560 Ti is aimed directly at 6870, but is moderately faster than it and should be around the same price.
I own a 560 ti and I love it to death. It runs a bit better than the 470 but it's much cooler and quieter! My 560 can hit 1GHz core with zero cooling issues. If you can find one for 200, I highly suggest you go for it. Also, if you ever want to get into folding you'll want Nvidia. You mentioned power consumption being an issue so that might not be feasible but still.

Also, yes, a 460 will definitely destroy a 9800.
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post #8 of 22
Thread Starter 
Gave you + rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by pencil364 View Post
It runs a bit better than the 470 but it's much cooler and quieter! If you can find one for 200, I highly suggest you go for it.
That is now my goal, I was looking @ the Sparkle one b/c it was on sale for 230


Quote:
Originally Posted by pencil364 View Post
Also, if you ever want to get into folding you'll want Nvidia.
I have no idea what that is, but it sounds like dedicating cuda/cpu cycles to something. I used to do the Seti@home thing a few years back on my single core.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pencil364 View Post
You mentioned power consumption being an issue so that might not be feasible but still.
I was only worried about power consumption with a combination of a 560 TI and this power supply

Quote:
Originally Posted by pencil364 View Post
Also, yes, a 460 will definitely destroy a 9800.
Extremely glad to hear this as I know at the very least that the Palit GTX 460 SE will make my 9600 GT look worthless and be worth the money.

Could you estimate how much better the Palit GTX 460 SE would perform ? Just using a comparison is fine, such as "better than 4 9600's sli'd", just a rough estimate.
Edited by Ascii Aficionado - 3/20/11 at 4:04pm
post #9 of 22
I can't see any reason not to get the sparkle 560, I got EVGA because I really like warranties and EVGA's is awesome.

This is what folding is all about:

http://www.overclock.net/folding-hom...need-know.html

That PSU will hold its own very well if you don't plan on overclocking. If you do, get a good 600+ watter. I took the Corsair one because it was on sale for under 100 and it's a great psu.

Take a look at the graph there, the 9600 pulled 13 fps, the 460 1gb (not OC'd) pulled 36.

http://www.guru3d.com/article/radeon...6870-review/19

So approximately 300% better. That's only one test though. It's all resolution and game dependant.
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post #10 of 22
the GTX 460 should be fine since you don't play any demanding titles.
the GTX 560 will allows you to max TF2 and put some SSAA on which will looks superb.
and for the record, you will be able to play crysis with any of these cards. 'nough said
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