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What is 'ghosting'? - Page 2

post #11 of 48
Ghosting†is the problem that some keyboard keys don’t work when multiple keys are pressed simultaneously. The key presses that don’t show up on the computer or seem to have disappeared are said to have been “ghostedâ€. On most keyboards, even some that are explicitly marketed as “Anti-Ghosting,†this happens with many three key combinations. Imagine playing your favorite video game and not being able to, say, run diagonally and fire your weapon at the same time (say pressing a, w, and g simultaneously). This is a result of the internal design of most existing keyboards

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post #12 of 48
Technically speaking, ghosting is where an extra keypress is registered - say you're holding "w", "a", and press "r" to reload, the keyboard might also send out a signal for "f" as well because of the way its matrix is designed. This is obviously a problem if you have say, text chat bound to that key. Most people worry more about lost keypresses though, which is a rollover/jamming problem, not ghosting.
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post #13 of 48
RayvinAzn is correct.

Ghosting is a term that is being used incorrectly these days. It's just an old problem that is almost non-existent with today's keyboards where if 2 keys are pressed at the same time, then a 3rd one might appear out of nowhere that you didn't even accidentally pressed - hence the name "ghosting".

Unfortunately, most manufacturers are incorrectly using it today to describe the key rollover of the keyboard.
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post #14 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
RayvinAzn is correct.

Ghosting is a term that is being used incorrectly these days. It's just an old problem that is almost non-existent with today's keyboards where if 2 keys are pressed at the same time, then a 3rd one might appear out of nowhere that you didn't even accidentally pressed - hence the name "ghosting".

Unfortunately, most manufacturers are incorrectly using it today to describe the key rollover of the keyboard.
It's reached past the point of being used incorrectly now. The usage of the term has simply changed. If you search google for "keyboard ghosting", you'll be hard pressed to find anything about the old usage of the term.

Remember that ghosting for keyboards was never a dictionary definition, like monitor ghosting. It was simply a term the industry used. Since the industry has been using it to mean that your keyboard keys won't block (to an extent), that is what it means now.

Any arguing differently is just confusing people, and is now in fact wrong. Ghosting doesn't replace the term "NKRO" or rollover in general; it's just a supplemental term that is vague, and means something has been done to optimize the matrix to prevent keys from being blocked. It is awkward to describe that using "xKRO", as Razer's keyboard would still have 2KRO.
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post #15 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy9000 View Post
It's reached past the point of being used incorrectly now. The usage of the term has simply changed. If you search google for "keyboard ghosting", you'll be hard pressed to find anything about the old usage of the term.

Remember that ghosting for keyboards was never a dictionary definition, like monitor ghosting. It was simply a term the industry used. Since the industry has been using it to mean that your keyboard keys won't block (to an extent), that is what it means now.

Any arguing differently is just confusing people, and is now in fact wrong. Ghosting doesn't replace the term "NKRO" or rollover in general; it's just a supplemental term that is vague, and means something has been done to optimize the matrix to prevent keys from being blocked. It is awkward to describe that using "xKRO", as Razer's keyboard would still have 2KRO.
Heh. Well that doesn't it correct, nor does it mean that the term makes sense. I mean, I just don't get how the word "ghosting" can describe blocked keys. After all, a ghost is an apparition that appears out of nowhere.
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post #16 of 48
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the replies - even if there are some different meanings suggested, I know the general idea is keys a) working when they shouldn't b) not working when they should due to other keys are being pressed.

I don't remember it happening with my last keyboard (Apple, numeric, wired) - well, until I spilt very sweet, sticky coffee on it - and hopefully it won't happen with this one.

According to cuad,
Quote:
NKRO is when you can press as many keys as you want at the same time, and all of them go through. This is similar to what some 'gaming keyboards' incorrectly market as "anti-ghosting", even though Logitech and Razer only apply it to the WASD cluster. Note that right now only PS/2 keyboards can exhibit full n-key rollover; though Microsoft and Ducky are just two companies who have already looked at designing NKRO over USB.
This suggests that PS/2 is better than USB? I don't know the date of the article so maybe that's changed and USB can do "full -n key rollover"... I also know that very little is quite as straight forwards as better / worse in computing. I'd always thought that PS/2 was an old 'socket' type, being slowly faded out.
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post #17 of 48
I've used a lot of cheaply made keyboards and the only time ghosting is really an issue when you play with emulators and 2 of you are whacking on the same keyboard!

The older PS2 keyboards even the cheap ones could take something like 10-15 key strokes at the same time i think.
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post #18 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by makecoldplayhistory View Post
Thanks for the replies - even if there are some different meanings suggested, I know the general idea is keys a) working when they shouldn't b) not working when they should due to other keys are being pressed.

I don't remember it happening with my last keyboard (Apple, numeric, wired) - well, until I spilt very sweet, sticky coffee on it - and hopefully it won't happen with this one.

According to cuad,

This suggests that PS/2 is better than USB? I don't know the date of the article so maybe that's changed and USB can do "full -n key rollover"... I also know that very little is quite as straight forwards as better / worse in computing. I'd always thought that PS/2 was an old 'socket' type, being slowly faded out.
Basically Microsoft figured out how to offer NKRO over USB on their sidewinder keyboard, and noppo released a keyboard a while after that which supported it as well. Those are the only ones I've heard of so far. It's speculated that there will be more models with this feature in the future.

PS/2 is technically superior since it offers the NKRO easily, and it also works on an interrupt based system, as opposed to polling like USB. When you press a key on a ps/2 based keyboard, it "interrupts" your system and registers the key press. On USB, it's polled regularly, and notices if the key is pressed or not every time it polls. However, USB is polled so fast, that it is unlikely anyone would really be able to tell the difference.

USB supports a maximum of 6 keys (plus 4 modifiers like shift), assuming the keyboard supports it. Generally the keyboards that have "6KRO" really have "NKRO", but are limited by USB to the 6. 6 keys pressed at once is quite a lot if you think of it, most people would be happier with the more convenient USB interface unless for some reason you really need to press 7 or more keys down at the same time.
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post #19 of 48
I used to play a MMO called 12Sky2 and Ghosting was caused when a persons internet is running slow. While a person is running by and he still appears on your screen because you may have slower internet or lagging. The person kills your character and you die a few seconds after(usually somewhere with no one around) and your like "*** I just got ghosted"

Edit: in other words you've been killed by a "Ghost"
Edited by WannaBeOCer - 4/7/11 at 9:41pm
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post #20 of 48
PS/2 IS old and being faded out.

Microsoft Intellitype stopped supporting it some time back


Really, 6KRO is good enough. I guess if you grew extra fingers you COULD get 8 modifiers if you count left and right ALT, CTRL, WIN, SHIFT and remap them to other commands.
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