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[NYT] House Votes Against ‘Net Neutrality’ - Page 7  

post #61 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
"What we need to understand is that while ISPs aren’t currently regulated by the government, they are already severely regulated. Not by government. They are regulated by YOU. You are their customer. You are the boss. You hold the checkbook. ISP companies are regulated by profits. That’s right, profit is the regulator. Like every company that is in business for profit, they have to answer to their customers. All successful businesses are constantly sniffing; trying to figure out what customers want. Profit makes them care about you. Customers will only voluntarily hand over money if it’s worth it. Right now we have de-facto Net Neutrality, because that’s what you want. That’s what we all want. We have to understand that the Internet has evolved by virtue of the decisions of billions of users and content creators. If you are on Facebook, you are a content creator. ISPs have responded to our needs and continually invest tremendous money and resources to provide better options. They ARE answerable to you, and thus they ARE highly regulated by you."

Again this is not an option. The market doesn't work like that. The vast majority of people simply can't function without internet, simply disconnection is not an option. That's why monopolies are so dangerous. The point also remains, if you buy your own argument, than what is the harm of the FCC's regulation. By your own argument ISPs would never run up against the rules anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
"The FCC’s own data shows that as of June 2008, 98 percent of zip codes have at least 2 broadband providers, and 88% of zip codes have at least 4 broadband providers. You can even still get unlimited slower dial up internet access for like $10/month if you’ve got a home phone line. And most people have access to 3g wireless internet, and very soon even higher speed 4g wireless internet."
It's not just about local ISPs, their are still only a few that own the backbone if the internet. It's the t1 providers that matter because they sell to the t3 providers. In this way having multiple local providers really doesn't matter and hardly any places have more than 2 major providers in the area.
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post #62 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by LOL_Wut_Axel View Post
Except not. Most ISPs in the United States have a monopoly in the region they're at and, because of no regulation, they're free to do pretty much anything they want. One thing that's quickly becoming popular is making ridiculous data usage caps and for them to not provide their advertised speed.

The free market DOES NOT take care of things. We need more regulation.
I have the option of comcast and at&t with various other even crappier low speed services.. I went with at&t because I had comcast at one point and I would get dropped connections like crazy, and the problem went unsolved despite many complaints.. Now at&t is doing the same thing and the other high speed option is comcast which is still having the same issue in my area all these years later.

Ontop of that, at&t are planning data caps while charging me the same amount they always have been :/

invisible hand sure is helping me out
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post #63 of 89
"The FCC’s own data shows that as of June 2008, 98 percent of zip codes have at least 2 broadband providers, and 88% of zip codes have at least 4 broadband providers. You can even still get unlimited slower dial up internet access for like $10/month if you’ve got a home phone line. And most people have access to 3g wireless internet, and very soon even higher speed 4g wireless internet."

I don't know of anyone who only has one option. If their ISP does something that they hate intensely, then they're going to switch to a different ISP.

If all the ISPs did the same horrible things, then who's going to be their customers? How will they stay in business if they lose all of their customers? Will the government give them the money? If so, then would that mean that we get free internet access?

Yeah, I think not. ISPs are in business to make money. That means they depend on their customers to stay in business.
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post #64 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annex View Post
invisible hand sure is helping me out
You think that's something, wait till the government starts helping you out.
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post #65 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
"The FCC’s own data shows that as of June 2008, 98 percent of zip codes have at least 2 broadband providers, and 88% of zip codes have at least 4 broadband providers. You can even still get unlimited slower dial up internet access for like $10/month if you’ve got a home phone line. And most people have access to 3g wireless internet, and very soon even higher speed 4g wireless internet."

I don't know of anyone who only has one option. If their ISP does something that they hate intensely, then they're going to switch to a different ISP.

If all the ISPs did the same horrible things, then who's going to be their customers? How will they stay in business if they lose all of their customers? Will the government give them the money? If so, then would that mean that we get free internet access?

Yeah, I think not. ISPs are in business to make money. That means they depend on their customers to stay in business.
If all ISP's do the same thing. Then noone'd be left with a choice with whom to go with, it becomes a situation that you'd either have Internet or no internet.

The latter is NOT an option anymore, in this day and age.
post #66 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
I don't know of anyone who only has one option. If their ISP does something that they hate intensely, then they're going to switch to a different ISP.
Having more than one option doesn't mean much if all the options are equally as terrible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Traches View Post
You think that's something, wait till the government starts helping you out.
It has in the past, and in a very efficient manner.
Edited by Annex - 4/8/11 at 4:45pm
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post #67 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
If all the ISPs did the same horrible things, then who's going to be their customers? How will they stay in business if they lose all of their customers?
The same customers. Not having internet isn't an option in this day and age...

It would be mutually beneficial for (in the case of a duopoly) both providers to raise rates and decrease quality of service. Profits increase and ... that's it. There is no downside to them, they are in complete control.
    
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post #68 of 89
Quote:
ISPs have for years sought to charge the BBC or customers, or both, for the huge amounts of data transferred over their networks by applications such as the iPlayer, whose popularity has exploded in the past few years. ISPs have to pay for carriage of data from BT's core network to customers, but offer unmetered services on broadband – meaning that when people's demand for data grows, ISPs can be out of pocket.
But the BBC and other content providers such as YouTube have resisted calls that they should pay, on the basis that they are providing a service that allows the ISPs to find customers. In response, ISPs both in the US and Europe have mooted the idea of "two-tier" connections where some services are slower than others.

Skype complained at the meeting that its service is effectively blocked on all of the mobile services in the UK except 3, meaning that carriers are violating the principle of net neutrality because they fear it will affect their call revenues.
Source

I don't buy into this argument that ISP's wouldn't do this for fear of loosing customers, especially if ALL ISP's agree to use a tiered system.
As the last paragraph shows Skype is already being blocked over the mobile network in the UK on all but one provider, and 3 is probably the least subscribed mobile provider in the UK.
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post #69 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kick View Post
Im fine with time warner.



i pay for 10mbps, but it goes to show you that a lot can be done to provide equal service to people...sucks that im moving out of this apartment to another...which probably has a weaker signal
Is that constant? They probably have some stupid net boost like Rogers in Canada. Short test and short downloads hit 20, but the average is 10 on larger files.
     
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post #70 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
"What we need to understand is that while ISPs aren’t currently regulated by the government, they are already severely regulated. Not by government. They are regulated by YOU. You are their customer. You are the boss. You hold the checkbook. ISP companies are regulated by profits. That’s right, profit is the regulator. Like every company that is in business for profit, they have to answer to their customers. All successful businesses are constantly sniffing; trying to figure out what customers want. Profit makes them care about you. Customers will only voluntarily hand over money if it’s worth it. Right now we have de-facto Net Neutrality, because that’s what you want. That’s what we all want. We have to understand that the Internet has evolved by virtue of the decisions of billions of users and content creators. If you are on Facebook, you are a content creator. ISPs have responded to our needs and continually invest tremendous money and resources to provide better options. They ARE answerable to you, and thus they ARE highly regulated by you."
Except they can't pay with their wallets because ISPs have monopolies in many regions in the US. It's either that or not having internet access. Which do you think people will choose? Thanks for trying.
    
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