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Warning: XFX's silent revision on the 6970 - Page 18

post #171 of 234
Did XFX notify anyone or change the part number? No? Seems "silently" is quite applicable.
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post #172 of 234
If I went to a restaurant, ordered a steak and got a salisbury steak, I would not be happy.

He ordered a GPU with the model number of a reference card and did not receive a reference card.

It really comes down to what you consider the "model number" as. I found a definition online which explains how I see the term

Quote:
A particular version or design of an object that is made in multiple versions
If you use that definition, the OP has every right to be upset as it's a different version using the same model number.

(Seems almost like a bait and switch, except the item they're offering is the same..just lower build quality)
    
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post #173 of 234
I fully agree with the OP. XFX did not have a proper behavior. And he only got the "secret" offer for a replacement because he happened to know that a XFX employee was a regular at a certain forum and he got to talk personally. This is, of course, not the normal way to do things. Not everyone is fortunate enough to know the right person. That is not even a very legitimate way to do things in the first place as it can lead to one person being favored and not the others. And as he said, through the normal channels - which is what most of the consumers would be using - he didn't get a thing.

People can always say that the consumer has to defend himself from shady companies' tactics, and not blame the company if he didn't pay attention in the first place. That is correct to a certain extent - but then again, you have to set reasonable limits - and that is what is at stake here. The OP was reasonable, XFX wasn't.

Some of those people even went as far as saying something as preposterous as "a model number is only of interest to the company itself". This is so wrong on so many levels I'm not even sure I should argument.

Let's see a few examples:

- motherboards that went through a revision process. They are stated in the manufacturer's site. Why ? Could have implications not only on functionality, but also what is the correct Bios update you need.

- GPU's the same thing. Some graphics cards come with GDDR memory from one manufacturer, the same GPU model can come with the exact same configuration, but GDDR memory from a different manufacturer, that, again, needs a different BIOS.

- CPU's, same thing - not only do revisions bring lower temperatures, power consumption and more overclock headroom, but also new instructions and new features. May I remind those who don't know, some CPU models from Intel from a few years ago came without Virtualization, and some with Virtualization. Take the Pentium Dual Core E5300 - first available without and later with Virtualization. The same applies to the Core 2 Quad Q8200 and Q8300.

- When you are searching for drivers you may need the exact model number - happened to me with a TV Tuner from Hauppaugge - different decoder chips needed different drivers, or complaining about a product you bought, it's not uncommon for the manufacturer to ask what is the board revision, so they can troubleshoot the problem properly and give you the right solution.


Just because companies have very arguable practices, it doesn't mean the consumer always has to take the burden. A few of you may not remember this, but 20 years ago, people had way less consumer rights. The warranty period for example was shorter and you were on your own way earlier. And the conditions where the warranty applied were also different and favored the manufacturer - in an unreasonable manner.

If it wasn't for people like the OP pointing out that it is only reasonable - that is what we are talking about here - for them to change the model number when they do a PCB change with such big implications (no bios switch and different heatsink mounting layout - which is very important on a high-end card that employs a loud and thermally inefficient cooler, which makes it even more likely to be replaced by the end user), we would still have almost no rights.

It's up to us to call them out when they don't behave accordingly to what is reasonable.

This is not about asking them to not change the reference layout as I incredulously read someone post here. It's something as simple as changing/adding a letter in a model number when they do such a big, functional, change, or adding a V1.1 at the end of the reference. Other vendors do that not only on the website, but also on the product box - no need to unpack a card.

This is all about being reasonable. In a time when many people buy online, the information should be as clear as possible. It is not reasonable for the OP to have to wait for the card to arrive and then open the box to realize he was deceived. This could have been avoided by XFX. Consumers have the right to be properly informed.

The OP was not properly informed. In fact, if you go to the XFX website, the HD6970 product page only has one model, and it has the AMD logo on the PCB, which is clearly not what the OP got (see the photo on the first OP post).
Edited by tpi2007 - 4/15/11 at 7:44pm
 
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post #174 of 234
Thread Starter 
@azianai: you are arguing on emotional grounds, which makes no sense. I presented evidence (ie. rational, verifiable facts) that XFX failed to update their model number following an important change, whereas competitors such as PowerColor or MSI succeeded in keeping to the usual naming conventions. A model number indicating a reference PCB should include a reference PCB in the box, plain and simple.

You and your trolling friends have a problem with my arguments because you seem to live under the delusion that everyone on an internet board whines just for kicks, or do it out of petty needs. Your counter-argument to my post is that I'm a whiny ***** out to make drama and inflame the public towards XFX. That is your opinion, but you are wrong. Dead wrong, as dead as the body I brought to the morgue last week.

You can argue the evidence I present on rational or scientific grounds if you wish, but you have no say in determining what my intentions were, or are. You do not know me. You have no idea how I think or what I do. So for you to claim my motives were dishonorable based on a word in the subject I used is completely ludicrous. Stupid, even.

20 pages later, I realize that trolls will be trolls. I do not need to convince you that my intentions were noble: I owe you nothing at all. I think the vast majority of readers understood I was trying to warn the community of this unannounced change (which not even retailers knew about mind you). If you are too narrow minded, cynical or immature to see nothing but pettiness in my posts, you're the one with the problem. Not everyone has a secret agenda. I did not invite, anywhere in my post, people to boycott XFX.

I presented facts, provided a context for those facts (the waterblock incident), but you failed to understand the context was not related to the problem. The method of discovery is not tied to the problem, which you also failed to argue on rational grounds. I can accept discussions and opinions that differ from my own, but when you start flaming, insulting and patronizing, you lose all credibility and respect. You were clearly biased from the very beginning, so you can't argue on equal grounds when someone isn't transparent. What is the point otherwise?
    
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post #175 of 234
This is not the first time I have seen this. The gtx 260 is a good example (the 65nm to 55nm reduction was just an excuse) No more overvolting via software, no more backplates. All nvidia cared was making a cheaper card
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post #176 of 234
Why are people even using stickers to buy cards?

Especially as those stickers are for vendor reference only.

Granted these stickers give some indication of what PCB layout you MIGHT be getting, It's not 100% guaranteed.

Anyone buying a card based on a sticker, I'll rephrase, Anyone buying a card based on a sticker that has number/letters that meen nothing nor have anything to do with the consumer is asking for trouble.

You ordered a XFX 6970 and you got an XFX 6970, No were does it state that they HAVE to give you a reference card.

You took a gamble buying it based on a sticker that XFX use for internal reference and complain.

It might not be the card you wanted but it's the card you ordered.
post #177 of 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatteh316 View Post
Why are people even using stickers to buy cards?

Especially as those stickers are for vendor reference only.

Granted these stickers give some indication of what PCB layout you MIGHT be getting, It's not 100% guaranteed.

Anyone buying a card based on a sticker, I'll rephrase, Anyone buying a card based on a sticker that has number/letters that meen nothing nor have anything to do with the consumer is asking for trouble.

You ordered a XFX 6970 and you got an XFX 6970, No were does it state that they HAVE to give you a reference card.

You took a gamble buying it based on a sticker that XFX use for internal reference and complain.

It might not be the card you wanted but it's the card you ordered.
You're really really reaching down to find fault with the OP here. How else does a person, not just the OP, but ANYBODY order an item without the manufacturers part number? If you can answer this question then you have a valid point.

I support the OP in letting us know that XFX did not make a change to their model number, even after they made significant changes to the card. Posting on multiple forum is fine. OCN is not the center of the enthusiast community.
post #178 of 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyin15sec View Post
You're really really reaching down to find fault with the OP here. How else does a person, not just the OP, but ANYBODY order an item without the manufacturers part number? If you can answer this question then you have a valid point.

I support the OP in letting us know that XFX did not make a change to their model number, even after they made significant changes to the card. Posting on multiple forum is fine. OCN is not the center of the enthusiast community.
I don't know about you, but majority of people who buy items go by the Product name.

I buy a new Motorola Droid 2, i'll be buying a droid 2, not a model number specific to the droid 2.

The OP bought a HD6970, he got a HD6970.
Can anyone who's saying i'm "trolling" claim he did not get a HD6970 video card? Can anyone say it does not perform like the other stock 6970 video cards?
post #179 of 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by azianai View Post
I don't know about you, but majority of people who buy items go by the Product name.

I buy a new Motorola Droid 2, i'll be buying a droid 2, not a model number specific to the droid 2.

The OP bought a HD6970, he got a HD6970.
Can anyone who's saying i'm "trolling" claim he did not get a HD6970 video card? Can anyone say it does not perform like the other stock 6970 video cards?
TigerLord got *a* 6970, granted, but it did not match the exact specifications he desired and reasonably assumed would exist for the card he bought.

@TigerLord: The way I see it, at this point? Swap with somebody who doesn't want to watercool and doesn't mind getting a different PCB. Hell, I'd swap with you if I had a 6970, because I am strictly an air cooling person.
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post #180 of 234
Buy Sapphire, stay out of trouble.

It's pretty hilarious how certain folks think its fine to recieve a completely different product than what you ordered. So If I order a black laptop and recieve a blue one, then it's OK?
Hell no, it's not OK at all. I ordered black, then I should get black.

This is basic logic. If you can't understand it, then you're born stupid.
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