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3GB GTX 580 or 1.5GB sufficient on U3011 2560x1600 maxxing AA whenever possible? - Page 7

post #61 of 102
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post
About AMD, reference brand doesn't matter that much. Its more about RMA where you live. If they are going to be at stock cooler, it doesn't really matter.

I don't know how much you can sell your 570, but if you get 400$ on it, you can are looking at paying 1445$ for a U3011 and two 6950 2GB, which I think is the best route if you are money pressed.

A 2GB card is more than enough for 1600p, and two of those will give you more than you need in terms of maxing out AA, especially if you unlock them to 6970.

If you really can't live without physx, get a second 570 and the U3011, which will set you back by 1676$.
4 or 8 MSAA is more than possible in almost every game, which means you will have no issues to compromise anything (well, maybe except in metro 2033).

Both options, I think, are the best and the cheapest.



P.S. Yamaha R1 is for pansies.
Get a real men bike. SuperDuke R ftw

I'll plan for a Duke later in life, because no point getting a cheaper one when the S and R models are out there (I hope to get an 1198R or whatever is equivalent is hopefully in about 5 years or so). Anyway, I don't think you should get me started on the R1, or i'll have to bring the troops down from the R1 forum, haha!

Your recommendation on a 2nd 570 SLi-ed with the U3011 - comes with the restriction of the AA at 1600p. Now, if someone running eyefinity at 4800x900 (1600x900 x 3monitors) booted up metro and ran it at 4xMSAA - or say GTA IV on absolute max settings, that would give me a pretty darn close comparison to with 1600p....

..since 2560x1600 = 4,096,000 /// and 1600x900x3 = 4,320,000 . If I could get a vram reading at that res (or better still 1600p) on the most demanding stuff - Metro,etc - I should be able to get the determining fact down!

I guess I shouldn't even be considering the 3GB 580 because 2 of those would be unnecessary at 1600p. I shouldn't even consider em. I guess now the battle is between the 570 and the dual 6950s - adding another 570 would be something I'm leaning towards more - Just that the damn vram issue is such a BI**H !
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post #62 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergod2000 View Post
I'll plan for a Duke later in life, because no point getting a cheaper one when the S and R models are out there (I hope to get an 1198R or whatever is equivalent is hopefully in about 5 years or so). Anyway, I don't think you should get me started on the R1, or i'll have to bring the troops down from the R1 forum, haha!


Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergod2000 View Post
Your recommendation on a 2nd 570 SLi-ed with the U3011 - comes with the restriction of the AA at 1600p. Now, if someone running eyefinity at 4800x900 (1600x900 x 3monitors) booted up metro and ran it at 4xMSAA - or say GTA IV on absolute max settings, that would give me a pretty darn close comparison to with 1600p....
You can see it here.
They got very low score with adaptive AA.
This game is a killer. Kinda hard to get very high FPS at 1600p.
But for the rest of the games, they got much higher FPS results at 1600p.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergod2000 View Post
I guess I shouldn't even be considering the 3GB 580 because 2 of those would be unnecessary at 1600p. I shouldn't even consider em. I guess now the battle is between the 570 and the dual 6950s - adding another 570 would be something I'm leaning towards more - Just that the damn vram issue is such a BI**H !
Yeah nvidia wheren't that smart to keep the vram so low.
But in general, its not really that needed to most users.
Someone playing on a single 1920x1080 monitor with a 6970 2GB, he will almost never get to fill the vram, but most likely will reach the GPU wall first with extreme AA.

But for you, in truth, the 6950 2GB is the better option.
The 2GB will help a lot, and even tho the are a bit slower than the 570s, the extra vram will neglect that at 1600p.
Edited by Defoler - 4/27/11 at 5:37am
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post #63 of 102
Thread Starter 
Hey guys,

I managed to find a few reviews that compared SLI vs Xfire scaling with 2 cards that brought out performance at 2560x1600, between the 6950 and the 570 single, crossfire, and as well in tomshardware's article, they covered tri-fire and tri-sli as well.

I must say that the review speaks volumes about scaling, which i think has changed in recent times due to AMDs driver updates causing a new favour (which i think could have been my mistake, because I based my purchase of the gtx 570 on the hardened knowledge of that card's performance back in jan-feb).

Anyway, here's probably the most helpful one that I read - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...g,2865-11.html

Over at Anandtech, here= http://www.anandtech.com/show/4061/a...eon-hd-6950/15
Metro at 1600p crossfire performance far exceeds the 1.5gb GTX580s in SLi. Contradicting, but I think it's the vram, since Vega has shown how well Metro scales with the 3gb 580s.

What is shocking is the amount of money i'll save with a dual 6950 flashed to 6970 setup over 2x gtx 570 at the prices i stated earlier, and on top of that, the review show fps being far better than the 570s (which makes me quite sad ).

What the article does point out though, is that dual 570s still do very well with metro at 1600p with 4xmsaa - and i think that the handling of the memory combined with the gpu power of the 570 still makes it a strong contender despite its vram limitation.

As quoted from windfire in another thread on the 570sli vs 6950xfire issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by windfire View Post
Benchmarkextreme did an extensive GTX570 scaling test at 2560x1600 over a range of 18 games.
As OP will move to 2560x1600 in the future, the result is a good reference.
Link:http://benchmarkextreme.com/Articles/GTX%20570/P21.html

As the first 2 graphs below show, 2-way SLI scaling index is 1.82 (out of theoretical max of 2.0) and 3-way SLI scaling index is 1.34 (out of theoretical max of 1.5).
These numbers are more accurate and realistic as they reflect an average of 18 games (vs 5 games used by Tom's).

From Tom's data (using x4 green bars of the 3rd graph below), 2-way Xfire is 1.92 while 3-way Xfire is 1.27 (1 + (244.87-192.34)/192.34).

So, on the scaling percentage of dual cards at 2560x1600, it is GTX570's 1.82 vs HD6950's 1.92 (and I suppose 6970 scales similarly).

My thought: As OP said ''Performance would be my first priority followed by stability (read: bug free usage)'', I suppose it is good to reflect upon OP's own experience with GTX470 SLI and HD6870 CF and then decide on the side with higher stability.
Hmmmm...

I'd hate to give up my 570 though .. I really like it at 1080p
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post #64 of 102
Most of time I give advice vg ... it's cause I already did the work for you

The 6970/50 cards (and newest Catalysts) seem like they're really 'tuned' to totally rock at 2560x1600.

Personally I also think the 6990 is worth a look. You can add a 6950/70 later for some tri-fire if you ever need more juice. Although this review is arguably unfair in terms of comparing 3 gpu's vs 2 gpu's, they considered it a worthy comparison based on the cost of both setups being very close. And the tri-fire 6990/6970 absolutely destroys SLI 580's both in terms of max playable settings, and the apples/apples comps. Unfortunately it's all done at Eyefinity/Surround type resolutions.

http://hardocp.com/article/2011/04/1...rifire_review/

The Tri-Fire performance is really pretty amazing ...

Although this particular review should make you feel pretty secure about the 570SLI setup ... it seems to hold up to the 6990 pretty dang nicely ... and although it's a small suite of games they've tested, it seems to be a pretty solid performer all the way up to 5040x1050 resolution (and sometimes even higher).

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2011/..._card_review/1

Hopefully you're familiar with the [H] testing methodology. If not be sure to familiarize yourself with it before trying to interpret one of their reviews.

Personally I really like how they do it (focused on max playable settings), but some people hate it. I say there's enough pure-FPS apples/apples reviews out there in the world (although the [H] reviews have those too). I also like the fps-over-time graphs they do.

Here's another one that does 6990 vs 570SLI vs 580SLI. Looking at straight FPS, the 6990 really gives the 580 SLI a serious run for it's money is the truth. Although 570 SLI still rocks, and again seems to hold up nicely even in triple monitor configs.

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/review...roduction.html
Edited by brettjv - 4/27/11 at 11:57pm
    
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post #65 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post
Here's another one that does 6990 vs 570SLI vs 580SLI. Looking at straight FPS, the 6990 really gives the 580 SLI a serious run for it's money is the truth. Although 570 SLI still rocks, and again seems to hold up nicely even in triple monitor configs.

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/review...roduction.html
Hmm?

It looks like the 570s are choking pretty bad with the demanding titles in surround. AvP and DA2 are pushing its min fps down around 10fps, and bullet storm killed everything except for the 6990.

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/review...lletstorm.html

^Talk about an endorsement for AMD.
post #66 of 102
that link to anandtech is interesting. at 1080p, GTX 580 SLI is the top dog. at 1600p, 6970 CFX is the top dog. the only possible explanation is VRAM bottleneck. since the 580 is in every way superior to 6970 except for the default amount of ram.

so yea, if u can live without physX (its pretty major in metro 2033) then 6950 CFX is your best choice. since it can beat even 580 sli at 1600p for metro 2033.
i'm pretty sure in all the other less vram demanding titles, gtx 580 sli is still top dog.
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post #67 of 102
This thread has made me a bit nervous about my recent purchase of a Dell u2711 with (I can't believe I am writing this) only one 580. If I keep the crazy 16x and 32x AA down I should be cool right?
post #68 of 102
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tats View Post
This thread has made me a bit nervous about my recent purchase of a Dell u2711 with (I can't believe I am writing this) only one 580. If I keep the crazy 16x and 32x AA down I should be cool right?
Sorry kiddo, you made the worst purchase ever. Hehe.. nah jk. 1.5GB seems to be the okay realm for 1440p. 1600p seems to strain most titles, and eyefinity and above eating into 5-6 megapixels definitely makes full use of 2GB.

That link on the 6990+6970 tri-fire vs 580 SLI is a great article that does touch on the vram issues indirectly, but they are running at 5760x1200 which is about ~7 megapixels

1.5GB should be fine on almost all titles at with high AA at 1440p. GPU wall should be hit first before the VRAM wall. Of course, more vram would be better, and nVidia really got cheap with the vram on reference boards - bad idea.

Anyway, why did you get the U2711 over the U3011? I'm still kinda debating between the two..
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post #69 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergod2000 View Post
Sorry kiddo, you made the worst purchase ever. Hehe.. nah jk. 1.5GB seems to be the okay realm for 1440p. 1600p seems to strain most titles, and eyefinity and above eating into 5-6 megapixels definitely makes full use of 2GB.

That link on the 6990+6970 tri-fire vs 580 SLI is a great article that does touch on the vram issues indirectly, but they are running at 5760x1200 which is about ~7 megapixels

1.5GB should be fine on almost all titles at with high AA at 1440p. GPU wall should be hit first before the VRAM wall. Of course, more vram would be better, and nVidia really got cheap with the vram on reference boards - bad idea.

Anyway, why did you get the U2711 over the U3011? I'm still kinda debating between the two..
First, thanks for the reassurance. I grabbed the 27 because I have a smaller desk and like to sit snugged up to it and I think 30 would be too big. I'm actually a bit nervous about the 27 size but I think I will learn to love it.

I was a bit hesitant about the text size and didn't see any reason to go any bigger.

I just got an email that it shipped already! So hopefully a nice unboxing tomorrow and some nice gaming all weekend!
post #70 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergod2000 View Post
That link on the 6990+6970 tri-fire vs 580 SLI is a great article that does touch on the vram issues indirectly, but they are running at 5760x1200 which is about ~7 megapixels
And now we have another great article exactly like that one, but putting 6990+6970 against 580 TRI-SLI. 3 GPUs against 3 GPUs. Surprising results.

6990+6970. 200W less, 500$ less, and beating 580 Tri-SLI. Impressive.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2011/...trifire_review

Conclusion:

''AMD Radeon Tri-Fire is giving you the same or better performance than GTX 580 3-Way SLI for $500 and 200 watts less. You get both a money savings and a power savings using Radeon 6990/6970 Tri-Fire instead of GeForce GTX 580 3-Way SLI.


It just makes no sense to build a GTX 580 3-Way SLI currently. AMD Radeon 6990/6970 Tri-Fire is better in terms of value, efficiency, and gaming performance than GTX 580 3-Way SLI. If you want to utilize that performance, the 2GB of RAM per GPU on the Radeon HD 6970 will allow you to do this and provide a noticeable gameplay experience and visual improvement over GTX 580 3-Way SLI. No other conclusion can be made at this point, AMD Radeon HD 6970 Tri-Fire is a tremendous value compared to GTX 580 3-Way SLI, and Tri-Fire is the better choice for multi-display gaming.


Given NVDIA's history of excellent SLI scaling, we expected to see the GeForce GTX 580 3-Way SLI dominating AMD Radeon Tri-Fire. Instead, this review has only further reinforced what an incredible value AMD's current generation video cards really are.''
    
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