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6950 mod to 6970 - Page 3

post #21 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senator View Post
Why? There is no reason not to as has been debated a million times. The worst case is a bricked card which you simply RMA. Alternatively you may find artifacting if you get a poorly binned 6950 when you flash it to a 6970. Flash it back and try for an RMA. If not you still have a working 6950.

99.9% of the time it flashed fine and the argument for different ram voltages in the 6970 is still 1) not proved as far as I know? *(I could be wrong here, haven't looked for a bit), and 2) not proven to damage a card at all unlike overvolting a 570 for instance.

Grab a ref 6950, flash it to a 6970 and enjoy. Use the saved cash to snag a waterblock and run the bad boy for years.
It is not only the RAM voltage which differes most importantly the RAM timings are not identical!

And that is the reason for the following mailfunction or improper behavior of the card.

A 6970 flash is unecassary as it is.
The performance gain from it is approximately 1-3 %.
Risking your card to be damaged for a 2 % performance gain is absurd.

But note that also the Shader unlock which is considered less critical also has yet to be proven save.

There are no long term affect studies of both types of unlock so be aware of that before flashing or unlocking.

Lastly you can forget RMA if you unlocked/flashed.
As soon as either one has been conducted your warranty is void.
And even though you flash it back ...there is BIOS Log unit which contains all BIOS activity.
They will see it and reject your RMA request immediately.
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post #22 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Pow View Post
A 6970 flash is unecassary as it is.
The performance gain from it is approximately 1-3 %.
Risking your card to be damaged for a 2 % performance gain is absurd.
I flashed a 6950 to a 6970 and experienced an 8% increase in performance.

Not to mention, it isn't much of a risk. There's a second bios.
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post #23 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by furiousgeorge View Post
I flashed a 6950 to a 6970 and experienced an 8% increase in performance.

Not to mention, it isn't much of a risk. There's a second bios.
I think you are confusing the Shader unlock to 1536 units with the full 6970 BIOS flash.

Here my standard post should give you all the answers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Pow View Post
First off here a little something about the unlock
There are two types of 6950 unlocks:

Type 1 unlock: Shader increase to 1536 units (same as the 6970)
Type 2 unlock: Complete BIOS flash to a 6970

The type 1 unlock is almost risk free and can be achieved with almost all the 6950´s.
The type 2 unlock on the other hand is a bit more risky because due to the full 6970 BIOS flash also the timings of the 6970 and other settings which are different will be applied.
To some cards that ultimately can lead to card failure or mailfunction.
Further marginal differences can be seen here:

But be advised that the Type 2 unlock only yields about 1-3% performance increase.
Wheter the Type 1 unlock + stock 6970 clocks have shown to yield the exact same amount of performance a normal 6970 would achieve
So according to those results one could imply that a Type 1 unlock + stock 6970 settings would upgrade a 6950 to a full 6970 performancewise even though other settings or structural differences are unequal.



Both types of unlocks will void your warranty if something goes wrong so be sure to bare that in mind when doing it.
There have not been any long term studies about the affect of the unlocking process and further causations yet.....but I am confident to say that nobody has encountered any problems yet
So I personally would advise you to leave the unlock be as it is not included in the warranty and just overclock your card 5-10% higher ...thus a higher overclock should be able to not only compensate but even exceed the performance boost the unlock provides
And if you must have an unlocked card at least wait until we know more about its long term affects

I would also like to refer you to my thread in which similar questions and all advantages/features benchmark results,performance comparisons to other cards including all designs etc etc should be displayed and answered

http://www.overclock.net/nvidia/9848...md-6950-a.html

Here the full guide + tips on unlock from TechPowerUp:http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/...ng/vidcard/159
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now you should be pretty much informed about the unlock.
Here a little bit about the unlockability of the 6950´s out there:


If a card unlocks or not is depending on wheter or not it has been laser cut to make it impossilbe for software to unlock the unfunctional units.

Another crutial part of the unlock is for the card to have a BIOS switch so in case somthing goes wrong you can always flash to the second BIOS.

Basically 90% of the tested Twin Frozr III cards unlocked fine there are already some newer laser cut products around so be careful to check the arrival date of the card at your local retailer before buying it to ensure it couldn´t have been laser cut yet.


Hope I could help
Anything earlier than March 15th should be fine I believe


The Full 6970 BIOS flash is highly risky and almost bound to cause mailfunction or improper behavior of the card due to the unequal voltages but most importantly unidentical timings ...the possibility of it working properly is very slight but not impossible.

Even so we don´t know what the long term affects of both unlock and flash are so just be careful.

And especially keep in mind that as soon as you have flashed or unlocked your card RMA capability and warranty are gone.
The BIOS Log unit of the 6950 which can only be interfered with by the manufacturer saves all BIOS activity and lists what has been done to it.
If they check it and trust me they will ..your warranty will be voided and RMA request rejected.

So be careful when doing either of those.

Lastly I just would like you to know that the 10% performance increase of the shader unlock and 1-3% of the 6970 flash are no necassary risks to take...it is better to just give the card a healthy overclock which will not only compensate the performance provided by the above mentioned operations it will also exceed it

Be save
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post #24 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Pow View Post
The Full 6970 BIOS flash is highly risky and almost bound to cause mailfunction or improper behavior of the card due to the unequal voltages but most importantly unidentical timings ...the possibility of it working properly is very slight but not impossible.
As you are so fond of saying, where is the proof? It's not 'highly risky,' as you have stated. In fact, citing the very information you have referenced, the majority succeed in flashing their cards just fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Pow View Post
And especially keep in mind that as soon as you have flashed or unlocked your card RMA capability and warranty are gone.
The BIOS Log unit of the 6950 which can only be interfered with by the manufacturer saves all BIOS activity and lists what has been done to it.
If they check it and trust me they will ..your warranty will be voided and RMA request rejected.
Again no proof. I HAVE RMA'ed a card back to Sapphire that had artifacting after I flashed it back to a 6950. It WAS flashed AND BENCHED as a 6970 before I flashed it back. They RMA'ed no questions asked. Sure, YMMV, but I've never seen any company perform what the check you are citing either. Does that mean it doesn't happen? Of course not. But your information isn't 100% correct either. In my personal experience it is in fact 100% wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Pow View Post
Lastly I just would like you to know that the 10% performance increase of the shader unlock and 1-3% of the 6970 flash are no necassary risks to take...it is better to just give the card a healthy overclock which will not only compensate the performance provided by the above mentioned operations it will also exceed it

Be save
Not true. An overclock by itself will never beat my flashed 6970 seeing as I, and many other who have flashed their's, overclock the GPU's from there.
    
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post #25 of 36
You can unlock non-reference 6950s with a script.

Just log on to TechPowerUp. They got a HUGE thread about this. Maybe they're also in the process of figuring out how to unlock shaders on the new revisions
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post #26 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senator View Post
As you are so fond of saying, where is the proof? It's not 'highly risky,' as you have stated. In fact, citing the very information you have referenced, the majority succeed in flashing their cards just fine.



Again no proof. I HAVE RMA'ed a card back to Sapphire that had artifacting after I flashed it back to a 6950. It WAS flashed AND BENCHED as a 6970 before I flashed it back. They RMA'ed no questions asked. Sure, YMMV, but I've never seen any company perform what the check you are citing either. Does that mean it doesn't happen? Of course not. But your information isn't 100% correct either. In my personal experience it is in fact 100% wrong.



Not true. An overclock by itself will never beat my flashed 6970 seeing as I, and many other who have flashed their's, overclock the GPU's from there.
Agreed to all statements here.

Though, I want to add that the RAM on the 6950s are of worse quality than the 6970's RAM, which means, if you flash it, you'll get the same voltage on the RAM as the 6970, and will likely kill your card.
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post #27 of 36
Just don't go to the bar or out to dinner one weekend and get a 6970 instead?
post #28 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senator View Post
As you are so fond of saying, where is the proof? It's not 'highly risky,' as you have stated. In fact, citing the very information you have referenced, the majority succeed in flashing their cards just fine.

The full 6970 is extremely risky because of the unequal timings and voltages.
Lol you even admit that your flashed card artifacted ergo mailfunctioned due to the flash?


Again no proof. I HAVE RMA'ed a card back to Sapphire that had artifacting after I flashed it back to a 6950. It WAS flashed AND BENCHED as a 6970 before I flashed it back. They RMA'ed no questions asked. Sure, YMMV, but I've never seen any company perform what the check you are citing either. Does that mean it doesn't happen? Of course not. But your information isn't 100% correct either. In my personal experience it is in fact 100% wrong.

I did not say the manufacturers check every single card´s BIOS Log unit to determine if it has been flashed but just because you have been lucky does not mean everybody will?


Not true. An overclock by itself will never beat my flashed 6970 seeing as I, and many other who have flashed their's, overclock the GPU's from there.

Sry but you should gather some information on the flash and unlock first
The 6970 flash provides 1-3% performance gain at most?
A 1 GHZ overclock for example ..achieved with almost every 6950 provides at least 35% performance increase?
Due to that statement I am beginning to question your knowledge about the card and the BIOS flash.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhitePrQjser View Post
Agreed to all statements here.

Though, I want to add that the RAM on the 6950s are of worse quality than the 6970's RAM, which means, if you flash it, you'll get the same voltage on the RAM as the 6970, and will likely kill your card.
The shader unlock is fairly less risky since there are no colliding hardware unsimilarities ...the 6970 flash however induces Memory failure due to uneven voltage and timing adjustments.
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post #29 of 36
I bought a MSI reference 6950 from NewEgg last week and it unlocked to a 6970 without any problems.

I also have a Sapphire HD 6950 that I flashed to a 6970 the day I bought it and it has been running at 940/1400 with the default voltage ever since. I've yet to see a negative side affect and that card has been used for hours (4+) a day for months now. Flashing the card may be risky, but I don't think it leads to a premature death or problems.
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post #30 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Xeb View Post
This. If you get a non-ref then your screwed.
I dont believe the MSI Power edition III is a reference design PCB..and it does indeed allow full unlock
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