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What is better water or air cooling? - Page 3

post #21 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by wermad View Post
Hmmm, why don't we see air cooled cars any more, hmmmm, since they are more reliable. hmmmmmm

edit: not surprised coming from an H50 user
Interesting argument.
To start, the transition from air cooling to liquid cooling in automobiles has nothing to do with reliability. In fact, from a reliability standpoint it was a step backwards. One of the by far most reliable cars ever built, the original VW Beetle was aircooled. There are no headgaskets to blow, no water pumps to wear out, no radiator to crack or clog, no hoses, no coolant. Just one easily replaced belt.

In addition to that, many airplanes are to this day, still aircooled. Anybody that knows about aircraft regulations knows that reliability is held at a nearly absurdly high standard, for instance magneto ignition systems and carburetors are still also common on small aircraft simply for the fact that they are more reliable than electronic fuel injection and sequential electronic ignition systems.

This is the exact same case when it comes to computers. An air cooler is just a heatsink and a fan, heatsinks never wear out and computer fans are so wel engineered by this point that theyre extremely reliable. This is opposed to a water cooling system where you have many more points of failure.

Aircooling:
1) Fans burning out
2) Heatsink clogging with dust

Water cooling:
1) Fans burning out
2) Radiator clogging with dust
3) Radiator clogging internally
4) Blocks clogging internally
5) Pump burning up
4) Hoses failing
5) Clamps failing
6) Reservoir failing
7) Need for regularly replacing coolant

Im all for liquid cooling, it has tremendous benefits and Im looking forward to building my own loop one day, but aircooling is significantly more reliable. I dont see how anybody could disagree with something so blatantly obvious.

As for youre comment about me having an H50, Im not sure what youre implying. Not that it matters, youre generalization about me due to having said cooler have zero argumentative importance.
Edited by Full_Tilt - 4/21/11 at 8:52pm
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Full_Tilt View Post
Aircooling:
1) Fans burning out
2) Heatsink clogging with dust

Water cooling:
1) Fans burning out
2) Radiator clogging with dust
3) Radiator clogging internally
4) Blocks clogging internally
5) Pump burning up
4) Hoses failing
5) Clamps failing
6) Reservoir failing
7) Need for regularly replacing coolant
Mmmm, kinda. You are right that there are more critical components, but from your list:


Water cooling:
1) Fans burning out - More fans with WC, less cooling loss if one burns out.
2) Radiator clogging with dust - same as AC
3) Radiator clogging internally - A
4) Blocks clogging internally - A
5) Pump burning up - It does happen, sure. It is unusual except in rare conditions though
4) Hoses failing - B
5) Clamps failing - B
6) Reservoir failing - B
7) Need for regularly replacing coolant - A

A - Don't run coolant. Distilled water and PT Nuke / KillCoil is the best solution. It does not clog anything up, it is just water, and it does not need to be replaced for at least 2 years. ...


From this thread

B - Quality components properly installed will not fail as you are thinking. If you are going to put these in here you have to add similar things to the air cooling section; heat sink falling off, motherboard bending etc.

Tl:dr - If you use quality components and set it up right then watercooling is not any less reliable than air cooling for the life of your computer.

Edit: With either cooling, the result of it stopping is the same; your computer will heat up until it hits throttling, then thermal shut down. It will not break anything.
Edited by GingerJohn - 4/21/11 at 8:55pm
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post #23 of 39
Good Water is better than Good air, but also costs much more. ie:
The Noctua NH-D14 is arguably one of the best air coolers there is, and costs around $80
With Good water you have to figure the cost for tubes, blocks, reservoirs, pumps, radiators, fans, coolant, ect, and it can all easily come to $200 or more. A WC setup will also use more electricity than standard air. (radiators require several fans to work, and pumps use electricity)
Just because your CPU is running cooler doesn't mean its using less electricity.
Edited by Nemesis158 - 4/21/11 at 9:02pm
post #24 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Full_Tilt View Post
Interesting argument.
To start, the transition from air cooling to liquid cooling in automobiles has nothing to do with reliability. In fact, from a reliability standpoint it was a step backwards. One of the by far most reliable cars ever built, the original VW Beetle was aircooled. There are no headgaskets to blow, no water pumps to wear out, no radiator to crack or clog, no hoses, no coolant. Just one easily replaced belt.

In addition to that, many airplanes are to this day, still aircooled. Anybody that knows about aircraft regulations knows that reliability is held at a nearly absurdly high standard, for instance magneto ignition systems and carburetors are still also common on small aircraft simply for the fact that they are more reliable than electronic fuel injection and sequential electronic ignition systems.

This is the exact same case when it comes to computers. An air cooler is just a heatsink and a fan, heatsinks never wear out and computer fans are so wel engineered by this point that theyre extremely reliable. This is opposed to a water cooling system where you have many more points of failure.

list:

Im all for liquid cooling, it has tremendous benefits and Im looking forward to building my own loop one day, but aircooling is significantly more reliable. I dont see how anybody could disagree with something so blatantly obvious.

As for youre comment about me having an H50, Im not sure what youre implying. Not that it matters, youre generalization about me due to having said cooler have zero argumentative importance.

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post #25 of 39
water

//end thread
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post #26 of 39
There is many benefits and draw backs to both.

Air: Simple, Works, cheap, efficient. Cons: cant overclock too much with low temps, can be loud, may change room temperature.

Water: works, more efficient, keeps temps lower, more overclocking potential, Cons: may leak if done wrong, must handle equipment, more expensive, harder to setup.

overall, watercooling is the way to go if you have the know how. its more fun to play around with too.

so do your homework. find a nice watercooling kit and give it a try.
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post #27 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by GingerJohn View Post
Mmmm, kinda. You are right that there are more critical components, but from your list:


Water cooling:
1) Fans burning out - More fans with WC, less cooling loss if one burns out.
2) Radiator clogging with dust - same as AC
3) Radiator clogging internally - A
4) Blocks clogging internally - A
5) Pump burning up - It does happen, sure. It is unusual except in rare conditions though
4) Hoses failing - B
5) Clamps failing - B
6) Reservoir failing - B
7) Need for regularly replacing coolant - A

A - Don't run coolant. Distilled water and PT Nuke / KillCoil is the best solution. It does not clog anything up, it is just water, and it does not need to be replaced for at least 2 years. ...
*snip*

B - Quality components properly installed will not fail as you are thinking. If you are going to put these in here you have to add similar things to the air cooling section; heat sink falling off, motherboard bending etc.

Tl:dr - If you use quality components and set it up right then watercooling is not any less reliable than air cooling for the life of your computer.

Edit: With either cooling, the result of it stopping is the same; your computer will heat up until it hits throttling, then thermal shut down. It will not break anything.
I agree with you 100%
Im not saying liquid cooling is terrible unreliable or anything, I was just arguing that air is more reliable. If youre building a PC for an integrated purpose, like a kiosk or in a vehicle, or basically any situation where maintenance needs to be kept to a minimum, Air cooling would be advised.
On a gaming rig owned by a computer enthusiast you would take the precautions and do the maintenance to prevent these possible failures and will also be more willing to deal with the possibility of a failure in exchange for the performance benefits.

On another note, I appreciate you making a proper contribution to this discussion, as opposed to other users...
post #28 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darqside View Post

Air: Simple, Works, cheap, efficient. Cons: cant overclock too much with low temps, can be loud, may change room temperature.
Why do people say this? Water Cooling, Air cooling, even phase change cooling heats up the room air (unless your thermal conversion point is outside the room / building such as rad's out a window).

You all get that the heat generated needs to go somewhere it doesn't just vanish if you use water. WC is just much more efficient at getting it away from your components and into the air than an air cooler.

There is no "May" about it, all PC cooling will change the room temperature, how much and how fast depends on how much air flow the room has and size of the room. Close the doors and windows of a normal size room and run your PC with any cooling and prime or other, come back in 4 hours and the room will be a sauna.

Sorry / rant off.
post #29 of 39
What ratdog said. You're simply moving the heat away from the CPU. But at the end of the day, it will still be producing 100W of heat or w/e.

Q:But what about laptops getting super hot?
A:Because their heatsinks are crap!! Limited space and weight limits the size of the heatsink. Put a normal desktop heatsink on it and watch the temperatures plummet! These processors will generally be producing only around 35W of heat vs your 100W on a desktop!!
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post #30 of 39
Water cooling destroys heat energy and you know it!!!
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