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[Gizmodo] Alleged LHC Memo Hints Scientists Have Found the Elusive Higgs Boson - Page 3

post #21 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantum Reality;13269488 
I'm also waiting for the peer review, but if they have found the Higgs, that's good news for the Standard Model. tongue.gif

On the other hand I've been betting privately they won't find the Higgs, which would force scientists to try and explain how a theory that correctly predicted not only the electroweak unification but also the masses of the exchange bosons of the weak interaction, nevertheless seems to have the wrong mechanism for its unification process.

(that said we need to be careful since there are other Higgs Bosons that have to do with imparting mass to particles that aren't exchange bosons)

But even if they don't find the Higgs particle, does that mean it doesn't exist? I mean, basically it means that their particular experiments can't show it exists--but it still doesn't prove that it does not exist.
    
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post #22 of 32
If they can't find it, then a Higgs Boson with the particular predicted mass does not exist. There could be much heavier Higgs Bosons, which would still require revisions to the Standard Model (supersymmetry, for example, predicts a Higgs mass in a higher range than the non-supersymmetric Standard Model).

I'm still betting there'll be no Higgs tongue.gif
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post #23 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by DayoftheGreek;13266857 
First of all, I don't think you have any idea what you are talking about. It isn't just about being small.

Secondly, even if smaller things exist, we still found (maybe) the next smallest one! Forward progress is great. We can't just stop looking because you think, "imo these is no smallest particle or god particle."

Thirdly, again, this is just another step forward in trying to understand this universe. There are tons of questions left to be answered if this turns out to be real. Finding this particle doesn't magically mean we understand the universe, its just one more thing that science can move out of the "maybe" column and into the, "almost certainly yes," column.

I hate that this thing gets called the God particle, since it really stirs up all sorts of crazy emotions in people when they start relating the word to the common idea of god. It's a pretty big deal for theoretical physics, but if you don't know what it is, it's not going to have any affect on your life anytime soon. Other than the affect it already has now, lol.
never said we shouldnt look for it! but look at the history of particle physics they are looking for the fundamental particle of the universe, how do u know there is such a thing? imo it takes all of these particles to create life or mass, i dont think they are going to find one particle thats responsible for creation, what they need to do is take the trillions they've wasted on this collider and put it towards free energy so we can travel the galaxy and supply the power it takes with no cost to the world to find these really small particles
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post #24 of 32
So... much... misunderstanding... of science....
post #25 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129;13270767 
So... much... misunderstanding... of science....

enlighten us please, i mean we cant have an amateur discussion, science is mostly theory no?
Edited by Ironcobra - 4/25/11 at 4:45pm
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post #26 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironcobra;13270789 
enlighten us please, i mean we cant have an amateur discussion, science is mostly theory no?

OH GOD IT GETS WORSE

*bangs head on desk*
post #27 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boyboyd;13270923 
OH GOD IT GETS WORSE

*bangs head on desk*

o the ego of u people, its laughable, so established scientific systems never get proven wrong?we assume to know everything thats published is fact, science is mostly theory, there is a theory that there is a bose einstein a theory that there is dark matter, theories theories theories thats all it is
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post #28 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironcobra;13270716 
never said we shouldnt look for it! but look at the history of particle physics they are looking for the fundamental particle of the universe, how do u know there is such a thing? imo it takes all of these particles to create life or mass, i dont think they are going to find one particle thats responsible for creation, what they need to do is take the trillions they've wasted on this collider and put it towards free energy so we can travel the galaxy and supply the power it takes with no cost to the world to find these really small particles

No they aren't.

Facts/Evidence are more important than your opinion. Unless you are a physics PHD, then they are still more important, but not as much.

No such thing, its basic physics. The govt pisses away trillions of dollars all the time, if they could just take a year off and make free energy (and then sell it!) it would've been done a long time ago. Its an energy companies dream to sell energy that doesn't cost them anything.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironcobra;13271056 
o the ego of u people, its laughable, so established scientific systems never get proven wrong?we assume to know everything thats published is fact, science is mostly theory, there is a theory that there is a bose einstein a theory that there is dark matter, theories theories theories thats all it is

Things do get proven wrong, but usually its more like they get proven better. Science only gets more accurate as time goes on.

Stop saying theory like its a bad thing. A hypothesis is a random guess with come evidence, a theory is WAY more researched an accepted. Scientific theory is so high level, it actually contains laws. For example, the THEORY of planetary motion uses Kepler's LAWS of planetary motion to put space probes within tiny fractions of accuracy of where they are supposed to be. As the Theory evolves, the accuracy gets even better. Theory and Laws are both equally supported. So think of it this way, when you hear about the theory of evolution, or the theory of quantum physics, those ideas have just as much support from observable evidence as scientific LAWS (like bouyancy, pressure, etc).

To put it roughly, theories are just broader laws. They are in no way less supported by evidence.
    
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post #29 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by DayoftheGreek;13271315 
No they aren't.

Facts/Evidence are more important than your opinion. Unless you are a physics PHD, then they are still more important, but not as much.

No such thing, its basic physics. The govt pisses away trillions of dollars all the time, if they could just take a year off and make free energy (and then sell it!) it would've been done a long time ago. Its an energy companies dream to sell energy that doesn't cost them anything.





Things do get proven wrong, but usually its more like they get proven better. Science only gets more accurate as time goes on.

Stop saying theory like its a bad thing. A hypothesis is a random guess with come evidence, a theory is WAY more researched an accepted. Scientific theory is so high level, it actually contains laws. For example, the THEORY of planetary motion uses Kepler's LAWS of planetary motion to put space probes within tiny fractions of accuracy of where they are supposed to be. As the Theory evolves, the accuracy gets even better. Theory and Laws are both equally supported. So think of it this way, when you hear about the theory of evolution, or the theory of quantum physics, those ideas have just as much support from observable evidence as scientific LAWS (like bouyancy, pressure, etc).

To put it roughly, theories are just broader laws. They are in no way less supported by evidence.

thank you, now thats a post! something i agree with not the one liner bs bangs head on desk that contributes nothing to the thread except my ego is bigger then yours, i am aware of scientific law vs scientific theory but the whole god particle is very much theory, and i dont think theory is bad its how ideas start and without ideas where are we

i dont have a phd and im betting no1 in here does, but every couple of years its funny they think they might have found the god particle, only to say later they didnt, and its always around the time there budget is cut back

I watched a vid a few years back about this subject and others if anyone intrested hes a lil out there but what theoretical physicist isnt, its long but well worth it:
Nassim Haramein: Crossing The Event
http://www.in.com/videos/watchvideo-10-nassim-haramein-crossing-the-event-horizon-14-9335321.html

the order is a lil confusing it goes 1.0 part 1-5 2.0 part 1-5 3.0 part 1-5

edit: backup link diff date but same presentation
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6151699791256390335#
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1895475242307393956&hl=en&emb=1
Edited by Ironcobra - 4/26/11 at 11:04am
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post #30 of 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironcobra;13266023 
imo there is no smallest particle or god particle, they always think they find the smallest particle thats the basis for all life only to find one thats even smaller as tech enables them to look smaller, i dont think we are even close to figuring out the universe yet when we cant even figure out how to run our planet, how long ago did they think electrons and protons were the smallest

last time i checked they were struggling to get financing so im sure this is more of a pr stunt then anything
Who said we run this planet?:rolleyes:We sit on this planet,it runs us.
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