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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-05-2019, 11:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Ryzen 2600 questions

Hello, especially to the glorious "old guard of AMD" (@cssOrkinman, @miklkit , @chrisjames61 , @The Sandman , @Minotaurtoo , @johan , @flanker , @jclafi , @Mega Man , @mus1mus , superstition and pardon to those i don't remember), which i think i saw still hanging around. It is probably not the wisest time to upgrade (i read about Ryzen 3000), but, i got a bit of upgraditis, a bit of tiresome USB bugs from Gigabyte 970 and also, not knowing what the future holds for Win7 support in B550 motherboards, i bit the bullet to pass to a 2600 build. I was torn between the 2600 and a 1700 (only 10 euro difference), but at the end, i went 2600 for the better memory support and for the higher clocks (i want to stay at stock 65W and practically the 2600 i found it performs like a Zen 1st gen @3.6Ghz). Also, wanting to keep stock speeds, i figure it's better to have higher single core performance, than another "FX", where i won't be really using 8c/16T. Even my video encoding days are over and i will keep FX rigs for that eventuality anyway, so the main rig will be for internet, films, music, "Sunday retro-gaming", so i guess the 2600 was more suited. To be honest the main reason, is i want native USB3, so that i can break free from the odd Gigabyte BIOS bugs and secondarily, to get an uplift in single core. To be honest i feel almost guilty because the FX has served me so well and i am nitpicking, like when i see a single core hit 100% and i think "oh, i could boost that". And that's pretty much the excuse for the upgrade. So i read that Ryzen 2600 is + 48% single core and +95% multicore, which is more than enough for me. When Zen4 goes EOL, i will probably grab an 8 core and be done with it.

So, the parts, will be:
- Ryzen 2600 (65W, a relief from FX's heat generation).
- MSI B450 Gaming Plus (i really wanted mATX, but they all have just 3 fan headers and in inconvenient places too, except for Asrock, which though uses 3 phases doubled and Nikos mosfets, which was enough for me to pass, so i went full ATX, and MSI seems the one with best RAM compatibility on reasonably priced RAM. Reasonably being a euphemism, but anyway).
- Corsair 2x8GB 3000C15 (the MSI board's QVL actually supports 4 DIMMs, more reason to get the combination!).
- Windows 7 (yeah, yeah, spare me the lecture)

The bad thing is they will need a week to arrive...

I have some questions:

1) I read Ryzen Master doesn't work on Windows 7. Is that a real problem for someone who wishes to stay at stock speeds? I mean, i don't know what exactly you can see, but i doubt it's something critical, right?

2) I am slipstreaming a Win7 DVD with Windows updates minus telemetry and with AMD USB drivers as we speak, but MSI's page says "Microsoft Win7 Hotfix installation is required for AMD Chipset Driver to be installed successfully." Any knows which exactly is this hotfix? I hope it's not telemetry...

3) I read MSI B450 have the best VRM (4 phase but with good heatsinks), but i also read of few people mentioning of very high stock voltage. I remember the same from FX days. Is this the "usual" behaviour in MSI B450? If so, is manually undervolting possible? If you undervolt, do you still keep the power savings? Ideally, i wouldn't want to undervolt and mess with all that at all, but if they shoot 1.45v for no reason, i will probably have to.

4) Is there a core unparking utility for Win7 like it was for FX or is it not needed for Ryzen?

5) Is the MSI B450 Bios stable for stock use or are there "known bugs" (i have to ask, since i come from Gigabyte 970 and i am used to quirks from that).

6) What are the safe package and core temperatures for Ryzen 2600? (i mean the equivalent of 70C core for FX).

7) Luckily, all my AMD coolers clipped to the standard AMD brackets, so i suppose they will all be compatible with AM4 (i have available Scythe Katana3, Xigmatek Balder and Alpenfohn Sella, but i think i will use the Katana3 , because it shoots some air towards the VRM too). I 've seen only photo of the stock AMD cooler and i don't think it's better than any of the above, right? So that i won't waste time trying different coolers.

Anything else weird i should know about Ryzen 2600 on Windows 7? (I know about "wufuc").

I am just trying to cover everything i can think of beforehand, so that i can have a system up and running ASAP.

Thank you in advance.

Last edited by Undervolter; 02-05-2019 at 11:35 AM.
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-05-2019, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, i think i found a probable answer to my own question 4: according to an article, the same M$ hotfix that unparks cores for FX, works for Ryzen too in Win7. If there is some other tool, you are welcome to post it.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-06-2019, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-08-2019, 10:19 AM
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Most of your questions are about Win 7 on Ryzen which I know nothing about. There were some threads about it in 2017. As I recall it was more trouble than it was worth. It's getting close to time to seriously start considering Linux.

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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-08-2019, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by miklkit View Post
Most of your questions are about Win 7 on Ryzen which I know nothing about. There were some threads about it in 2017. As I recall it was more trouble than it was worth. It's getting close to time to seriously start considering Linux.
Thanks, i will probably find things on my own. The problem with Linux is that i have some specific programs that i doubt exist in Linux and that i won't be able to play games. It's not that i play a lot, but the few i play, need Windows. One solution would be dual boot, but then it becomes a mess with multitasking. I will probably end up in Linux, if i ever manage to stop all games completely and find some equivalent utilities for Linux for some blu ray, encoding and such stuff.

At the end, i may be forced to move to Win10, but as long as i can avoid it, i will!
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 04:18 AM
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Glad to see you back Undervolter. I always enjoyed your posts. Good luch with your new rig.

Ryzen- Too lazy to list everything. ASUS ROG Crosshair VI Hero- R5 1600, MSI Gaming Titanium- R5 2400G
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 05:34 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Undervolter View Post
Ok, i think i found a probable answer to my own question 4: according to an article, the same M$ hotfix that unparks cores for FX, works for Ryzen too in Win7. If there is some other tool, you are welcome to post it.
Look into Power Settings Explorer The core parking is just a simple change in the registry but this utility makes it more friendly. There are also about 40 other settings that can be tweaked to get the processor to "behave" the way you want it to.

Additionally, you can import this XML file I have attached using that utility and it will unhide all of the settings so they can be adjusted using the Advanced Power Settings within windows. The forum wont let me upload xml format but just change the file extension from txt to xml and then import using the utility.
Attached Files
File Type: txt Powersettings.txt (80.4 KB, 10 views)

CPU- AMD Ryzen [email protected] *[email protected](R.I.P)*
MOTHERBOARD-
ROG Crosshair VII Hero
GPU- EVGA GTX 1080ti SC2 w/ XOC [email protected] (Morpheus Cooler)
RAM- G.SKILL TridentZ [email protected] (14-13-13-22-36)
COOLING- CORSAIR Hydro Series H115i Pro w/ Noctua NF-A14 (x7)
CASE- Silverstone RL06 Pro (Modified)
MONITORS- VIOTEK GN32C (x2)



Last edited by CJMitsuki; 02-10-2019 at 05:43 AM.
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-10-2019, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by chrisjames61 View Post
Glad to see you back Undervolter. I always enjoyed your posts. Good luch with your new rig.
Glad to see you too! Apparently not many of the old members post much anymore! Thanks, i hope i won't have much trouble.

Quote: Originally Posted by CJMitsuki View Post
Look into Power Settings Explorer The core parking is just a simple change in the registry but this utility makes it more friendly. There are also about 40 other settings that can be tweaked to get the processor to "behave" the way you want it to.

Additionally, you can import this XML file I have attached using that utility and it will unhide all of the settings so they can be adjusted using the Advanced Power Settings within windows. The forum wont let me upload xml format but just change the file extension from txt to xml and then import using the utility.
Thank you, i 've never heard of this utility before. I 've downloaded it and will keep it ready if needed. I see it can do many things! Don't worry, i understood what you mean by renaming the extension.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 03:27 AM
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Hi Undervolter!

It's always good to see you in this forum and you cannot go wrong with the R5 2600 65W.

In my case, ritght now, my PC is stock since i have one GTX1060 6Gb and the R5 have plenty of power to drive the GPU @ 1080p without any sort of bottleneck.

The multicore performance is incredible and i do recomend you to buy a dirt cheap WD-250Gb Green SSD M.2. Yes is a low end part but after a firmware update the thing is very very fast and will give you some good results.

Also dont bother w/ Ryzen Master, i have Win10 and don't use. My last Win7 instalation was w/ my old FX (my wife PC now), perhaps this patch is send to you by e-mail?

The MSI B450 is very similar to my X470. Board layout, VRM and BIOS do look like. It's a very solid option and you are set to go even when overclocking is in the agenda. About 4.1 Ghz daily is VERY EASY and the board is solid. Nothing to worry about.

About temps i'm using one Cooler Master Hyper 212 Turbo push/pull. I know it's a very dated desing but the performance is there. CPU Stock temps are just great and now it's summer here. So you have 32ºc iddle and 55ºc gaming (multi core game) w/ 26ºc ambient temp. Not that bad at all !

The stock cooler can handle the CPU no problem, but sucks a little. So i went w/ cheap aftermarket solution.

Also you did good with the RAM, it's not a good idea to run lower clock RAM with Ryzen, so about 3000/3200 it's very nice. You can tune timmings to lower latency, use Ryzen DRAM tools, very easy and FUN !

Nice to have you back i hope you enjoy your new RIG !

I will update to Ryzen 2 but only in 2020, when Ryzen 2+ will be lauched. will be the end of road to AM4, so it's a nice one for me.

See ya.

R5 2600 - MSI X470 Gaming Pro - nVIDIA GTX1060 6GB O.C - Corsair Vengeance LPX 16GB @ 3200 - Cooler Master Storm Scout - Western Digital Green 240GB M.2 - Kyngston A400 480GB - Seagate Barracuda 1Tb - Cooler Master Hyper 212 Turbo - SamSung 32in LED - eVGA 750W - Razer Abyssus V2 - Logitech G27

Last edited by jclafi; 02-12-2019 at 01:31 AM.
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 02-11-2019, 03:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by jclafi View Post
Hi Undervolter!

It's always good to see you in this forum and you cannot go wrong with the R5 2600 65W.

In my case, ritght now, my PC is stock since i have one GTX1060 6Gb and the R5 have plenty of power to drive the GPU @ 1080p without any sort of bottleneck.

The multicore performance is incredible and i do recomend you to buy a dirt chep WD-250Gb Green SSD M.2. Yes is a low end part but after a firmware update the thing is very very fast and will give you some good results.

Also dont bother w/ Ryzen Master, i have Win10 and don't use. My last Win7 instalation was w/ my old FX (my wife PC now), perhaps this patch is send to you by e-mail?

The MSI B450 is very similar to my X470. Board layout, VRM and BIOS do look like. It's a very solid option and you are set to go even when overclocking is in the agenda. About 4.1 Ghz daily is VERY EASY and the board is solid. Nothing to worry about.

About temps i'm using one Cooler Master Hyper 212 Turbo push/pull. I know it's a very dated desing but the performance is there. CPU Stock temps are just great and now it's summer here. So you have 32ºc iddle and 55ºc gaming (multi core game) w/ 26ºc ambient temp. Not that bad at all !

The stock cooler can handle the CPU no problem, but sucks a little. So i went w/ cheap aftermarket solution.

Also you did good with the RAM, it's not a good idea to run lower clock RAM with Ryzen, so about 3000/3200 it very nice. You can tune timmings to lower latency, use Ryzen DRAM tools, very esay and FUN !

Nice to have you back i hope you enjoy your new RIG !

I will update to Ryzen 2 but only in 2020, when Ryzen 2+ will be lauched. will be the end of road to AM4, so it's a nice one for me.

See ya.

Glad to see you again! Thank you for your advice. To be honest, i am not in a hurry to switch to M2 any time soon. I will probably go to 500GB SATA SSD and let M2 mature more. I really don't need a bigger SSD right now, but it would be a good excuse to upgrade with SSD an older laptop. To be honest, i haven't read anything about M2 performance drives yet, so maybe i will be surprised. But, for the time being, it's not a priority. Usually, when you rush to a new technology, you pay a lot for something that soon becomes old tech.

In the meantime, i enjoy the benefits of a new platform. The 6.0.1 is made on the FX/Gigabyte 970 UD3P and the 6.0.2 is on the fresh Ryzen:





I feel the system slightly snappier on the desktop compared to FX at 4Ghz, but nothing to write home about. Got 7.8 on processor WEI (0.1 above the FX).

And voilà!



I swear, i had never seen the Scythe Katana3 hit 2700rpm. I swear that on 3 AM3+ motherboards, it was going up to 2350rpm. I don't know what happened. Maybe this MSI motherboard overvolted it? LOL! It has a crazy graph in the BIOS where the RPM goes all the way up to 7000 or something! I was scratching my head when i saw it...

Ambient must be somewhere around 18C (it's winter and late night). But, i can make temps better with more care fans speed and i have also better CPU coolers if needed. I just like the Katana3 for the cosyness of both doing the job and cooling the VRM too. I have also maintained my "FX habbit" and have a 60mm fan on the CPU VRM and a 100mm thin Scythe fan blowing at the back side of the socket. Aaaah, the great teacher that was FX! So, mosfets at 37C...

I think temps are good, given that i haven't the case fans at full speed and 1 fan i have it completely disconnected.

The motherboard, like you say, gave me an excellent impression. Feels very sturdy and well made. OK, it's first time i bought a 100 euro motherboard, so that helped. I bought it mainly for the many fan connectors and the diagnostic LEDs.

I didn't even have to use Windows on USB flash drive (made with the MSI smart tool) or use the PS/2 dongle i have. The mouse and keyboard worked directly (maybe because the top USB ports are USB2? I don't know).

The FX unpark patch, which i had read that works on Ryzen too, well, it doesn't work. Windows refuses to install it, saying there is no compatible device. On the bright side, the WIn7 task scheduler, seems that puts 1 thread on each core, before putting a 2nd thread.




The only "bad" thing, is that the motherboard has too loose timings for trc compared to SPD:




Tomorrow i will see if i can tighten them a bit. Everything else, aside the fans, i left it on auto. More testing tomorrow. I am curious to see performance in Skyrim and Europa Universalis. Overall, impressed by MSI, aside the utilities. I may install "Nahimic", but i read a lot of bad things about it, adding lag. Also i had the "MSI Commander" installed for a while, but i saw it adds a lot of drivers and got rid of it. It was also a bit chaotic. I may put it back at some point. I need to try first without Nahimic and then see if causes troubles, as they say. Actually for Win7 they have only Nahimic2. Nahimic3 is only for Win10. I don't know if i should rejoyce about that or not.

P.S: I hate this new "drag and drop" file thing.
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Last edited by Undervolter; 02-11-2019 at 03:52 PM.
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