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Is AMD current leadership good for end users?

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post #21 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 07:13 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by TriWheel View Post
Isn't it AMD's job to lower prices of NVidia and Intel products?

I don't like them getting all uppity just because they have the superior product.

AMD, you disappoint me, get back in your hole!
AMD did exactly that with intel HEDT. HALF PRICE.

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post #22 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 07:21 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by sblantipodi View Post
High end mainstream CPUs skyrocketed to 1000+ euros in europe for 3950X
entry level HEDT skyrocketed to 1600+ euros for 3960X
and now we have a new "segment" for HEDT with 64 cores...

...I don't consider this market healthy because still after those years, there is no competition and I think that this is not good for us.

Judging a market 2 days into a release is not reasonable. This is not how prices will settle.

You may criticize AMD for launching a product with limited supply. That would be reasonable, but consider this:
AMD is growing its production at a high rate which in itself is impressive. The demand is just so so high and continuing to grow.

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post #23 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 07:52 AM
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yes, its great.... specially once intel drops the core replacement in a couple years. For now though, AMD gets to be a corporation, and make money, which is the charter goal, along with innovation. Those that "errrr mrrr grrrrd underdog" need to move to south america already.
n just wait for intel to toss its GPUs into the market, that'll be great for end users as well.

this is how it goes when someone releases a new killer. Specially when AMD does it, cuz they do small runs... which are supposedly getting larger, though that's at the limit of TSMC's waiting list.

all in all though, from a gaming perspective. right now is a terrible time to build. As we tend to fall in with the console rotation. We don't get anything truly new an awesome until the consoles do. IE: GPUs finally getting HDMI2.1 on the next revolution.

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post #24 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by andrews2547 View Post
Yes, but only if Intel stay competitive.


With current trends of people saying/doing things like "I oNlY bY aMd BeCaUsE tHeY'rE tHe UnDeRdOg TaKe ThAt InTeL" AMD is going to end up in the same position as Intel was in 2013-2017 where there is 0 competition and AMD will be able to do whatever they want, and they will end up being like Intel where there's very little improvements in performance with significant price increases. If someone thinks AMD won't do that because "AMD is our friends" you'll be in a bad surprise should this happen and we end up with $250 entry level AMD CPUs.
I agree with this.
I'm worried about this "I have the best CPU on the market so let's push the price to the stars" because with this behave
nothing good can happen.

If you open your eyes, calm down and think on how faster those CPUs are, does they really worth all that money over previous generations?

Try to think on the graphs you see from the various benchmark, how much time will you save from those CPUs even if you are a professional.
Many graphs shows an advantage but many of them shows some seconds of difference, other some minutes but at the end of the day, how many time you will safe in a real world usage?

I'm a computer scientist, I work for one of the big 5 in tech and I serve as a software architect.
Mosts of my collegues, develop their software on laptops then uses servers for heavy tasks.
Robert from AMD talks about code compiling as an infinite task, probably robert never written a line of code.
Compilers are always more efficient and it is really rare to wait more than a minute in a build because you never need to build all the project from scratch.
Most of the time you only need to compile what you developed in the last minutes/hours, and this is surely a really fast task even on a laptop.

I have other collegues working on data science projects, artificial intelligence, those are people who move those tech forward,
they code on laptops!

Mosts of the real professionals does not use desktop or workstations for heavy task, so what is the point of those cpus at those prices?
What are the real world scenarios that justify those prices?

Probably there is some sense in the cinema/movies industry and not that much because even there, mosts of the rendering are made server side.
The fairy tale that Blur studios said about the terminator movie is a fairy tale, a good CG artists needs a 3900X with a good GPU to get his job done,
there is no software that uses all that cores during "the creative process", the final brute force rendering must be done offline and server side.
So I don't trust the Blur studios fairytale.

If those CPUs can't improve our workload, what are the sense of those prices?

If you are one of the few who can say, I save money on a 3970X, surely there are some of those people not saying the opposite,
can you please share with us the reason why you save money with that CPU please?

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post #25 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 08:15 AM
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I'd assume y'all have a proper dev/prod setup as well... do they do any local work, or are they in the server 99% of the time?

<<server admin

most of my devs use their laptops like* dummy terminals.

I don't expect this current volatility to stabilize until Intel has replaced CORE. Now is the time AMD can make bank, so they're going to do it.

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post #26 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 09:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
I'd assume y'all have a proper dev/prod setup as well... do they do any local work, or are they in the server 99% of the time?

<<server admin

most of my devs use their laptops like* dummy terminals.

I don't expect this current volatility to stabilize until Intel has replaced CORE. Now is the time AMD can make bank, so they're going to do it.
90% of software developers develop their software on laptops or cheap computers because the development process does not need huge power or huge resources.
using laptops as terminal have no more sense this days.
jeez, VCS and CI/CD has been invented for collaborative work, why develop on other machines when you have a personal computer.

Huge resources are needed (if any) on production environment and in production enviroment there is other kind of hardware, so no, mosts devs in the world does not develop
on dream machines as most people think.
mosts devs in the "biggest 5 company in tech" develop their billionaire software on laptops or cheap machines.
same for devs in other companies.

this is the truth, leave alone what AMD marketing bull**** are wide spreading, those are fairytales.

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post #27 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 09:54 AM
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There are always going to be people like me who multi-task and do professional work on the same machine they game on. Probably not a large enough market to merit a fancy new CPU tier for, but we exist nonetheless.

I recall hitting 100% load for some periods of time on my OC'd 1700X. A few more cores would have gone a ways towards smoothing things out when loaded down.

And of course there is always ripping a movie from my collection to drive with Handbrake - which was quite slow on my 4790K and incredibly speedier on the 1700X. I'm pretty sure the additional cores helped immensely there.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?


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post #28 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 09:57 AM
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what I mean is, they do all there stuff locally on ~i5 laptops, then I push it up into dev server for QA folks to test(india), then we push into staging, confirm functionality(india), n flip staging w. prod.(me)

I didn't build this system, I just man it. I was under the impression that the dev/stage/prod cycle was pretty common. this is weird hardcore SQL to web stuff though. insurance/claims software turned into websites. that's as much as its ever been explained to me LOL.

the only folks with fancy PCs at my job are the ones who don't really need them in any way shape or form.

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Last edited by skupples; 11-27-2019 at 10:01 AM.
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post #29 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by speed_demon View Post
There are always going to be people like me who multi-task and do professional work on the same machine they game on. Probably not a large enough market to merit a fancy new CPU tier for, but we exist nonetheless.

I recall hitting 100% load for some periods of time on my OC'd 1700X. A few more cores would have gone a ways towards smoothing things out when loaded down.

And of course there is always ripping a movie from my collection to drive with Handbrake - which was quite slow on my 4790K and incredibly speedier on the 1700X. I'm pretty sure the additional cores helped immensely there.
can you tell us what is your professional work that needs all those cores?
ripping a movie from time to time does not justify the crazy prices that they want to force on the market.

leave alone the fact that mosts "multimedia fans" transcode their films on NAS using the NAS cpu.
even youtuber does not need those power since mosts encoding software is not able to handle all those cores.

Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
what I mean is, they do all there stuff locally on ~i5 laptops, then I push it up into dev server for QA folks to test(india), then we push into staging, confirm functionality(india), n flip staging w. prod.(me)

I didn't build this system, I just man it. I was under the impression that the dev/stage/prod cycle was pretty common. this is weird hardcore SQL to web stuff though. insurance/claims software turned into websites. that's as much as its ever been explained to me LOL.

the only folks with fancy PCs at my job are the ones who don't really need them in any way shape or form.
good example, thanks for sharing.
in any case that kind of people will never use a threadripper because they don't even know what it is


Last edited by andrews2547; 11-27-2019 at 12:41 PM.
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post #30 of 61 (permalink) Old 11-27-2019, 10:19 AM
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@sblantipodi :

There's one big difference between Intel and AMD that's very good for people:

* Intel keeps the price up for old CPUs.
* AMD goes down with the price for old CPUs.

You can right now find a new 2700 for €150, and a new 2700X for €170. You can just get one of those instead of the newest parts. Then staying on the same board, in around two years you can take a look at the 3900X or 3950X, or you could check out one of the 4000 models.
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