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Why you should undervolt your Ryzen 3000 - Part II

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post #21 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-05-2020, 07:39 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dansi View Post
Try not to use manual overclock and use pbo as presented in this thread. Remember low voltages as possible.

Tbh, most people do not need a fixed all cores loadout, we are better off with amd precision boost and it is safer to boot!

I just purchased a 3700x and waiting for the new hardware to arrive in a few days. Reviews and benchmarks suggest like you've said, to use PBO instead of manual overclocking for the best performance, because manual overclocking actually caused benchmark scores to go down.


I don't plan on overclocking the CPU, but I will likely overclock my RAM, which will give a better single-core performance boost. Do you have or know of a guide to set up the BIOS for the maximum PBO/automatic performance of the 3700x? I'd love to read it in anticipation of my new parts arrival.
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post #22 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-05-2020, 09:40 PM - Thread Starter
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As a starting guide
Ram at least 3600 at 1:1:1 ratio at 1.35v
Get the timings from Ryzen calculator
Cpu turn on pbo in CBS
Try ppt 300w, tdc 180a, edc 160a. (These are arbitrary values higher than the stock ones)
use the max +200mhz autoOC
Turn off scalar and all llc to normal or stock
Set vcore and soc voltage to normal or stock (depending on your motherboard terms)
undervolt -0.1v offset
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post #23 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 07:58 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dansi View Post
Try not to use manual overclock and use pbo as presented in this thread. Remember low voltages as possible.

Tbh, most people do not need a fixed all cores loadout, we are better off with amd precision boost and it is safer to boot!

Why in hell are you telling me to use PBO for all-core overclock when PBO NEVER gets you a higher all-core overclock than manual. You obviously are not a good listener. I have clearly stated my case on this and yet you persist with nothing specific that debunks what I am saying. Shove your PBO where the sunlight never shines. If you are doing a productivity workload using all cores and threads is the way you most often want to go. TO be honest you have offered a lot of bilge which does not suit MY needs. Do not raise this with me again. I do not have time to waste with people who do NOT listen.

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post #24 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 08:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by os2wiz View Post
Why in hell are you telling me to use PBO for all-core overclock when PBO NEVER gets you a higher all-core overclock than manual. You obviously are not a good listener. I have clearly stated my case on this and yet you persist with nothing specific that debunks what I am saying. Shove your PBO where the sunlight never shines. If you are doing a productivity workload using all cores and threads is the way you most often want to go. TO be honest you have offered a lot of bilge which does not suit MY needs. Do not raise this with me again. I do not have time to waste with people who do NOT listen.
Relax buddy, no reason to get hot and bothered over the internet. We just be sharing our findings and tweaking.

Yes all cores manual over clocks do provide best all peak MT performance. But at expense of danger dan to your cpu. There is reason why as processes get smaller, more internal checks are being implemented inside the processer.

But really have you tried pbo + undervolt as in this thread, plz not be a quickie to dismiss it. Give it another chance, sure it won't give you highest MT results but perhaps the balance it brings to ST/MT force, you may end up liking it?

Oh and buy Amd stocks during today's dip! To the moon we go soon.
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post #25 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 11:07 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by os2wiz View Post
Why in hell are you telling me to use PBO for all-core overclock when PBO NEVER gets you a higher all-core overclock than manual.
He's saying try using PBO instead of manual overclock. Every benchmark and test shows you're actually losing performance by manual overclocking on these chips instead of using PBO. That's all he's trying to suggest.

Last edited by -BoneZ-; 01-07-2020 at 03:43 AM.
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post #26 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 11:22 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dansi View Post
Relax buddy, no reason to get hot and bothered over the internet. We just be sharing our findings and tweaking.

Yes all cores manual over clocks do provide best all peak MT performance. But at expense of danger dan to your cpu. There is reason why as processes get smaller, more internal checks are being implemented inside the processer.

But really have you tried pbo + undervolt as in this thread, plz not be a quickie to dismiss it. Give it another chance, sure it won't give you highest MT results but perhaps the balance it brings to ST/MT force, you may end up liking it?

Oh and buy Amd stocks during today's dip! To the moon we go soon.
I can see both sides in this, although I have to admit I don't understand all the voodoo going on with PBO and XFR on zen2. It's hard to let go of 20 years of understanding overclocking (simply add voltage and profit). :-) When I look at the SVI2 TFN vcore under load on my all core OC (44/44/43/43) it is nearly the SAME as when I'm using the undervolting idea here so my simple mind just asks 'where's the danger in that'.

One thing to keep in mind, not everyone is using these for mixed workloads or gaming. I'll describe my situation. Coming from a 1950x @ 3.9Ghz, I use it exclusively for Blender and Keyshot rendering so the ONLY concern I have is to maximize the core frequency. So basically in the case of the 3950x I have now, I'm trying to use a mainstream part as a HEDT part. I wish I could have a 3960X but I can't justify the cost. Hence, for the price of a 3960x, I got a 3950x and an X570 mobo and a Optimus block.

Now I have started playing with this undervolting idea, and have seen an increase in the all core average core clock go to 4150 from 4000 at stock. Although so far in my benchmarks it's still slower that an all-core OC.

I have a question tho, I set my PBO limits to 300/300/300 in BIOS, how are you setting the auto OC max 200 thingy? In BIOS or Ryzen Master? EDIT: nm found it, max boost override. It's set to 200 now.

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post #27 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 04:44 PM
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So this thread inspired me to try to undervolt my 3600X (while I wait for my 3950X to arrive... 2 more days).

As I did it, I managed to make the BIOS unstable, and now I can barely undervolt at all.

Here's the whole story:
I have a Gigabyte Aorus X570 Ultra. In the Tweaker tab, I started by simply changing CPU Vcore from Auto to Normal.
I worked my way through -0.025V to -0.05V to -0.075V all fine. I even got a slight boost with -0.75V. I went to -0.1V. Windows booted fine. Benchmarks ran fine. I went to BIOS to take it even lower. However, the machine just froze on a black screen after I hit Del to enter BIOS.

I had to do a clear CMOS to get the machine out of this state.

I reflashed BIOS for good measure, loaded optimized defaults and then enabled XMP. Clean boot, so I went back and tried a -0.06V offset. No Dice, BIOS crash, self-reset this time. Start fresh again, try only a -0.03V offset. Same thing, BIOS crash, self-reset.

So what the hell happened? Has anyone experienced this? The BIOS not stable at -0.1V seems a bit strange as many people have been there. But this degradation where I can't even do -0.03V is bizare. You woudn't think anything would be damaged with an undervolt...

PS: Auto vs Normal VID were both reporting 1.35V while running Cinebench R20. SVI2 TFN Vcore sensor was reporting 1.35V for Auto and 1.33V for Normal (no offset). At the -0.1 offset, SVI2 TFN was reporting 1.294V.

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Last edited by briank; 01-06-2020 at 04:50 PM. Reason: Add Vcore measured voltages
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post #28 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 08:34 PM
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Either I am doing something wrong or missing something but this just hurts my performance. Boost clocks are down and cinebench scores go down.

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post #29 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 11:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by briank View Post
So this thread inspired me to try to undervolt my 3600X (while I wait for my 3950X to arrive... 2 more days).

As I did it, I managed to make the BIOS unstable, and now I can barely undervolt at all.

Here's the whole story:
I have a Gigabyte Aorus X570 Ultra. In the Tweaker tab, I started by simply changing CPU Vcore from Auto to Normal.
I worked my way through -0.025V to -0.05V to -0.075V all fine. I even got a slight boost with -0.75V. I went to -0.1V. Windows booted fine. Benchmarks ran fine. I went to BIOS to take it even lower. However, the machine just froze on a black screen after I hit Del to enter BIOS.

I had to do a clear CMOS to get the machine out of this state.

I reflashed BIOS for good measure, loaded optimized defaults and then enabled XMP. Clean boot, so I went back and tried a -0.06V offset. No Dice, BIOS crash, self-reset this time. Start fresh again, try only a -0.03V offset. Same thing, BIOS crash, self-reset.

So what the hell happened? Has anyone experienced this? The BIOS not stable at -0.1V seems a bit strange as many people have been there. But this degradation where I can't even do -0.03V is bizare. You woudn't think anything would be damaged with an undervolt...

PS: Auto vs Normal VID were both reporting 1.35V while running Cinebench R20. SVI2 TFN Vcore sensor was reporting 1.35V for Auto and 1.33V for Normal (no offset). At the -0.1 offset, SVI2 TFN was reporting 1.294V.
Did you set your ram voltages after selecting xmp? That could be a reason.

I don't think there is degregation from under volting.

I also don't think you need reflash, Gigabyte will kick your bios to default after a few rounds of failure to boot.

Are you on f11 bios? It should work well on zen 3000. When i had zen 2000, i faced tons of bios stability with Giga x570 boards, see my post history
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post #30 of 89 (permalink) Old 01-06-2020, 11:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by Delphi View Post
Either I am doing something wrong or missing something but this just hurts my performance. Boost clocks are down and cinebench scores go down.
Share your bios settings for this.

It could you went too high with under volt values, or pbo is not completely setup correctly
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