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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 12:16 AM - Thread Starter
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3990x tweaking advice!

hi all, ive just finished bolting together my monster new workstation (and first ryzen based system.):

3990x

asrock creator trx40

128gb trident z 3200cl15

corsair ax1600i psu.


given the 3990x is the only zen 3 cpu where PBO makes a decent difference, it seemed a shame not to play with it.. however im getting some wierd (i think?) results.

if i let things go totally maxed out, i get 4.15 all core and close to 700w cpu power use.

in my case since im not after records, i set the power limit in PBO to 500w.. cpu draw drops to about 400w and i get a solid all core at 3.9.. which is a decent speedup over stock, without going too crazy on power.


anyway, on to the wierdness.

at full bore, running vraybenchmark, i get banks of cores momentarily downclocking and my scores drop massively.

i assumed at the 500w limit it didnt have that problem, however i note on doing a longer render in max, that it still does it with a 500w limit, just after a few minutes rendering, and not immediately like before.


the wierd thing is, my temperatures are low. my massive custom loop keeps cpu temps below about 65 degrees at all times, my VRMS (not the best on this board i know) stay around 55 degrees, and all other temps in hwmonitor are reasonable. power and current values are all way below limits, and max voltage is about 1.26v.


the only thing i can see that seems connected, is in HW monitor, i get occasional warnings "thermal throttle: HTC" and "thermal throttle: prochot EXT"

note that i also have "thermal throttle: prochot cpu" which never triggers.

also note, this happens a handful of times during a render, but NOT every time my cores downclock.

there is very little online on this subject.. a couple of comments in the hwinfo forum, suggesting that "prochot ext" warning means something other than cpu is overheating.. however i see nothing hot on the sensors. it could apparently also be something erroring out.

any suggestions? id like to get a stable, decent clock speed on my monster.

any advice most appreciated.. not sure what to do!
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 06:13 AM
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Try increasing power limit to 600w and run again. What Vcore are you currently at?
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 06:50 AM
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Can you try switching from HWMonitor to HWINFO? It always could find more sensors on all PCs I've seen. Maybe one of the extra sensors HWINFO finds shows something interesting about those "HTC" and "prochot EXT" events.

If things work like on the smaller Ryzen CPUs, there's TDC and PPT that you can both use to target a certain power usage for your CPU. Maybe see what happens if you use TDC to limit your power usage while keeping PPT very high. You'll need to experiment to find the TDC that makes your CPU use the power you want (perhaps start with TDC value of 300).

Another thing I heard, normal Windows 10 Pro behaves weird on these CPUs because of the 128 threads. There's Windows Enterprise and something called Windows "Pro for Workstations" that don't have the problem that Pro has.
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by deepor View Post
Can you try switching from HWMonitor to HWINFO? It always could find more sensors on all PCs I've seen. Maybe one of the extra sensors HWINFO finds shows something interesting about those "HTC" and "prochot EXT" events.

If things work like on the smaller Ryzen CPUs, there's TDC and PPT that you can both use to target a certain power usage for your CPU. Maybe see what happens if you use TDC to limit your power usage while keeping PPT very high. You'll need to experiment to find the TDC that makes your CPU use the power you want (perhaps start with TDC value of 300).

Another thing I heard, normal Windows 10 Pro behaves weird on these CPUs because of the 128 threads. There's Windows Enterprise and something called Windows "Pro for Workstations" that don't have the problem that Pro has.
hm.. i mis-wrote.. its HWINFO im using.

also, windows had a patch last night which allows it to use all 128 threads without splitting into groups.

ill try playing with tdc see if it does anything different.

i have a feeling that despite the vrm being fine, there is something on this motherboard which is struggling.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by gecko991 View Post
Try increasing power limit to 600w and run again. What Vcore are you currently at?
i will try later, but i already tried at 1000 (max on this board) 650, 550, 500 and 280 (stock)

from what i could see, higher values just made thesse clock drops occur more quickly.

max vcore i see when rendering is 1.26v at current settings.

iirc at 1000, it was up to 1.35v

both, as far as i understand it, are quite acceptable voltages.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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another observation.. ryzen master and hw info show different clock behaviour.

according to ryzen master im currently oscillating between 4.025 ghz all core, and dropping to, at lowest, 2.8 they all appear to be changing approximately together in ryzen master.

according to hwinfo, ive got the same 4.025ghz clock, but groups of cores are dropping all the way to 547 mhz.
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 08:46 AM
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Just wanted to clarify, this is not a zen 3 chip but rather a zen 2 chip. Maybe you meant gen 3 chip?
-Nelson
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 09:05 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by robinlawrie View Post
another observation.. ryzen master and hw info show different clock behaviour.

according to ryzen master im currently oscillating between 4.025 ghz all core, and dropping to, at lowest, 2.8 they all appear to be changing approximately together in ryzen master.

according to hwinfo, ive got the same 4.025ghz clock, but groups of cores are dropping all the way to 547 mhz.

It does seem to be heat - or at least heat-sensor - related, especially when compared to various vids on 3990X performance, in default or PBO. May be try I re-application of thermal paste (on my TR2, I use the 'credit card spread' method to great effect). Also, what water-block are you using ? Finally, check this OCN link out and may be even PM Elmor (he really knows his stuff, and then some) https://www.overclock.net/forum/10-a...l#post28329892
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 11:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by J7SC View Post
It does seem to be heat - or at least heat-sensor - related, especially when compared to various vids on 3990X performance, in default or PBO. May be try I re-application of thermal paste (on my TR2, I use the 'credit card spread' method to great effect). Also, what water-block are you using ? Finally, check this OCN link out and may be even PM Elmor (he really knows his stuff, and then some) https://www.overclock.net/forum/10-a...l#post28329892
i could try reapplying the paste, but every cpu related temp i can measure is excellent.. between 50 and 60 degrees whatever i do.

i have a heatkiller iv waterblock and a monster (2x mora 3 and 2x d5 pump) external watercooler. also note the "prochot cpu" sensor in hwmonitor never triggers. apparently the prochot EXT is something non cpu.


-ive followed earlier advice and tried limiting the tdc not ppt..

setting the ppt to max (1000) then limiting the tdc to 350 seemed to help... until i did a 1 hr render... the clock drops still happen. i dropped tdc to 315 now, and it seems to be ok.. but given the board should be good for 1000w, limiting my eventual cpu wattage to circa 350 watts seems a bit lame.
(having said that, with only that small increase in wattage over the 280 stock, i get up to 3.7 all core, as opposed to 3.1 at stock.. this cpu has a nice chunk of extra performance available for a small increase in power... beyond that we get into classic zen 2 territory of diminishing returns. )


ive emailed asrock.. no idea what sort of generic reply ill get..

if i knew where to look for whatever is overheating, id stick a fan or heatsink on it!

last option is an rma, but a) swapping motherboard is a right pain and b) i got it in another country so shipping it back is, also, a right pain.
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-17-2020, 11:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by J!NX View Post
Just wanted to clarify, this is not a zen 3 chip but rather a zen 2 chip. Maybe you meant gen 3 chip?
-Nelson
yes i often make that mistake.. i wish they didnt call it zen 2 but ryzen 3XXX, its confusing.
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