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post #41 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 02:15 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Heuchler View Post
Image
Hi!

Thanks for your answer.

I was change my Thermaltake Floe Riing RGB 360 TT Premium Edition for a DeepCool Castle 360 RGB and my temps went from 95º Prime95 Small FTTs to 60º in same stress test.

See the block difference, the new block are very mucho big. With old block , the IHS touch screws, now is far away from screws.



Vs



Now i can reach about 4550 Mhz in boost.



Regards.

Last edited by OverCloke; 08-22-2019 at 02:24 AM.
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post #42 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 04:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Glad it worked out. Nice temps with the DeepCool Castle 360 RGB

Ryzen Memory Tweaking & Overclocking Guide by 1usmus
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...locking-guide/


From the Community: RAM Recommendations for AMD Ryzen and Intel Core
https://www.computerbase.de/2019-06/...-empfehlungen/
Click image for larger version

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Google Translate Link
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Overclocking History (Click to show)
Intel 386DX/16 @ 20 MHz
CX486SLC/50 @ 50 MHz
AM486DX2/80 @ 100 MHz
AM486 DX4-100 @ 120 MHz
AK5x86-P75 [email protected] 160 MHz
Pentium 90 @ 120 Mhz
IBM 6x86L P166+ [email protected] 160 MHz
Celeron 300a @ 454 MHz
Pentium 3 700 @ 933 MHz
Athlon XP 1400+ @ 1600 MHz
Athlon XP 1800+ @ 2088 MHz
Athlon XP 2500+ @ 2200 MHz
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 2603 MHz
Athlon X2 BE2300 @ 1900 MHz
Athlon X2 4200+ @ 2210 MHz
Athlon X2 5000+ @ 2600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E4300 @ 3000 MHz
Core 2 Duo E6750 @ 3600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E8400 @ 4000 MHz
Xeon C2Q L5408 @ 3200 MHz
Xeon C2Q X5450 @ 3300 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5440 @ 3400 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5450 @ 3600 MHz
Phenom2 X4 B50 @ 3700 MHz
Phenom2 X6 1045T @ 4050 MHz
Core i5-2500K Sandy @ 4500 MHz
X5650 6-Core Westmere @ 3982 MHz
AMD FX 8320E Black Edition

FX-8320E @4.5GHz, X5650 @ 4.0GHz, X6 1045T @4.0GHz, i7 [email protected]
Thinkpad T420p with i7-2720QM overclocked because this is OCN

Last edited by Heuchler; 08-23-2019 at 10:41 PM.
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post #43 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-23-2019, 12:46 PM
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GL850S USB 2.0 hub provides the four USB 2.0

USB 3.1 gen 2 and PCIE 4.0 things (i.e. cost drivers besides the power delivery + audio/LAN):
  • four Pericom PI3EQX USB 3.1 (10Gbps), three are on the top of the motherboard, and one is on the backside.
  • There is also a Realtek type-C controller, the RTS5441
  • IDT PCI-E 4.0 clock generator used to manage PCI-E 4.0 bus speed
  • four PI3EQX16 PCI-E 4.0 re-drivers
  • PI3DBS16 PCI-E 4.0 quick switches

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post #44 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-23-2019, 10:09 PM - Thread Starter
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[Computer Base] Ryzen 3000 Memory Test
https://www.computerbase.de/2019-08/...gher-is-better

Samsung B-Die vs. Micron E-Die, SR vs DR, 4x 8GB vs 2x 16GB
Click image for larger version

Name:	RAM tweaked.png
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Page 1 Test methodology, System used and DDR4 kits tested
Page 2 is XMP with different Infinity Fabric clock speed (IF scaling)
Page 3 is RAM OC (memory fully optimized) ADIA64, 7-Zip,Corona 1.3, Handbrake, Sandra, SuperPi




AIDA64 - XMP
Spoiler!


AIDA64 - RAM OC
Spoiler!


Samsung B-Die vs. Micron E-Die (XMP vs tuned memory)

Shadows of the Tomb Raider @720p (XMP max 151.1 FPS vs RAM OC max 176.9 FPS)
Spoiler!


Forza Horizon 4 @ 720p (XMP max 193.3 FPS vs RAM OC max 213.2 FPS)
Spoiler!


Counter-Strike GO @ 1080p (XMP max 319.7 vs RAM OC max 339.1 FPS )
Spoiler!


Computer Base article Google Translate
https://translate.google.com/transla...00-test%2F3%2F

Overclocking History (Click to show)
Intel 386DX/16 @ 20 MHz
CX486SLC/50 @ 50 MHz
AM486DX2/80 @ 100 MHz
AM486 DX4-100 @ 120 MHz
AK5x86-P75 [email protected] 160 MHz
Pentium 90 @ 120 Mhz
IBM 6x86L P166+ [email protected] 160 MHz
Celeron 300a @ 454 MHz
Pentium 3 700 @ 933 MHz
Athlon XP 1400+ @ 1600 MHz
Athlon XP 1800+ @ 2088 MHz
Athlon XP 2500+ @ 2200 MHz
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 2603 MHz
Athlon X2 BE2300 @ 1900 MHz
Athlon X2 4200+ @ 2210 MHz
Athlon X2 5000+ @ 2600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E4300 @ 3000 MHz
Core 2 Duo E6750 @ 3600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E8400 @ 4000 MHz
Xeon C2Q L5408 @ 3200 MHz
Xeon C2Q X5450 @ 3300 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5440 @ 3400 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5450 @ 3600 MHz
Phenom2 X4 B50 @ 3700 MHz
Phenom2 X6 1045T @ 4050 MHz
Core i5-2500K Sandy @ 4500 MHz
X5650 6-Core Westmere @ 3982 MHz
AMD FX 8320E Black Edition

FX-8320E @4.5GHz, X5650 @ 4.0GHz, X6 1045T @4.0GHz, i7 [email protected]
Thinkpad T420p with i7-2720QM overclocked because this is OCN
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post #45 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 06:15 AM
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I have been using Ryzen master to test a few things.
If I go to the bios and from a clean load optimized defaults i change vcore to 1.325 and oc to just 4GHz. The PC boot to windows but vcore settings don't save.
I am using the latest BIOS on a x570 master
How can a fix this? can you manually change the vcore voltage and save the settings?


What mess is this? after years of working with Ryzen master a agesa releases gigabyte still can make it compatible.
I am starting to regret of not getting an asus board. I might get a refund.
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post #46 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-24-2019, 05:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by l0rdraiden View Post
I have been using Ryzen master to test a few things.
If I go to the bios and from a clean load optimized defaults i change vcore to 1.325 and oc to just 4GHz. The PC boot to windows but vcore settings don't save.
I am using the latest BIOS on a x570 master
How can a fix this? can you manually change the vcore voltage and save the settings?


What mess is this? after years of working with Ryzen master a agesa releases gigabyte still can make it compatible.
I am starting to regret of not getting an asus board. I might get a refund.


Would be helpful if you provided more background info - your system specs and what settings you are using and software.

The picture you posted in the AORUS Owner thread shows you are using Auto Overclocking in Ryzen Master. Ryzen Master overwrites BIOS settings [SMU].
Sometime bad enough that one has to flash the BIOS to clear Ryzen Master settings and gain BIOS level control. Not to be a dick but it has been mentioned
on 4 out of the 5 pages in this thread.

I would strongly recommend not using auto overclocking features in BIOS nor Ryzen Master unless you have a specific need for it.


Pretty sure all AMD motherboard partners get the same micro code libraries to build BIOS out of. GIGABYTE has been rolling out new BIOS on the latest AGESA faster than any other maker.


try CLR CMOS and the load default profile, then set vcore. If that doesn't clear try flashing BIOS to stop Ryzen Master taking over BIOS setting.

Overclocking History (Click to show)
Intel 386DX/16 @ 20 MHz
CX486SLC/50 @ 50 MHz
AM486DX2/80 @ 100 MHz
AM486 DX4-100 @ 120 MHz
AK5x86-P75 [email protected] 160 MHz
Pentium 90 @ 120 Mhz
IBM 6x86L P166+ [email protected] 160 MHz
Celeron 300a @ 454 MHz
Pentium 3 700 @ 933 MHz
Athlon XP 1400+ @ 1600 MHz
Athlon XP 1800+ @ 2088 MHz
Athlon XP 2500+ @ 2200 MHz
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 2603 MHz
Athlon X2 BE2300 @ 1900 MHz
Athlon X2 4200+ @ 2210 MHz
Athlon X2 5000+ @ 2600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E4300 @ 3000 MHz
Core 2 Duo E6750 @ 3600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E8400 @ 4000 MHz
Xeon C2Q L5408 @ 3200 MHz
Xeon C2Q X5450 @ 3300 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5440 @ 3400 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5450 @ 3600 MHz
Phenom2 X4 B50 @ 3700 MHz
Phenom2 X6 1045T @ 4050 MHz
Core i5-2500K Sandy @ 4500 MHz
X5650 6-Core Westmere @ 3982 MHz
AMD FX 8320E Black Edition

FX-8320E @4.5GHz, X5650 @ 4.0GHz, X6 1045T @4.0GHz, i7 [email protected]
Thinkpad T420p with i7-2720QM overclocked because this is OCN
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post #47 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 03:18 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Heuchler View Post
Would be helpful if you provided more background info - your system specs and what settings you are using and software.

The picture you posted in the AORUS Owner thread shows you are using Auto Overclocking in Ryzen Master. Ryzen Master overwrites BIOS settings [SMU].
Sometime bad enough that one has to flash the BIOS to clear Ryzen Master settings and gain BIOS level control. Not to be a dick but it has been mentioned
on 4 out of the 5 pages in this thread.

I would strongly recommend not using auto overclocking features in BIOS nor Ryzen Master unless you have a specific need for it.


Pretty sure all AMD motherboard partners get the same micro code libraries to build BIOS out of. GIGABYTE has been rolling out new BIOS on the latest AGESA faster than any other maker.


try CLR CMOS and the load default profile, then set vcore. If that doesn't clear try flashing BIOS to stop Ryzen Master taking over BIOS setting.
Ok, I think I found a solution and a bug as well.

If I change vcore in the gigabyte BIOS, it doesnt work, if I change it in the gigabyte BIOS but going to AMD overclock settings, it works. I hope they can fix this.
Still I don't understand why BIOS settings are duplicated everywhere and in some places they work and in some other don't, is honestly a mess, I don't know how the other are but this is a mess.


BTW anyone knows if this can be changed in a gigabyte BIOS?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment...0x_need_other/
SB Spread Spectrum and VRM Spread Spectrum
https://www.gigabyte.com/Support/FAQ/2536

I don't see this setting in our BIOS and apparently could improve the performance
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post #48 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 03:40 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by l0rdraiden View Post
Ok, I think I found a solution and a bug as well.

If I change vcore in the gigabyte BIOS, it doesnt work, if I change it in the gigabyte BIOS but going to AMD overclock settings, it works. I hope they can fix this.
Still I don't understand why BIOS settings are duplicated everywhere and in some places they work and in some other don't, is honestly a mess, I don't know how the other are but this is a mess.


BTW anyone knows if this can be changed in a gigabyte BIOS?
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment...0x_need_other/
SB Spread Spectrum and VRM Spread Spectrum
https://www.gigabyte.com/Support/FAQ/2536

I don't see this setting in our BIOS and apparently could improve the performance
Load defaults in Ryzen Master/ & reset to stock, nuke your BIOS, Q-flash or optimized defaults.
That isn't normal behaviour.
Optimzed defaults should reset your whole BIOS, but if Ryzen Master hijacks in Windows and sets it's own values, your back to square one.

Spread spectrum should be disabled by default on the Xtreme & Master boards. (I think it was it didn't work on these, clarification would be nice from Gigabyte REP)
I have no idea on the other boards but usually it's enabled for Gigabyte boards and no option to turn it on/off. I have no idea why they keep that hidden from users to control.

Gigabyte X570 AORUS XTREME, Ryzen 7 3800X PBO boost, 3800/1900 MEM/FCLK, 13.23.17.30.66.tRFC 600 1T 1.700V
4x8Gb Kingston HX434C19FB2K2/16 3466C19 1.2V (Micron Rev.E 19nm [D9VPP])
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post #49 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 02:32 PM
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Greetings to everyone contributing to this thread, and thanks to Heuchler for the detailed OP. I've built my first AMD rig for the first time in about 15 years. Basic specs: 3900X, 32GB ram (detailed below), Auros X570 Master, H100i AIO cooler.

I want to bother you all just a little about RAM and overclocking. Just 2 issues, and hoping someone might be able to help.

1.) I've had success with the overclocking tool after many hours of failing. The guide in the OP was extremely helpful in accounting for some voltage block values that I wasn't imputting which seems to have allowed me to not only escape boot loops (several hours of that), but to begin the process of getting stable in Windows. Thank you for your efforts there and throughout the thread. That said, I've noticed that when using the "Safe" timings profile in Ryzen Memory Calculator, my Read, Write, Copy and Latency numbers are really no different from stock. I've attached relevant images, but at stock (18-19-19-19-39 @ 3600):

Read: 54724 | Write: 52525 | Copy: 57072 | Latency: 72.0

"Safe" timings (16-17-16-16-36 @ 3600):

Read: 55741 | Write: 52667 | Copy: 58086 | Latency: 70.9

I had hoped with the lower CL and considerably tighter timings, I'd see latency in the 60s, at least, but nope. At minimum, I thought I would see at least *some* improvement, but I don't see it in testing.

So my question is this: Am I doing something wrong? Is it my RAM kit that simply can't do better timings? I see a few posts up that the Trident Z Neo 32GB 2x16 kit comes recommended for optimum OC. Would that RAM kit give me a better result than what I'm seeing here?


2.) I've been having a bit of paralysis of analysis trying to get some relative perspective on how much of an improvement I could expect from a B-Die kit like the aforementioned 2x16 Trident Z Neo kit (https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-...82E16820232860) with slightly better timings for relatively high resolution and high refresh rate gaming (120fps, 3440x1440) at 3733Mhz OC? If we're talking negligible performance gains, I'll stop losing sleep and keep what I have...but if the gains would be measurable and meaningful, I'll go with that kit or any kits recommended here. I don't really have a point of reference for how a latency of 62ns translates to in-game performance compared to 70ns. I have a preference for a 4x8 kit for the aesthetics but with this being a daisy chain topography I understand that a 2x16 kit is likely to be the better performer. If that ends up being the recommendation, that'll be fine.

Also, I had been looking at some of the 14-14-14-34 @ 3200 kits like this one (https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-...82E16820232850) which is listed in the high-end category of the recommended options, but I don't know if going with something like that and OC'ing it would yield a better, solid result than getting something already at 3600 and tightening the timings. My goal would be 3600 or 3733 with great performance. I do need 32GB as this is my work and play machine. The $350 kit or something equivalent would likely be around my spend limit and I do like the RGB look more than the more standard Flare styling.

Thank you in advance for your insights and recommendations!
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post #50 of 289 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 07:11 PM - Thread Starter
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@ l0rdraiden - Glad your vcore is being applied correctly. Voltages not being applied properly could be the most annoying issue. I believe that motherboard partners can't change the AMD CBS part of the BIOS. So some settings a redundant in the BIOS and if they don't match it probability isn't a good thing.
The first reddit post you link the OP doesn't see temps over 80c because how the Ryzen 3000 [Matisse] new boost algorithm handles things.
If your temps are too high it won't clock high. But he is assuming because he is at 80c that he has thermal headroom left.


Quote: Originally Posted by The Stilt View Post
Matisse Boosting Algorithm

Setting the thermal limits below stock (95°C) make no difference, since the boost algorithm already uses lower limits.

The original limits for Ryzen 3000 SKUs were:

- 3600 = 4100MHz (80-95°C) / 4200MHz (< 80°C)
- 3600X = 4200MHz (80-95°C) / 4400MHz (< 80°C)
- 3700X = 4200MHz (80-95°C) / 4400MHz (< 80°C)
- 3800X = 4300MHz (80-95°C) / 4550MHz (< 80°C)
- 3900X = 4400MHz (80-95°C) / 4650MHz (< 80°C)

Since then, it appears that the HighTemperature limit has been reduced further to 75°C (from 80°C).
New SMUs also have introduced "MiddleTemperature" limit, but that gets disabled when PBO is enabled.

HWInfo is also able to display these limits (fused values).
https://www.overclock.net/forum/28085580-post549.html
SMU firmware = System Management Unit (includes Power Management among many other things). I started reading up on it a little.


@Dreams-Visions - 2xCCD Matisse Chip (3900X and 3950X) seem to prefer 4 single rank DIMMs over 2 dual rank DIMMs

Quote: Originally Posted by The Stilt View Post

For 2 CCD SKUs, 2 DPC SR configuration seems to be the way to go.
Both the 3600 and 3700X did 1800MHz UCLK on 1 DPC DR config, but most likely due to the discrepancy of the two CCDs in 3900X, it barely does 1733MHz on those DIMMs.
Meanwhile with 2 DPC SR config there is no issue in reaching 1866MHz FCLK/UCLK. That's pretty unfortunate since 8GB DIMMs cannot be considered as desireable or future proof as 16GB ones, due to the 32GB limitation.
Sure 16Gb ICs exist nowdays (hence allowing 16GB SR modules), but none of them can come even close to B-die in terms of frequency and timings.



Increasing cLDO_VDDP seems beneficial > 3600MHz MEMCLKs, as increasing it seems to improve the margins and hence help with potential training issues. On previous gen. products it was only useful for shifting the MEMCLK holes, which were
present on certain CPU, motherboard and DIMM combinations. But then again, we never did this kind of MEMCLKs on those parts.
Damn good question. Found another X570 Master owner running Hynix CJR SR and he was testing 4x8 at 3800. Before I was thinking about picking up a 32 GB Micron Rev.E based kit. Samsung B-die still seem to be kind. Micron Rev.E
seems to have some advantages over Hynix CJR. On the other hand CJR seem to able to have lower tEFC and tFAW. Nighthog has his Rev.E memory at 4266. Seems like a lot of fun to overclock it.
I played around Flare X based B-die on Ryzen 1000-series and the motherboard wouldn't even do rated speed (not a fan of that motherboard company). 3440x1440 is about 20-25% performance hit over standard 2560x1440
from my testing depending on game and settings. 720p and 1080p FPS differences between the top three IC (B-Die, Rev.E and CJR) ComputerBase link a few post before. I wouldn't really worry about it too much
and spend the difference on getting a better GPU or put it aside for a future GPU upgrade. Huge L3 cache seems to be doing a good job in not bottlenecking performance. But more testing is need and faster GPUs.

Optimal FCLK vs MCLK from Buildzoid [google spreadsheet link]
Attachment 285552


LAB501 3900X Memory Review does include 1440p and 2160p results for Ashes of the Singularity, Batman Arkham Knight, Dawn of War 3, Deus EX Mankind Divided, Metro Exodus, FarCry New Dawn, Shadow of the Tomb Raider, Shadow of War
https://lab501.ro/procesoare-chipset...nglish-version
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Overclocking History (Click to show)
Intel 386DX/16 @ 20 MHz
CX486SLC/50 @ 50 MHz
AM486DX2/80 @ 100 MHz
AM486 DX4-100 @ 120 MHz
AK5x86-P75 [email protected] 160 MHz
Pentium 90 @ 120 Mhz
IBM 6x86L P166+ [email protected] 160 MHz
Celeron 300a @ 454 MHz
Pentium 3 700 @ 933 MHz
Athlon XP 1400+ @ 1600 MHz
Athlon XP 1800+ @ 2088 MHz
Athlon XP 2500+ @ 2200 MHz
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 2603 MHz
Athlon X2 BE2300 @ 1900 MHz
Athlon X2 4200+ @ 2210 MHz
Athlon X2 5000+ @ 2600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E4300 @ 3000 MHz
Core 2 Duo E6750 @ 3600 MHz
Core 2 Duo E8400 @ 4000 MHz
Xeon C2Q L5408 @ 3200 MHz
Xeon C2Q X5450 @ 3300 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5440 @ 3400 MHz
Xeon C2Q E5450 @ 3600 MHz
Phenom2 X4 B50 @ 3700 MHz
Phenom2 X6 1045T @ 4050 MHz
Core i5-2500K Sandy @ 4500 MHz
X5650 6-Core Westmere @ 3982 MHz
AMD FX 8320E Black Edition

FX-8320E @4.5GHz, X5650 @ 4.0GHz, X6 1045T @4.0GHz, i7 [email protected]
Thinkpad T420p with i7-2720QM overclocked because this is OCN
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