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Is AM3+ Worth Investing In?

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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-01-2014, 07:19 PM
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It's a good socket, but honestly, likely a dead socket.

Even when (if) AMD starts dropping FX processors again, my conversations with Jim Prior on Twitter strongly hint that an iGPU will be involved as to not split their market base any further when it comes to people not being able to use HSA acceleration.

This was a huge reason when I gave my AM3+ build to my friend, as to why I jumped to an FM2+ based socket even though the goal was to build a high end rig to replace a high end rig. Any future FX chips based on my twitter questions to Mr. Prior are very much going to HAVE to be on FM2+ going forward as well, unless a new socket is announced.

So if you are going to stick with the 8 core you know, I'm sure performance will be fine no matter what you pair it with, but you are giving up the ability to run HSA acceleration down the road, PCI express 3.0, and a better CPU intergrated IMC, as well as you are likely causing yourself to be left out of the running for any future FX APU releases.

Just know that before you make up your mind.
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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-01-2014, 08:03 PM
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Being that AM3+ socket is near the end of its life cycle, i would wait till the end of this year to see what AMD and intel has coming out and go from there, especially since DDR4 is coming with the newer intel boards this year, the 8 core intel chips is what im looking forward too.
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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-01-2014, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kahboom View Post

Being that AM3+ socket is near the end of its life cycle, i would wait till the end of this year to see what AMD and intel has coming out and go from there, especially since DDR4 is coming with the newer intel boards this year, the 8 core intel chips is what im looking forward too.

My opinion is don't wait, Earliest consumer availability for DDR4 is 2015 / early 2016 and prices will likely be much higher than ddr3. The exception is Ivy-E, which is supposedly late 2014. AM3+ is EOL only in the sense that it is very unlikely new processors will be released for it. It is not EOL in availability and production of motherboards and processors will continue until their is a replacement for the current lineup of FX chips. Even if new processors were still coming out, the platform will soon have to be replaced for DDR4.

I just upgraded to a 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0 I purchased from another OCN member and a FX-9590 and this thing is fast! I'm more than sure it will last me until DDR4 is mainstream.

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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-01-2014, 08:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by yawa View Post

It's a good socket, but honestly, likely a dead socket.

Even when (if) AMD starts dropping FX processors again, my conversations with Jim Prior on Twitter strongly hint that an iGPU will be involved as to not split their market base any further when it comes to people not being able to use HSA acceleration.

This was a huge reason when I gave my AM3+ build to my friend, as to why I jumped to an FM2+ based socket even though the goal was to build a high end rig to replace a high end rig. Any future FX chips based on my twitter questions to Mr. Prior are very much going to HAVE to be on FM2+ going forward as well, unless a new socket is announced.

So if you are going to stick with the 8 core you know, I'm sure performance will be fine no matter what you pair it with, but you are giving up the ability to run HSA acceleration down the road, PCI express 3.0, and a better CPU intergrated IMC, as well as you are likely causing yourself to be left out of the running for any future FX APU releases.

Just know that before you make up your mind.

Those are excellent points. I'm not super keen on HSA acceleration as the majority of my computing is done within Debian GNU/Linux. With that being said, as a Free Software developer I refuse to sign an agreement to a proprietary license in order to develop HSA applications.

Me'thinks I may be better sticking with AM3+ after all mellowsmiley.gif
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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-02-2014, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yawa View Post

It's a good socket, but honestly, likely a dead socket.

Even when (if) AMD starts dropping FX processors again, my conversations with Jim Prior on Twitter strongly hint that an iGPU will be involved as to not split their market base any further when it comes to people not being able to use HSA acceleration.

This was a huge reason when I gave my AM3+ build to my friend, as to why I jumped to an FM2+ based socket even though the goal was to build a high end rig to replace a high end rig. Any future FX chips based on my twitter questions to Mr. Prior are very much going to HAVE to be on FM2+ going forward as well, unless a new socket is announced.

So if you are going to stick with the 8 core you know, I'm sure performance will be fine no matter what you pair it with, but you are giving up the ability to run HSA acceleration down the road, PCI express 3.0, and a better CPU intergrated IMC, as well as you are likely causing yourself to be left out of the running for any future FX APU releases.

Just know that before you make up your mind.

assuming hsa goes anywhere at all of course. you never know with these thiings.

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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-02-2014, 02:24 PM
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True Bomb, very true. But one thing my conversations with Jim Prior have it made crystal clear to me is not to expect any future mid-range to high end flagship CPU's from AMD that do not have an iGPU on them.

So in that light, even taking HSA's worst case scenarios into mind, FM2+ is still the way to go if you intend to stick with the newest AMD chips down the road.

Please keep in mind folks, the end game of Kaveri (and especially Excavator a year or so from now) is not for these APU's to fall into the midrange class. AMD has stated numerous times the chips without proper acceleration will lose to haswell in most cases and we have indeed seen that play out in numerous programs and apps.

The end game is to change the way devs approach coding altogether. To stop using integer cores in situations that integer cores tend to suck wind at. If they have their way, this 7850k will likely fall between a 4670k and a 4770k in anything using HSA acceleration, and Excavator may indeed greatly supercede that.

If they don't have their way, well, it was a noble effort. Either way my point is that we still know absolutely nothing about this chip'spotential performance. Gaming wise, Thief will be the first game to give us a really good idea of it.

Benchmark wise, I'm hoping Futuremark and/or Uniengine recode to demonstrate what an APU can really do, but that is a fingers crossed thing.
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 04:15 PM
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In ~15 years of building computers for myself, family, and friends, I have never upgraded a CPU. From my perspective, the socket is "dead on arrival" regardless of how new or old it is, because the platform will be obsolete by the time a CPU upgrade is necessary anyway. If AM3+ suits the existing need and offers good performance/value, then there is nothing wrong with implementing it.

A computer is only ever an "investment" if it performs a work function that generates income/profit. In and of itself, computer hardware is never an investment as it is nearly always in a state of declining value. (only in rare cases, does computer hardware appreciate in value. Any attempt to profit from these unusual blips would result in losses more often than not.)

I fully expect that Kaveri will be obsolete by the time HSA is widespread enough to have a significant effect on daily computer use.

A CPU performance comparison chart.

"Kind of a ring thing, comes with a dialer, you hit the symbols, it spins around and lights come on, it kind of flushes sideways" -O'Neill
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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 06:49 PM
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I would have agreed with you before i happened to get a hot deal on a q9550 back around 2009. i recently bought a cheap $50 p45 motherboard for it an boom! practically a modern machine! A low end one, rather than a high end one, but still, for a system looong past it's sell by date it's doing pretty well.

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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 07:00 PM
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To my knowledge, all currently active sockets (besides FM2+, this one is alive and kicking) are sporting their last CPU types(AM3+/2011)-even current 1150 mobos are good for haswell only. There are reasons to ditch AM3+ but not having an upgrade path isn't one of them really.

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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 10:06 AM
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an excellent point. There will be an 1150 die shrink, but even if they keep thew same socket perfomance enhancements are likely dubious at best.

the problem is silicon is simply maturing. the new chip just isn't that much faster than the old chip

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