[Official] The CoolerMaster Storm Scout, Scout II Club - Page 1734 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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post #17331 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-19-2011, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockr69;12074497 
Yep I got one with no case mods. My MOBO allows the card to just stick into the 5.25 bay:D

Still lovin the card Bri:wubsmiley

Yeah, I'm kinda missing it right now. Then again, what would I mount it on once I send this puppy off to Evga? Then again again, how are they going to replace an LE (limited edition) motherboard? Ooooh Maybe they'll give me a classy in it's place! Naw, not likely, I'd love the FTW3 board, that would be sweet.

Oh the video card, running these 480's gets expensive, looked at my little app that APC provides, PowerChute & with 2 of these monsters running it's a big part of why my power bill has been high. Then again, they do keep the room warm!


Edit: Ok, SHHHHH! The plan is, switch out my motherboard with Mindy's, say I'm fixing her DVD drive.... it's been under my desk for 2 weeks. Then, hey hun, your fan is broken!! Guess you better send it in to get fixed, after all you have the lifetime warranty!!

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post #17332 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-19-2011, 11:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telnets;12074554 
Welp, tomorrow is the day... The day i figure out how to put all this inside the Scout case

IMG_0782.jpg

And move from my current H70 to a full water cooling system

Something tells me that you have it all figured out in your head. There is too much thought in the parts. Don't be silly.. You are going to be wonderful.
Now where is your Teflon Tape. You can get it at Walmart or any hardware store or Auto parts dealer. You wrap it around the treads of the mounts to stop leaks from the start. And then do at least a 3 hour leak test afterwards.

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post #17333 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-19-2011, 11:43 PM
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Ok guys, now for real, don't know what Evga will send me but after looking at the prices of new & even used 1366 mobos. Really wish I would have gone for an 1156 but we had money badk then.

So, I found this puppy!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188061

$50- rebate on a re-conditioned board! Niccceee! biggrin.gif

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post #17334 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-19-2011, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by BriSleep View Post
Other, bad news. Ok, know all the problems I've been having?? Three HDD's toasted, lots of other seemingly random stuff happening? My mobo is wracked!! Gotta send it back to Evga for the RMA process. Just trying to get one to take it's place in the meantime. Not much money right now, some strange stuff selling the trailer which amounts to theft in the minds of everyone around us. I've been gutting the place so that if they do take it, it won't be worth much!
That sucks I'm pretty ticked ATM that I am having to RMA my SSD.
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post #17335 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-19-2011, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Crazyeyeschase View Post
That sucks I'm pretty ticked ATM that I am having to RMA my SSD.
Oh man, my SSD's both Corsairs, one went back twice, the other 3 times before they finally came out with V2.0 and replaced both of mine. Man, between me upgrading things and the ones that broke down almost everything in this system has been replaced! Shhh, don't tell the processor, he's underwater anyway, so maybe he can't hear.

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post #17336 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-20-2011, 01:46 AM
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Ok, this is officially:
A Word about Video Card Numbering systems.
Subtitled: How you guys (and gals Aura & Izzy) are getting duped by the Video Card Numbering system.

Oh, for those of you that have been here a while, my speciality is video cards, it always has been, for those of you that are new here, go back about 17 words and read again.

Ok, this isn't new. With the introduction of Nvidia's 260 series came some of the first dupes. They were releasing 260 numbered cards that were not even close to the 260 cores that they were supposed to have. Some groups of owners tried to make them accountable for these dupes and tried to force them (Nvidia) to change the numbering system & send out the correct cards for the correct core numbers.

In fact, it didn't even have to be the number but the letter, a GTS card wasn't the same as a GTX card even though it was hard to tell the difference from the box.

Now, the DX-11 cards come out. ATI (AMD), has led the pack the whole way with thier ground breaking 5xxx series of cards, it was pretty easy to tell your 5870 was better than your friends 5850 because after all a 70 is bigger than a 50.

Then along comes Nvidia again, the new, long awaited Fermi cards are HOT, not just on the market but literally the chips run upwards of 95c! Unless you have been around for a while & know there are many things you can do like running MSI afterburner & adding a custom cooling profile, running Evga Precision and also a custom cooling profile. Or you could change the TIM and get HF brackets & HF backplates, or go to the extreme & get watercooled.

So, when the 480 was released, it was easy to figure out, it had 480 Cuda cores, the 470 had 470 Cuda cores, the 465 and so on.

The only really confusing thing was AMD's eyefinity cards were the same as the regular card but the ports were entirely different. The card was still basically the same card. Then came the 6xxx series and of course, everyone was thinking.........Cool, the 6xxx card has to be better, stronger, faster than the 5xxx card of the same number right? Wrong!

Lets just take one, the 5870 and the 6870, well Bri, the 6870 is going to be a better card, right? Guess again, that answer is wrong!
A 5870 has 1600 stream processors a reference card is running at 850mhz with an effective memory clock of 4800mhz.
A 6870 has only 1120 stream processors running at a slightly higher 900Mhz (which you can do with the included CCC software on the 5870), making it's effective clock run at 4200Mhz.
So you see the flag ship of the 5xxx fleet is still better than the equivelent card of teh 6xxx fleet. The only thing you're going to get better by getting the 6xxx card is 3D & honestly, how many of you can actually afford a 3D setup?? I'm not talking about the built in 3D graphics but the full blown 3D effect that requires a special monitor & special glasses?

Now to Nvidia. The GTX 480 comes out & it trounces on the equivalent AMD card, the 5870. Or does it? It comes out a full $130- more, it takes up to 135 watts more & puts out heat off it's hobbled chip that goes up to 95c no problem. Also, the production is miserable, a full 50% of all the fermi chips that come out can't even make it to be a GTX 480. As usual though, they aren't headed to the Silicon graveyard but head instead to be altered to make 470's 460's and 455's. When "The Fermi Problem" is finally corrected though, the GTX 580 is released. it has a set of fully working 580 Cuda cores, it runs cooler, it runs quieter but it still takes a very powerfull PSU to feed it's hunger. Meanwhile the hobbled Chips on the GTX 480's have dropped in price, dramaticly, they're now selling for around $100- less than on release date. Nothing new there, early adopters are always punished.

The core count didn't stay right from the very beginning though because while a 480 had 480 Cuda cores, a GTX 470 has 440 cores.
Then we drop the numbers a bit and we get into the mix of letters too where a 470 is a GTX (336 cores) but a 450 is a GTS (192 cores).

Are we all baffled now?? Just wait, the GTX 580 was released with lots of fanfare and horns blowing that said it's got fully operational 580 cores but the new 570's have 480 cores! So how is it a 570 instead of a 480?? Well the 570 is cheaper & has 60 texture units and 40 ROP's. The 480 has 480 cores, 56 texture units and 48 ROP's. Is it better to have a 570 than a 480?

It depends gang, it all depends!

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post #17337 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-20-2011, 03:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazyeyeschase;12074799 
Well I guess I need to put some pics up so here yall go. I am hoping to do more later down the road.

I am not sure if any one has said this or not but as you can see in one of my pictures I have a mesh grill on the back of my side fan, I store this off the bottom of the case since I'm not using the dust guard they supplied for the PSU all I did was trim it up a little its not 100% flush but gets the job donw for now.

I love the smell the smell of a new Scout in the morning. Nice build. Flip that PSU over and you'll have even purtier (is that even a word:confused:) wiring. Plus the blue fan will look like you have neon kit under it:D

@Bri, all your problems could be solved if only you'd come over the dark side, AMD FTW!!!!

After seeing what this 5870 will do DC'd, I run it at stock clocks and she idles at a power sipping 157 core/300mem, ....nice!

As for the sneaky plan with Min's puter, I can see the headlines now; "Local disabled vet hospitalized with massive injuries. Wife says she doesn't remember anything until the paramedics arrived or how she came to be holding husband's prosthetic limb" wink.gif
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post #17338 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-20-2011, 08:44 AM
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I need to add some info here for the ATi/AMD cards. First thing; What is the difference between ATi and AMD cards?-nothing. Because of licensing requirements all models of Radeon cards made be by ATi before the AMD take over will still be labeled ATi. That series runs up through the 5970, which IMO is still the king of the hill. The new 6XXX series and all new model cards will be AMD.

Now on to the extra info
Quote:
Originally Posted by BriSleep;12075671 
Now, the DX-11 cards come out. ATI (AMD), has led the pack the whole way with thier ground breaking 5xxx series of cards, it was pretty easy to tell your 5870 was better than your friends 5850 because after all a 70 is bigger than a 50. rolleyes.gif

This is completely true because the 5870 had more goodness than a 5850, it needed to be bigger.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BriSleep;12075671 
The only really confusing thing was AMD's eyefinity cards were the same as the regular card but the ports were entirely different. The card was still basically the same card.

This again is true, but only to a degree. Eyefininty requires three seperate ports to render a scene to the two peripheral monitors. In order to get a card to run three individual monitors seamlessly the cards pipelines needed to be increased in the display engine. Since DVI will only support a maximum number of display piplines vs the size of real estate they occupy on the board, the display port was introduced to handle the additional pipeline output to the third monitor. It worked great. The only rub is finding affordable monitors that support the display port. Look for them on Newegg. There are only three. One from HP, one from ASUS, and one from NEC with the ASUS offering being the most affordable; 27'' for $309. Also the greatest 5970 offered to date, the 4GB model, doesn't even support DVI, only display port. So in order to just get the minimal Eyefinity setup going with that card will require and additional $1000 in monitors and to even get started with only one monitor will require display port support on the monitor. C'MON! AMD! Throw us a bone! At the rate display ports are being adopted by the monitor manufacturers, this may indeed be a bust for ATi/AMD. Only the future will tell. So, to circle back to my original point, Eyefinity cards may look the same with an additional port, but really they are different critters on the inside.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BriSleep;12075671 
Then came the 6xxx series and of course, everyone was thinking.........Cool, the 6xxx card has to be better, stronger, faster than the 5xxx card of the same number right? Wrong!

Lets just take one, the 5870 and the 6870, well Bri, the 6870 is going to be a better card, right? Guess again, that answer is wrong! confused.gif
A 5870 has 1600 stream processors a reference card is running at 850mhz with an effective memory clock of 4800mhz.
A 6870 has only 1120 stream processors running at a slightly higher 900Mhz (which you can do with the included CCC software on the 5870), making it's effective clock run at 4200Mhz.
So you see the flag ship of the 5xxx fleet is still better than the equivelent card of teh 6xxx fleet. The only thing you're going to get better by getting the 6xxx card is 3D & honestly, how many of you can actually afford a 3D setup?? I'm not talking about the built in 3D graphics but the full blown 3D effect that requires a special monitor & special glasses?

True, but how about being affordable? Well really if you take a close look the 6800 series seem like a good deal, right? Wrong again. The ATi 5800 series still offer the best performance in Radeon lineup. Compare a 6850 with a 5850 and you'll see that for only about $30 US dollars more you'll jump from 960 stream processors in the 6850 to 1440 stream processors in the 5850. So in reality the 6850 sits right between the 5770 and the 5830 for $50 to $100 dollars more than the 5770 depending on manufacturer. This is just another clever naming scheme created to boost sales while giving the false impression to lazy consumers who don't do their research that they'll be getting a better card because the number in the name is bigger.

Right now, again this is only my opinion, the HD5870 is still the leader for for price, heat, power consumption and performance and thanks to Bri, I got mine for $100 bucks less than retail.

I hope between our two posts everyone can get a better idea of what kind of things to look at when choosing a card, but don't forget the most overlooked video card requirement of all. Will it fit in your case?
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post #17339 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-20-2011, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BriSleep;12074887 
Ok guys, now for real, don't know what Evga will send me but after looking at the prices of new & even used 1366 mobos. Really wish I would have gone for an 1156 but we had money badk then.

So, I found this puppy!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188061

$50- rebate on a re-conditioned board! Niccceee! biggrin.gif

Wow, that's a steal! I had to give $199 for my 1366 MB, and at the time that was as cheap as I could find.
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post #17340 of 28622 (permalink) Old 01-20-2011, 09:46 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BriSleep;12075671 
Ok, this is officially:
A Word about Video Card Numbers Game.

Subtitled: How Nvidia and ATI are duping their new customer base.

Oh, for those of you that have been here a while, my specialty is video cards, it always has been, for those of you that are new here, go back about 17 words and read again. wink.gif

drum.gif Okay, this isn't new. With the introduction of Nvidia's 260 series came some of the first test dumps for the dupes. They were releasing 260 numbered cards that were not even close to the 260 cores that they were supposed to have. Some groups of owners tried to make them accountable for these dupes and tried to force them (Nvidia) to change the numbering system & send out the correct cards for the correct core numbers.

In fact, it didn't even have to be the number but the letter, a GTS card wasn't the same as a GTX card even though it was hard to tell the difference from the box.

Now, Enter in the DX-11 line of cards.

ATI (AMD), has led the pack the whole way with thier ground breaking 5xxx series of cards, it was pretty easy to tell your 5870 was better than your friends 5850 because after all a 70 is bigger than a 50. rolleyes.gif That's easy right.

Then along comes Nvidia again...


The new, long awaited Fermi cards are HOT, not just on the market but literally the chips run upwards of 95c! eek.gif Unless you have been around for a while & know there are many things you can do like running MSI afterburner & adding a custom cooling profile, running Evga Precision and also a custom cooling profile. Or you could change the TIM and get HF brackets & HF backplates, or go to the extreme & get watercooled.

So, when the 480 was released, it was easy to figure out, it had 480 Cuda cores, the 470 had 470 Cuda cores, the 465 and so on.

Then AMD went into their own confusion phase.

AMD's eyefinity cards were the same as the regular card but the ports were entirely different. The card was still basically the same card. Then came the 6xxx series and of course, everyone was thinking.........Cool, the 6xxx card has GOT to be better, stronger, faster than the 5xxx card of the same number Because its a 6 series and the number is a thousand bigger? right? Wrong!

Lets just take one example

The 5870 and the 6870, Let's see.... the 6870 is going to be a better card, right? No.. Guess again, that answer is wrong! Are you confused yet.

A 5870 has 1600 stream processors a reference card is running at 850mhz with an effective memory clock of 4800mhz.
A 6870 has only 1120 stream processors running at a slightly higher 900Mhz (which you can do with the included CCC software on the 5870), making it's effective clock run at 4200Mhz.


So you see the flag ship of the 5xxx fleet is still better, stronger and faster than the equivalent card of the 6xxx fleet. The only thing you're going to get better by getting the 6xxx card is 3D & honestly, how many of you can actually afford a 3D setup?? I'm not talking about the built in 3D graphics but the full blown 3D effect that requires a special monitor & special glasses?

Now Glance back at Nvidia.

The GTX 480 comes out & it trounces on the equivalent AMD card, the 5870. Or does it? It leaves the gate,
a full $130,00 more,
it takes up to 135 watts more
& puts out heat off it's hobbled chip that goes up to 95c no problem.

Also, the production is miserable, a full 50% of all the Fermi chips that come out can't even make it to be a GTX 480.

As usual though, they aren't headed to the Silicon graveyard but head instead to be altered to make 470's 460's and 455's. When

"The Fermi Problem" is finally corrected" though, the GTX 580 is released. it has a set of fully working 580 Cuda cores, it runs cooler, it runs quieter but it still takes a very powerful PSU to feed it's basic Needs.

Meanwhile the hobbled Chips on the GTX 480's have dropped in price, dramatically, they're now selling for around $100- less than on release date. Nothing new there, early adopters are always punished for buying too soon.

The core count didn't stay right from the very beginning though because while a 480 had 480 Cuda cores, a GTX 470 has 440 cores.
Then we drop the numbers a bit and we get into the mix of letters too where a 470 is a GTX (336 cores) but a 450 is a GTS (192 cores).

Are we all completely baffled yet?? ( Just wait, it gets better.)

.
the GTX 580 was released with lots of fanfare and horns blowing that said it's got fully operational 580 cores but the new 570's have 480 cores! eek.gif So how is it a 570 instead of a 480?? Well the 570 is cheaper & has 60 texture units and 40 ROP's. The 480 has 480 cores, 56 texture units and 48 ROP's. Is it better to have a 570 than a 480? So where are you now on the confusometer? Red-lined I am sure.

It depends gang, it all depends! If you understand the new numbers and what they REALLY mean ninja.gif
10x1110iub994f.jpg
Db006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockr69;12077808 
I need to add some info here for the ATi/AMD cards. First thing; What is the difference between ATi and AMD cards?-nothing. Because of licensing requirements all models of Radeon cards made be by ATi before the AMD take over will still be labeled ATi. That series runs up through the 5970, which IMO is still the king of the hill. The new 6XXX series and all new model cards will be AMD.

Now on to the extra info



This is completely true because the 5870 had more goodness than a 5850, it needed to be bigger.



This again is true, but only to a degree. Eyefininty requires three separate ports to render a scene to the two peripheral monitors. In order to get a card to run three individual monitors seamlessly the cards pipelines needed to be increased in the display engine. Since DVI will only support a maximum number of display pipelines vs the size of real estate they occupy on the board, the display port was introduced to handle the additional pipeline output to the third monitor. It worked great. The only rub is finding affordable monitors that support the display port. Look for them on Newegg. There are only three. One from HP, one from ASUS, and one from NEC with the ASUS offering being the most affordable; 27'' for $309. Also the greatest 5970 offered to date, the 4GB model, doesn't even support DVI, only display port. So in order to just get the minimal Eyefinity setup going with that card will require and additional $1000 in monitors and to even get started with only one monitor will require display port support on the monitor. C'MON! AMD! Throw us a bone! At the rate display ports are being adopted by the monitor manufacturers, this may indeed be a bust for ATi/AMD. Only the future will tell. So, to circle back to my original point, Eyefinity cards may look the same with an additional port, but really they are different critters on the inside.



True, but how about being affordable? Well really if you take a close look the 6800 series seem like a good deal, right? Wrong again. The ATi 5800 series still offer the best performance in Radeon lineup. Compare a 6850 with a 5850 and you'll see that for only about $30 US dollars more you'll jump from 960 stream processors in the 6850 to 1440 stream processors in the 5850. So in reality the 6850 sits right between the 5770 and the 5830 for $50 to $100 dollars more than the 5770 depending on manufacturer. This is just another clever naming scheme created to boost sales while giving the false impression to lazy consumers who don't do their research that they'll be getting a better card because the number in the name is bigger.

Right now, again this is only my opinion, the HD5870 is still the leader for for price, heat, power consumption and performance and thanks to Bri, I got mine for $100 bucks less than retail.

I hope between our two posts everyone can get a better idea of what kind of things to look at when choosing a card, but don't forget the most overlooked video card requirement of all. Will it fit in your case?

I have put this all together for a Nice Sticky that can be added to page one.
Thanks Brian and Rockr69 for such a great report on the Nvidia/ATI Numbers game.

Rep up and thank you.
Gen Enigma.
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