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[Reddit] RX 480 fails PCI-E specification

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post #1111 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

It is synonymous with TDP. Only Anandtech seems to use the term.

I see, so it's not very accurate to say TBP, is it?
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post #1112 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 11:24 AM
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I see, so it's not very accurate to say TBP, is it?

To be fair, I am unsure what looncraz is trying to convey. The only thing I do know is that his post is full of inaccurate information.

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post #1113 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by mtcn77 View Post

We can split it 2/(3+1) thanks to The Stilt and that is just as good.

I respect The Stilt alot but please view all these posts as to what realistically the fix achieves and what it means for us in the sense of the current ref PCB if OC'ing.

i) what difference does it make BB B0 vs FF F0 data value for the registers

ii) what if we're maxing VDDC to gain OC for a bench, daily high OC use, etc

So comparing this ref PCB AMD card with PCI-E plug with recent past cards power sourcing and loading of VRM is pretty much not "optimal".
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post #1114 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 11:43 AM
 
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Originally Posted by gupsterg View Post

I respect The Stilt alot but please view all these posts as to what realistically the fix achieves and what it means for us in the sense of the current ref PCB if OC'ing.

i) what difference does it make BB B0 vs FF F0 data value for the registers

ii) what if we're maxing VDDC to gain OC for a bench, etc

So comparing this ref PCB AMD card with PCI-E plug with recent past cards power sourcing and loading of VRM is pretty much not "optimal".
You are only dismissing the heat element still being an issue with the cooler involved. You'll be pulling 100w, plus whatever vram+uncore thingies necessitate - up to 54w - together they make up 65 from the socket and 155 from the pci-e bus. We know the numbers don't reach that amount. Else, you won't get up to 1.4GHz without der8auer's 1.25v practices and 1.5GHz is only relevant for bench purposes at 1.35v with the resultant 260 watts of power consumption. Quite literally, '104 watts' from the socket would be the least of my worries in order for me to be able to reach those clocks. I'd be over 5% above phase current protection thresholds by then(38>36A) and balancing the load by pulling 114 watts from the socket is out of the question for me anyway.
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post #1115 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by oxidized View Post

Well case where custom were worse than reference are very rare or am i wrong, but anyway i can understand that case or the thing with waterblocks.
But for any other makes very little sense.
Correct, two different things, but AMD's TDP (which is different from nvidia's TDP) represents the max Watts drawn from the card under load, which was 150W for the 480, it wasn't respected, cause in some benchmark the card reached ~180W, so power draw isn't really good, on the other hand yes, the problem wasn't the draw, but the distribution, and despite the fix, several tests showed that the card is still at pciex limit, surpassing the standard max current drawable wich is 5.5A but in some games it still reaches ~6A. Surely better but still not good, and there's nothing amd can do about it now, so let's wait AIBs and a possible refresh later.

AMD corrected those specs to specify that they meant the chip power, not the whole card. And it is already fixed with a driver update, investigate further before stating stuff like "there's nothing amd can do about it now", it doesn't make you sound very credible when AMD fixed the issue with software 2 days ago.
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Originally Posted by Ajvar View Post

Man, you are such an ignorant person.
Here, I put this image for you and even translated if you are slow to figure out by intuition. Go eat your power distribution and concentrate on PCI-E specced max powerdraw.


Now if you still have questions or mistakenly believe you still shouldn't see how you are wrong then go reread my latest 3 post as much time as you need (2 times or 4, whatever).

Oh, what a special case we have here. Let me sum up the argument for you:
You: AMD overclocked that card, that is why it is drawing too much from the PCI-E
Me: Overclocking doesn't have anything to do with PCI-E power draw.
You: Of course it does, when you raise the clocks you raise the power. Engineering samples were clocked much lower.
Me: Yes, you raise the power, but that doesn't mean you raise specifically the power from the PCI-E, there are 300W cards out there that still pull less than 75W from the PCI-E.
You: OMG u so stoopid, look how high PCI-E power draw is.

doh.gif

Let me spell it out for you systematically, so even a donkey would have some chance of understanding:

1) Overclocking raises overall power usage, it does NOT tell the card where to draw this power FROM. It is the card's internal power distribution mechanism that decides that.
THEREFORE with a power distribution that prioritizes 6 and 8-pin PSU cables, overclocking will NOT raise PCI-E power draw.
2) The issue is already FIXED with a driver update.
3) Before you take it upon yourself to classify people as ignorant, go test your basic reasoning skills.

Got it?
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post #1116 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mtcn77 View Post

Wise people, such as yourself, would know 6 pin and 8 pin connectors are only differentiated by the amount of current drawn from the same cables, imo.
Yeah, but my original dialog was about how miserable for some members is to attack overclockers providing official AMD statement (for asking more test data) and at the same time defend AMD who breaks official PCI-E specification statements (be that semi solved PCI-E slot or overall powerdraw).
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Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

Yeah, there also are engineering samples of Ivy Bridge processors that lack PCIe lanes, that run at half the target clockspeed, that aren't stable, have no turbo boost...
...Find yourself somewhere else to nitpick, that was a terrible example.
That wasn't an example, an example is real life results which are over all tech news since the release date of RX 480. That was just an additional remark so you must have much free time if spend it writing such posts.
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Originally Posted by ronnin426850 View Post

Oh, what a special case we have here. Let me sum up the argument for you:
You: AMD overclocked that card, that is why it is drawing too much from the PCI-E
Never wrote that. So didn't even read what you wrote past that line.
Looks like you indeed have a special case here. Go follow my advice about rereading 2-4 times what you think you read or just visit a specialist who manages your special case. REREAD IT. If you still see me saying Drawing from slot only then visit doctor (Click to show)
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post #1117 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by ronnin426850 View Post

AMD corrected those specs to specify that they meant the chip power, not the whole card. And it is already fixed with a driver update, investigate further before stating stuff like "there's nothing amd can do about it now", it doesn't make you sound very credible when AMD fixed the issue with software 2 days ago.

The problem isn't fixed, there's no way amd can fix that, it was just rectified, by changing vrm priorities and such. To fix it we'd need amd to redesign the whole power supply circuit
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post #1118 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 01:40 PM
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The problem isn't fixed, there's no way amd can fix that, it was just rectified, by changing vrm priorities and such. To fix it we'd need amd to redesign the whole power supply circuit

It is no longer a problem. I call that fixed.
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post #1119 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 02:34 PM
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It is no longer a problem. I call that fixed.

It could still be a problem
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post #1120 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-09-2016, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by oxidized View Post

It's could still be a problem

- Don't sail the east sea, you could fall of the edge of the world!
- But the world is a sphere.
- ...It could still happen!

No, for real, it's fixed, relax smile.gif
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