[Reddit] RX 480 fails PCI-E specification - Page 67 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[Reddit] RX 480 fails PCI-E specification

 
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post #661 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 08:57 PM
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I've done a new build after the RX480's had a fun time with my old rampage. Heard AMD released drivers to solve the issue today?



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Originally Posted by DJkelly go_quote.gif
I was trying to do a pencil mod for lower vdroop while the computer was turned on


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post #662 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubeman View Post

I've done a new build after the RX480's had a fun time with my old rampage. Heard AMD released drivers to solve the issue today?

There seems to have been an announcement that AMd would provide information on Tuersday.

source copied from
Computerbase.de


As you know, we continuously tune our GPUs in order to maximize their performance within their given power envelopes and the speed of the memory interface, which in this case is an unprecedented 8Gbps for GDDR5. Recently, we identified select scenarios where the tuning of some RX 480 boards was not optimal. Fortunately, we can adjust the GPU's tuning via software in order to resolve this issue. We are already testing a driver that implements a fix, and we will provide an update to the community on our progress on Tuesday (July 5, 2016).
AMD
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post #663 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

There seems to have been an announcement that AMd would provide information on Tuersday.

source copied from
Computerbase.de


As you know, we continuously tune our GPUs in order to maximize their performance within their given power envelopes and the speed of the memory interface, which in this case is an unprecedented 8Gbps for GDDR5. Recently, we identified select scenarios where the tuning of some RX 480 boards was not optimal. Fortunately, we can adjust the GPU's tuning via software in order to resolve this issue. We are already testing a driver that implements a fix, and we will provide an update to the community on our progress on Tuesday (July 5, 2016).
AMD

Thanks.

I replied back on the ticket saying "It wasn't my memory or drivers" and stated again about the PCIE voltage/wattage issue. If it's another copy pasta response on their ticket system ill just link the articles i found or wait for AMD to officially release the fix. (Not asking XFX to refund me a new rig, Asking them to compensate for the fact I had to basically do a new rig or buy a used MB to replace my old.)



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Originally Posted by DJkelly go_quote.gif
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post #664 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:06 PM
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Not that anyone cares, because it's a big flame AMD fest...

I think part of the problem is AMD release drivers default overvolted the ever living crap out of their cards. My Wattman has me sitting at 1.15V default, for stock clocks I can undervolt it by 125mV and the memory by 75mV, for a mild 3.5% (45MHz) OC, I can undervolt it by 75mV.

They didn't 'leave room' in their Wattman tool to overvolt at all. It was default at the max voltage. This is with an ASIC of 70%, which is 'better' then only 2.2% of cards reported through GPU-Z. That means my voltages and temps on reference air should be among the worst seen out there.



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post #665 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

Because it proves that this whole deal have been ignited just because its AMD.

The GTX 950 have sold 10 times more than what the RX 480 probably will in this quarter yet no eyebrows were raised when the tests showed the GTX 950 spiking way above the 75W the motherboard PCIe slow was rated for, so why is this issue finally coming to light now? Why not before?

Ignorance is not the reason as the tests were there, proving how much those cards spiked above the 75W the motherboard was rated, it's just that nobody cared because Nvidia.

Whats the point of shifting all attention into one card that presents an issue that 90% of current and past cards present?

Part of your confusion stems from the belief that spikes are more important or just as important than sustained. Motherboard manufacturers aren't concerned about spikes as much as sustained.


Considering all the power supply reviews I have read energy spikes don't concern me as much either because burst will always occur. The fact is that the damage from sustained limit breaking will wear down components faster.
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post #666 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bauxno View Post

Afther waching the stream of builzoid the conclution that came with him making some test was that the pcb of the rx480 is a mess.
3 VRM and the chip are powered by the 6 pin and the other 3 VRM and the vram are powered by the pic-e. Both the pcie and 6 pin work without tranfers power between each other so AMD can not offset power from the pci-e to the 6pin.

Also the 6pin its working with 3 ground pins when 1 of those should be used to reconize the conector as a 6pins wich doesn´t do.

Well that was what he found so is best to wait for AIB cards and also AIB cards with custom pcb since if they use the same pcb of the reference it will not matter if they put a 8pin or 5 8pin conectors since the pci-e will still use the same watts as is using now.

Lowering the vram my help reduce the watt usage of the card so maybe someone can test that.

sry for my english.

His analysis is bogus.

You only use a sensing pin when you might have an 8-pin connector, otherwise the spec says you can just solder the +12 and grounds on the 6-pin. You don't have any other possible connector that would be plugged into the card...

Splitting phases in the VRM between PEGslot and PEGaux is a total non-issue for a card that was supposed to peak at 150W - the RAM is pulling from the PCI-e, which is where the over-current is occurring, AFAICT. GDDR5 can pull 30~40W easily.

EDIT: I see looniam already covered this... my bad
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post #667 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:24 PM
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post #668 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Have you seen the video stream of "buildoiz", mentioned by Bauxno here and link given by mark_thaddeus?


Here again:
https://www.twitch.tv/buildzoid/v/75850933

After the whole pre-story, it starts right before 54 minutes in. By voltmeter the user measures the PCB for his voltage mod.

He finds out it is a 50:50 split on the board itselff or PCI-Express-SLOT and PCIe-6pin. This explains why the card behaves like it does in tests. Look for yourself.

How is this proof that AMD did the hardware wiring on the PCB wrong?

And as I've stated at least three times, even if the power distribution can't be programmed by rail in the bios, you could just as easily lower the global power target to decrease the total power draw until the sustained average through PEG does not exceed 75W.

Not to mention undervolting is another option, though impractical to implement on a large scale. But claiming this is a hardware flaw that can't be fixed except by PCB redesign, yeah I don't buy that.
Quote:
By marketshare: Yes
By reality: No

Everyone would be on the fence if it is proven. But since the AMD fans are way to used shouting garbage all day long, many would try to stay neutral at first. Since AMD is the "underdog" - lots of sites try the cruising gear tone to not sound mean.

Right because nVidia fans don't do the exact same thing. Maybe you should head over to HardOCP and check out the witch hunt that's going on there, it's absolutely farcical.
Quote:
Even a budget build can be worth several hundrets. CPU, Mainboard, PSU, SSD, RAM and whatever could be affected. If it were only the GPU, easy case. Once you mess with the whole system it is no joke anymore. Especially since the card is in the mainstream segment, the issue becomes even more devastating.

The RX480 should never ever behave like it does. Someone really messed up here.

So we've gone from 480 would cause motherboards to dei, to it'll pretty much do anything and everything, including blowing up your entire rig. Yeah ok I'm done here.

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post #669 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Have you seen the video stream of "buildoiz", mentioned by Bauxno here and link given by mark_thaddeus?


Here again:
https://www.twitch.tv/buildzoid/v/75850933

After the whole pre-story, it starts right before 54 minutes in. By voltmeter the user measures the PCB for his voltage mod.

He finds out it is a 50:50 split on the board itselff or PCI-Express-SLOT and PCIe-6pin. This explains why the card behaves like it does in tests. Look for yourself.

have a vid from someone who knows what they're talking about:

@ 55 minutes buildoiz is just sticking a multimeter to compoints and saying, "omg i have no idea why they did that!" "i hate that voltage controller!" "this is so stupid!"

as i said several times those grounds/sense pin are going to be shorted, as according to pci-sig specs whether his multimeter picks that up or not sticking it in the card's molex connector doesn't matter; they'll all be shorted to each other the second he plugs in the power connector.

there is NO PROBLEM updating the firmware to use vrms on the 6 pin more so than on the pci slot using that voltage controller than buildoiz hates.

after my posts for the last few days - i am expecting nvidia to revoke my green card! THANKS AMD! mad.gif

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post #670 of 1129 (permalink) Old 07-02-2016, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Have you seen the video stream of "buildoiz", mentioned by Bauxno here and link given by mark_thaddeus?


Here again:
https://www.twitch.tv/buildzoid/v/75850933

After the whole pre-story, it starts right before 54 minutes in. By voltmeter the user measures the PCB for his voltage mod.

He finds out it is a 50:50 split on the board itselff or PCI-Express-SLOT and PCIe-6pin. This explains why the card behaves like it does in tests. Look for yourself.
By marketshare: Yes
By reality: No

Everyone would be on the fence if it is proven. But since the AMD fans are way to used shouting garbage all day long, many would try to stay neutral at first. Since AMD is the "underdog" - lots of sites try the cruising gear tone to not sound mean.
Even a budget build can be worth several hundrets. CPU, Mainboard, PSU, SSD, RAM and whatever could be affected. If it were only the GPU, easy case. Once you mess with the whole system it is no joke anymore. Especially since the card is in the mainstream segment, the issue becomes even more devastating.

The RX480 should never ever behave like it does. Someone really messed up here.

So let me get this right, random YOU-TUBER makes a claim = fact. Looniam provides copy of part of the pcie spec and you completely fail to read or acknowledge that.
Then proclaim that all the people involved with the design and production of said adapter card are completely incompetent at their daily jobs. rolleyes.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi go_quote.gif

You're just nitpicking words now. I was talking about in terms of performance, those are the only measurements that matter. Not IPC or clock speed.
Quote:
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If Bulldozer came out of the box at 5 ghz and overclocked to 6 ghz on air, no one would have said it was a failure.
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