[G3D] TSMC Unveils 6-nanometer Process - Page 3 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[G3D] TSMC Unveils 6-nanometer Process

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post #21 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 10:15 AM
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16nm to 12nm also provided a 15% improvement in transistor density which we never saw in chips.

As nodes become more and more expensive to do, it makes less and less sense to do refreshes on these process which is why we only saw polaris 10 receive the treatment along with the Ryzen. The move to 6nm would likely be a waste of money better saved on developing chips on 5nm. Refreshes won't get the treatment but it AMD develops a high end chip built on 6nm for late 2020, it could make sense. However AMD would want this to cover the professional market as well due to the high cost of development and the need to increase the total addressable market(so likely a Vega 20 replacement as well). Navi will be too fresh for AMD to replace in 2020 so expect Navi to be replaced in 2021 or potentially 2022 and by this time 5nm might be possible and this will be do or die time for AMD. 5nm is crazy expensive and Intel will be present as well, so combine this with Nvidia dominant position, AMD will be at a crossroads, if they want to continue to make discrete processors.

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post #22 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 11:58 AM
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Smaller die size I fear will equal more heat. So much crammed into something so small is going to present new cooling challenges for engineers.

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post #23 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 12:17 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Gedm5 View Post
How can you say that 5, 6, and 7 nm nodes don't have a huge difference when 5 nm and 6 nm haven't even started risk production? It's far to early to be making those claims.

With that said, you are right that as nodes have been getting smaller the gains have been dropping.
Because 18% increase in density from 7 to 6 is a heck of a lot smaller than the 75% increase from 28 to 16.


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post #24 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 01:49 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by DNMock View Post
Because 18% increase in density from 7 to 6 is a heck of a lot smaller than the 75% increase from 28 to 16.
It is nothing. They can use that density increase for gap.

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post #25 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 06:14 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post
It is nothing. They can use that density increase for gap.
yeah, from what i recall they haven't really been increasing density much for a while now.

increasing the gaps between connectors and transistors on the other hand decreases parasitic capacitance by a huge amount.
which means to say they get less vdroop, less current leakage at higher frequencies, and potentially higher clock speed ceiling.

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post #26 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 11:23 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by bigjdubb View Post
I expect prices to stay high. If AMD brings the heat I think they will match Nvidias pricing instead of Nvidia coming down in price.
I fear the same, at least in the high end anyway. Fury X and Radeon VII have already proven this.

Looks like I'll be rocking this X79 build to the silicon grave lol. If and when I do upgrade, I'll be sure to intentionally stay a generation (or even two) behind.

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post #27 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-16-2019, 11:59 PM
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I hope TSMC will sell some dry ice with these .

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post #28 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:42 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by epic1337 View Post
yeah, from what i recall they haven't really been increasing density much for a while now.

increasing the gaps between connectors and transistors on the other hand decreases parasitic capacitance by a huge amount.
which means to say they get less vdroop, less current leakage at higher frequencies, and potentially higher clock speed ceiling.
My gut is telling me I'm ignorant on something here, so help me out please:

I had always assumed reducing the gap size was increasing the density. As in the the density of transistors over a given area increases.


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post #29 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:56 AM
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Wouldn't the node shrink decrease the footprint of the micro components? Then as long as the surface area they are mounted on remains the same there would be more room to space the components apart as they are all smaller than before.


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post #30 of 36 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 08:19 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by magnek View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by bigjdubb View Post
I expect prices to stay high. If AMD brings the heat I think they will match Nvidias pricing instead of Nvidia coming down in price.
I fear the same, at least in the high end anyway. Fury X and Radeon VII have already proven this.

Looks like I'll be rocking this X79 build to the silicon grave lol. If and when I do upgrade, I'll be sure to intentionally stay a generation (or even two) behind.
Completely reasonable to do now too even at top tier gaming.

My old X79 tower is totally happy driving my old Korean panel w. A used 1070.
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